If chops matter then, why are Ringo and Lars

they've both been (were in their same respective bands for years?
ya know like married couples have more equity built up than single people..?
 
Chops are fine, but parts and feel are what make mainstream songs work. Sometimes the songs involve technical chops, but usually not.

Again: mainstream. Meaning, what most people listen to and pay to hear.

Also, Ringo's been at this a lot longer and to a larger degree than most of the working drummers out there, and he's had some great album sales at a time when albums were still selling.

For those who like 'chops' drummers, there are some great ones out there. Buy their songs... they probably need the money. 😮
 
to say Ringo didn't have chops is kinda dumb innit? He invented a way to play- had to- to accompany who he was accompanying.
his situation, tea towels..Pretty inventive..He discovered a way. he didn't sit back there and play a two four always something special some trademark twist err "naturally". His fills are legend.
 
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1) Who said chops are important?

2) Song writing > Everything else, and Ringo and Lars contribute in that way.

3) Lars had chops in 1989. I'm not sure where they went afterward, but there is a lot of cool playing on the earlier albums and a lot of tricky parts on the Justice album.

4) What Ringo lacked in chops he made up for with originality at the time.

5) Rock drum history isn't chicken or egg. We know what came first, and a lot of "chops" rock drumming came later.
 
Why do we always have these discussions? They’re so drum-centered and don’t take into account the music being made. Has no one figured it out yet? If you can make music that everybody loves, then your position is solid. If you can’t make music, then nobody cares about your chops. Doug Clifford basically kept time for CCR and never displayed any mind-bending chops yet everybody knows the music he played. Why does everyone think the amount of $$$ you make is tied to how many notes you can stuff into a song?
 
Aside from all the things said so far in this thread, which I largely agree with.....I want to reiterate what @DrumEatDrum said above......

When comparing drummers of different eras you need to do so with the perspective of what had been done on the kit before them and in a musical context as well as factor in what equipment limitations there may have been at the time......I'm looking at you kick drum pedals......

Ringo was/is a very musical drummer and was right up there with the talent level of the time and Lars was at the tip of the spear as well and brought additional leadership and structure to the 40+ year company that is Metallica......like him or not.....the music is killer for that genre.......

Without Peart there would be a different Portnoy, without Portnoy there would be no.....(fill in the blank) they each built on what was out there previously.

Oh and to complete my "get off my lawn" moment here.........none of them had YouTube or the inter web to supercharge their learning curve. What they did have was music and ears......and they along with all the guitarists etc. had to LISTEN and LEARN what the music was doing and what parts were being played and how they all fit together vs. today's online drumming olympics......

Just my $0.02 worth maybe $0.01....
 
I know Ringo gets used as an example of a drummer without chops but I would still argue he had more chops in some ways than your average drummer. Particularly with double stops and the fast right hand on shuffles.

Big two-handed fill at 1:40

And frankly many gigging drummers don't have the technique to keep this groove going

It's not exactly stuff Buddy Rich couldn't do but also something many drummers wouldn't be able to do on the fly.
 
I am not going to get into judging this or that famous drummer. If they made it in the music business and people like them, then more power to them. I am going to comment from a different angle. From the angle of the person who is learning drums.

Why is YouTube flooded with drum solo clips? Why such an interest in these clips?
Wow, how musical just playing a drum set! Wow, look at that speed! What chops!!

Do this rudiment. But why? It develops your hand muscle. It builds chops.
Do this exercise. But Why? It increases your speed in single stroke roll.
Learn lesson number 1, number 2 and number 3. What is next? Solo #1 at 120 BPM.
As a student of drums, I am always reminded that one of the skills that I need to work on is chops. And that is the way it is.
 
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dcrigger said:
Why are we equating "chops" with "lots of notes"???
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Philaiy9 said:
I know Ringo gets used as an example of a drummer without chops but I would still argue he had more chops in some ways than your average drummer. Particularly with double stops and the fast right hand on shuffles.

Big two-handed fill at 1:40

And frankly many gigging drummers don't have the technique to keep this groove going

It's not exactly stuff Buddy Rich couldn't do but also something many drummers wouldn't be able to do on the fly.
Click to expand...
Ringo could execute some fast Flat Flams. Check out Help.

Great ride bell work on She's A Woman.
 
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