Good Second Crash

Lovetadraw

Senior Member
I'm fairly new to drumming (Since last August) and just last November I got my own set. I got a Zildjian ZBT (don't tell me it's bad) 14 inch crash as my first crash. I'm wondering what's a good second crash to compliment a 14 inch? I like Zildjian, so I'm sticking to it. If I can, I want to at least get a ZHT this time because all the other ZBT crashes are really gongy, and I don't wanna break them.. Thanks.
 

alparrott

Platinum Member
First, I would consider the 14" as a stop-off to bigger and better cymbals ... literally. A 14" crash is really nothing more than a very large splash, in my opinion. Eventually you'll want to get something larger, either a 16" or 18". If you could only have one crash, I'd recommend an 18"; if you could get two, you could consider a 16" or 17".

As far as specifically what to get ... consider looking for gently used pro-level cymbals instead of moving from cheap beginner sheet-metal cymbal to slightly more expensive beginner sheet-metal cymbal. Check whatever passes for Craigslist in your area, and if fortunate enough to live near a large music store, check to see if they carry used gear as well. You can sometimes get a great pie for less than you would pay new for that ZHT.
 

Lovetadraw

Senior Member
I have and 8" splash, and indeed I look around the local Guitar Centers when possible. There's a music store near buy that sells used drum stuff really cheap, just never what I'm looking for. :) So larger then? Thanks!
 

Pocket-full-of-gold

Platinum Member
You asked me not to comment on the ZBT so I won't, but you said nothing about ZHT's. Forget the ZHT.....they're bad. :)

Look around for a used A or A Custom 18" crash.
 

Lovetadraw

Senior Member
You asked me not to comment on the ZBT so I won't, but you said nothing about ZHT's. Forget the ZHT.....they're bad. :)

Yeah, I honestly didn't know what was what. My set didn't even come with any stock cymbals, just a ZBT 18" china (edge full of cracks -_-) and ZBT 14" Hi Hats. I was desperate for anything to crash other than a China. XD That said, I don't mind the harshness of the sound; it depending on what type of music I'm playing, those older, beaten up, dingy hi hats are great for grunge : ). My main thing is that I haven't broken any cymbals yet, and I hear people say ZBT crashes only last a few months.
 

Pocket-full-of-gold

Platinum Member
Whilst it was somewhat of a tease, I honestly believe that you're better spent avoiding the entry level lines and looking around for used pro-level cymbals. Almost everyone who starts out on the budget lines wants to upgrade sooner or later anyway.....especially when they gain a little bit of experience and their ears become acustomed to just how great the difference between a quality cymbal and an entry level one really is. There is much you can do to make a cheap drum kit sound better than it is, but it's not the same with a cymbal.....they pretty much stay the same forever. I always recommoned aiming for a good cymbal sound from the get-go. There's huge saving to be had by scouring the used market.....and if you're ever unsure if something is appropriate or a good deal, then you can always come back and ask us.

My main thing is that I haven't broken any cymbals yet, and I hear people say ZBT crashes only last a few months.

Cymbals don't have a "lifespan" per se. There are guys who've been playing cymbals that are 50 years old and never look like breaking them. I never think about how long a cymbal will last me when I'm buying them. I think about the sound I want and the setting I want to use it in and try to choose the cymbal accordingly. So I don't use a paper thin crash if I'm going to be slamming senseless it with a 2B stick, for example.

That's not to say a cymbal will never break, sometimes they just do. But a lot of the breakage I read about comes from the wrong cymbal being used in the wrong application......and quite often it's simply a matter of guys hitting them way too hard. More often than not, how long a cymbal lasts comes down to how it's used and treated.

I should also add that the reason we all hear of so many broken entry level cymbals no doubt comes down to several factors......like the fact that they are often used by less experienced players who haven't developed their touch or feel on a kit yet so tend to smash the bejesus outta them. And of the fact that being entry level, they simply don't have the same manufacturing techniques that go into producing them that a pro-level cymbal will.
 

Pocket-full-of-gold

Platinum Member
Dave Grohl hits them too hard XD

Dave Grohl doesn't have to keep forking out for them.....and even if he does, he's worth millions and would get them for cost due to his endorsement deal.

You do have to pay (full price) and I'll take a guess you're not worth millions.......see the difference?
 

Lovetadraw

Senior Member
I know, I was trying to agree with your point that all cymbals break if you don't treat them well.

That said, most people tell me sheet bronze breaks easier. I play a lot of rock, but I don't like a lot of... not thin crashes, any suggestions? They always seem to sound too gongy, or do you just have to it them harder?
 

shambo

Member
I took a 10 year hiatus from drums and when I started re-building, I bought a pack of ZHT's. As several people have already said, when I had the money, I started to upgrade. The pack had 14 hats, a 20 ride and 16 and 18 crashes. I still play the 18 crash because it sounds good to me. No cracks or issues with durability after 5 years, so I wouldn't count it out if that is what you can afford and you like the sound.
 

Drumolator

Platinum Member
I have owned ZHT crashes and Sabian XS20 crashes. To me the XS20 crashes sound much better. Good luck finding the right cymbal. Peace and goodwill.
 

Lovetadraw

Senior Member
My drum teacher uses the 22" K Custom Dark Ride and 13" Dark K Hats and Foo Fighters <3 use A customs. I like the sound of the ride, but the hats can be a bit... Thick sounding(?) on hit hat crashes. I like a very clean, crisp hi hat crash sound. That aside, I guess I like the K Darks :D
 

shambo

Member
I love my18" K dark crash or 18" A custom crash. I have 16" crashes but to me they are almost too small. 14" is like a splash to me.

Totally agree there...I have 16 and 18 crashes and picked up an A Custom 15...very splashy...should have gone bigger not smaller!
 

AirborneSFC

Gold Member
My drum teacher uses the 22" K Custom Dark Ride and 13" Dark K Hats and Foo Fighters <3 use A customs. I like the sound of the ride, but the hats can be a bit... Thick sounding(?) on hit hat crashes. I like a very clean, crisp hi hat crash sound. That aside, I guess I like the K Darks :D

I have both A custom and K hi hats. Depending on what gig I have I switch up cymbals. If you wanted the best of both worlds go the Avedis route.
 

AirborneSFC

Gold Member
So Avedis are like midway between them?

In my opinion yes. They are not as dark sounding as the K's and not as bright as the A Customs. They can also be had cheaper than either two. If you have a look on Ebay there are a few sellers with a complete set of Avedis cymbals for sale.

For years I toured with a set of Quick beat Hi Hats, 16" Avedis Medium Crash and 20" Rock ride. I think had a crash ride too but I don't recall.

If you prefer Sabian they are also great cymbals and to my ear have the most similar sound to Zildjian since they come from the same family.

While I love both Zildjian and Sabian - I also have owned and played Paiste which also sound amazing just a different sound. To me it sounds like you are trying to move up and I would recommend a good set of used pro cymbals. Until you develop your "sound" or what you prefer its the most economical route.

To give you an idea of what new costs are - for my sets of A Customs and K's I have about $1.5k all in. Don't even get me started on my drum gear lol.
 

Lovetadraw

Senior Member
I hope to move up as I go along. Like now that I have the basics, anything I add cymbal wise will be better quality because I don't need it so immediately and thus can save longer if needs be. I use an older used Pacific Drums 5 piece minus the original snare. It was replaced with an UMI chrome snare. My double pedal is a Mapex P500TW, I like it. My hardware is 75/25 Gibraltar and Pacific, whatever gets the job done without breaking/the bank ;) . Tell me, how bad does a crack make a crash cymbal sound? What does a crack really do to the sound? I have no hands on experience because the cymbal I have that is minorly cracked was like that since I'd had it. Cuzz I found this 17" Avedis for 25$. maybe a 3" crack making and L shape on the edge.
 
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