So what is it with the cheaper snare drums?

[Bo Eder]

When you look at your average metal snare, there’s not a lot to it. Some lugs, a strainer, wires, heads, boom. Yet, an old Tama Swingstar 6.5” snare really doesn’t come close to my 6.5 Supra. So what do you think it is? Badly formed snare bed? The bearing edges I’m not sure you can improve. I’ve seen this with Yamaha student snares, Pearl Export snares…..none actually hold up to a pro level metal snare. This is one instance where the more you pay, the better it plays. But like I said, what could it be? Bed? Edges? Wood I can see physical differences, but formed metal is formed metal. What do you think?

 

[tris66]

Eric Valentine loves his old Pearl export 6.5x14, so your opinion isn't shared by all "experts in the field." If you are are comparing steel to aluminum you are cheating. Different beasts. I prefer Acros to Supras. I had an aluminum Ludwig Standard that was in the same league as both of them, though the cheap lugs and different design gave it an different overall tonality. I have little doubt an aluminum Sensitone would easily stand up to all of those from everything I have heard about them. Lower end products have looser quality tolerances. I'd bet if you did a blind test you would be surprised especially if you took a quality lower price steel snare like a Sensitone and put it up against something more expensive.
My two favorite snares:
Acro: student snare.
Stewart Copeland snare: Cheap Pearl COB.

 

[harryconway]

People like what they like. And for many ..... it was the chrome aluminum Supraphonic. American drummers were quick to embrace Tama, Yamaha & Pearl drums. And damn, a lot of them kept their Supra (or Black Beauty) for their main snare. Forced the Japanese companies to start making aluminum and brass snares.

There are some Japanese steel snares that stand out. The ones that I'm familiar with (or have .... in which I'm quite familiar) the Pearl Chad Smith sig. (14x5) is a pretty nice one. The Yamaha Shinya Sig. (14x5.5) snare and the Akira Jimbo sig. (14x5) are pretty nice.

If you're into 13's (which I am) ..... the Pearl Joey Jordison sig. (13x6.5) is pretty nice. I picked up a Yamaha SD-2340 (13x4) that I really like. And whenever I find one, I'll get it's bigger brother, the SD-2355, which is 13x5.5.

 

[Chris Whitten]

Eric Valentine loves his old Pearl export 6.5x14, so your opinion isn't shared by all "experts in the field."

Eric Valentine piles three or four snare samples on his drum mixes, as well as extensive EQ, compression and FX.
I've always said a cheap metal snare drum can sound incredible for one thing. A more expensive, better designed snare drum can sound fantastic for more uses in more situations.
There is no well know studio drummer who only plays a cheap snare or two. They will carry a cheap snare or two along with their Supraphonic, Black Beauty and N&C

 

[Elvis]

When you look at your average metal snare, there’s not a lot to it. Some lugs, a strainer, wires, heads, boom. Yet, an old Tama Swingstar 6.5” snare really doesn’t come close to my 6.5 Supra. So what do you think it is? Badly formed snare bed? The bearing edges I’m not sure you can improve. I’ve seen this with Yamaha student snares, Pearl Export snares…..none actually hold up to a pro level metal snare. This is one instance where the more you pay, the better it plays. But like I said, what could it be? Bed? Edges? Wood I can see physical differences, but formed metal is formed metal. What do you think?

Well, for starters, your Supra is made from a different metal. Aluminum. The other snares you mentioned are steel, so "formed metal" is not the same, across the board.
Ronn Dunnett and Gregg Keplinger both made their names because they understood that fact.

 

[Winston_Wolf]

I think a snare goes beyond the sum of its parts. But if any of those parts are lacking, it has an effect on the whole. Carelessly formed bearing edges or beds? Shell out of round? Going to be hard to tune and/or get good snare wire response. Low quality swivel nuts? Going to be hard to tune. Thin hoops? Going to hear more funky overtones.

Any one part of a snare that isn't great quality is going to drag a snare drum down. Usually the problem is compounded because when you get close to the bottom it isn't any one thing, but it's that pretty much every thing is less than the best. With the snare drum having so many parts and that drum being the center of attention on the kit you are going to notice those shortcomings more easily.

 

[tris66]

Eric Valentine piles three or four snare samples on his drum mixes, as well as extensive EQ, compression and FX.
I've always said a cheap metal snare drum can sound incredible for one thing. A more expensive, better designed snare drum can sound fantastic for more uses in more situations.
There is no well know studio drummer who only plays a cheap snare or two. They will carry a cheap snare or two along with their Supraphonic, Black Beauty and N&C

My point was to refute the 'cheap=bad" supposition. If you want to argue studio tricks I can make an equal argument that all snares are junk because they get samples stacked over them on a daily basis. I don't care what the studio players carry around. My point again is the difference in sound between an inexpensive drum and an expensive drum built from the same materials is smaller than most people might think. If there is any difference.

 

[Winston_Wolf]

My point was to refute the 'cheap=bad" supposition. If you want to argue studio tricks I can make an equal argument that all snares are junk because they get samples stacked over them on a daily basis. I don't care what the studio players carry around. My point again is the difference in sound between an inexpensive drum and an expensive drum built from the same materials is smaller than most people might think. If there is any difference.

I agree, but I also think some of that is down to the fact that a lot of drummers spend so much time early on fixing and fiddling with sub-par snares that they forget that you don't have to spend hours trying to coax an acceptable sound out of a drum if you start with a well made drum that isn't fighting back the whole time.

 

[jda]

what could it be?

steel doesn't rate very high on musician's "sonorous" scale.
It's good for other things car repair home improvement highway guardrails (don't get me started

so once you move from steel- to aluminum, angelic brass etc etc- you gettin some "tone"..

ok ed just my guess
I do like plain iron for girders in bridges and in skyscrapers

 

[tris66]

I agree, but I also think some of that is down to the fact that a lot of drummers spend so much time early on fixing and fiddling with sub-par snares that they forget that you don't have to spend hours trying to coax an acceptable sound out of a drum if you start with a well made drum that isn't fighting back the whole time.

Agreed. When you get down to beginner tier drums the materials and WC are probably going to be degrees lower.

I do like my iron plain in girders in bridges and skyscrapers

But do you like your brides in iron girdles?
Not a fan of steel snares, myself, but I insist on steel in my guitar and bass strings.

 

[Chris Whitten]

My point again is the difference in sound between an inexpensive drum and an expensive drum built from the same materials is smaller than most people might think. If there is any difference.

Having recorded hundreds of snares of all types and brands, I disagree. The cheaper steel drums can sound great at one thing, maybe two. A better made drum that is slightly more expensive is designed to sound good at more than one tuning, for more than one musical situation.
You don't care what all studio players carry around, but your first sentence highlighted Eric Valentines snare choice - and I was just pointing out that in his drum mixing videos he's piling a ton of samples and fx on every drum.
My opinion is start out with the best snare drum you can afford - and take it from there.

 

[Chris Whitten]

My point again is the difference in sound between an inexpensive drum and an expensive drum built from the same materials is smaller than most people might think. If there is any difference.

Most cheap snares are made of steel or some other very cheap alloy. I have never liked that sound. It doesn't matter to me if Ronn Dunnett or Craviotto are selling a $1000 steel snare, I'm not buying it, I'll stick to a material I DO like the sound of.

 

[Rattlin' Bones]

steel doesn't rate very high on musician's "sonorous" scale.
It's good for other things car repair home improvement highway guardrails (don't get me started

so once you move from steel- to aluminum, angelic brass etc etc- you gettin some "tone"..

ok ed just my guess
I do like plain iron for girders in bridges and in skyscrapers

I dunno. I think we're too often influenced by the name/ model, looks, etc. And maybe how much $$$we spend.

My own experience: playing a metal snare for a year at our blues band practice space. Heavy as he***. I never looked very closely at it because it's not mine. It's always set up ready to go for practice. I just sit down and start practicing with band. Easy peasy. I thought it was brass. Sounds great. Perfect for our blues band. But a few weeks ago I looked and it's steel. And not an expensive steel snare. Therefore, I don't necessarily agree with your premise that: steel doesn't rate very high on musician's "sonorous" scale.
That steel snare I've been practicing on for a year is very sonorous. It is a Pearl Sensitone Steel.

I actually went and bought a 6.5" Pork Pie brass snare based on how well the practice place snare sounded when I was mistaking it for brass.

The Pearl does have a Remo plastic dampener ring on top of head. Now, I do not use any dampening with the PP brass snare - maybe that is the difference? The steel has more ring?

 

[bongoman]

Somebody has gotten the “steel is cheap and bad sounding” idea lodged in their head a little too far. I’ve heard several incredible sounding boutique steel snares, and they were capable of more than one good sound. Sonor, Oriollo, Beier, Keplinger. If anything I think this mental fixation highlights the OP’s original question about details like bearing edges, snare beds, and the quality of the specific metals (and plating) used. “Steel” is a big category that includes a huge range of ingredients and manufacturing techniques, for different tension, stiffness, crystalline structure, and so on.

 

[Tamaefx]

I have had couple of steel snare cheap or not ; and the main gauging criteria is - IMO - the weight.

A heavy and more rigid shell can sound very nice, a cheap light steel shell, almost bendable, will NEVER sound good.
My experience, Tama Rockstar steel against Tama metalwork steel 14x6,5 / 8 lugs both : Much cleaner ring on the heavier one - the Metalwork, fuller sound less dirty ring.
Same experience with Export vs Sensitone. Easier tuning too.
I played a long time a cheap Premier Steel, APK / XPK, not that good, but I changed for 2.3mm triple flange and it was better on rim shot and sounded less ringy.

By the way, my beautiful sounding Rogers Dynasonic (ok, it's COB) has a heavy shell but light hardware.

 

[jda]

That steel snare I've been practicing on for a year is very sonorous. It is a Pearl Sensitone Steel.

Ok. Are you going to make that a snare in your arsenal of choices. You going to buy one to keep. Ok. Good. That's what all this is. We pick choose acquire..... and then play. We don't "need" to "go back" and question our choices "unless there is a question"

My first thread on Drum Forums it was at Harry Cangany's Drum Forum (which spawned Cymbalholic and others) was titled

"Is your Instrument Finished Yet?"

I thought then as I feel now
people were debating this or that back and forth (as they do now) when the botom line is what you own and how you play. That is what matters to you. Not anyone else.
But the talk continues...and I do like the occasional train wrecks

 

[Flea.Bite]

steel doesn't rate very high on musician's "sonorous" scale.
It's good for other things car repair home improvement highway guardrails (don't get me started

so once you move from steel- to aluminum, angelic brass etc etc- you gettin some "tone"..

ok ed just my guess
I do like plain iron for girders in bridges and in skyscrapers

The Ferromanganese Steel is sonorous to me.

 

[jda]

around 6 years ago I took a small $70 chance on one of these:

Vintage MAPEX Venus Series Steel Snare Drum 14" x 6" | Reverb

This vintage snare drum by Mapex is in very good condition. The Venus Series Steel Snare Drum has a diameter of 14 inches and a depth of 6 inches, making it the perfect addition to any drum set. The drum is made of high-quality steel, ensuring that it produces a crisp and clear sound. Whether you...

reverb.com

Tube lugs, 6.5 deep, 8 lugs, Mapex reputation to detail..


Lasted I think 11 minutes with me. A non-musical tone
it didn't possess that "human vocal quality" I look for (need) a better drum seems to have..it was to be polite industrial if that's a musical term at all.

After that not interested- there is an old Script badge Pearl across the street from me in an odds and ends shop. I'm not going to repeat the experience. Crossed off my list- but in drums- you do you- there's no rules until someone expands the rules- and that could be you

 

[Fluffster]

i have the stock snare that came with my very cheap kit and it sounds just fine.... as long as i dont know what im missing the temptation of upgrading to another snare wont bother me. and il have more money for better and more important things. like alcohol.

 

[jda]

The Ferromanganese Steel is sonorous to me.

a Sonor buff would have to have one of those I'd think
(I'm not a Sonor-buff)
That's for them/those/ that are..

Can't own everything.
I'm happy and content in my sphere
that I've cultivated nursed possess
and of course tested as far as I want to be.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Music's supposed to reach in and touch your soul.
Do what you have to do.
Everytime you play a note.