Letting others borrow equipment

In East Anglia, fire is a recent discovery. Hence the third-hand bathwater. It takes hours to get enough from an open fire.

I'm reading through this thread and I agree and disagree with just about everything. I've let people borrow my set in the past - especially my old Export - out of necessity and out of choice. There have been situations where backline is available but it's so terrible that I've requested to use my own gear and as a result, I become the backline for the evening. In those circumstances I've always asked for the phone numbers and/or email addresses of the other drummers in the bands so that I can speak to them in advance.

The last time I did this, I make three phone calls. One didn't answer or reply after I left a message, one didn't respond to an email and the other one messaged me back straight away. We had a pleasant conversation, spoke about the backline situation and I agreed to let him use my bass drum and toms as long as he provided his own pedals, cymbals and snare. No problem. I help him set up, show him a few quirks of my kit (it's quirky) and we both tune it and assist during the sound check. He even talks about how he likes my bass drum tuning and we had a nice conversation about tuning and the approaches we take (and he preferred mine to his!).

The bloke from the other band swaggers into the venue (after not replying to my message) he's brought his own kit. No problem. To save time though, he does use my stands with his own shells. They play their set and then leave (rude, at least acknowledge the other bands even if it's for a a minute or two) and I discover just as I'm setting up that my snare stand is broken. An easy fix but not one I could do there (stripped bolt due to over-tightening and cross-threading the wingnut) so I played the set with a replacement from the venue. The guy has said nothing to me and left. More irritating is that the band were actually quite good...

My rule now is that I have to have spoken to them on the phone before I agree to let them use any of my gear and using my snare, cymbals and pedals is out of the question (although I put it in more polite terms). I'm not precious about my kit at all - it's not valuable and it's fairly easy to replace if necessary - but for me, it's about inconvenience. If a bloke has broken something just before I'm about to play, that's irritating.

So I will lend my kit out when I'm playing but only with certain conditions. Where I was playing (London) it can be difficult for people to drive to a venue, park and be able to set up so I'm willing to make their lives easier and would hope that it would be applied both ways depending on circumstances. If I played in a town where the parking policies were liberal and people didn't have to rely on public transport then I'd be much more stringent about the conditions of bringing a kit. Ultimately, I want to play my own gear at a gig if it's possible and if that means sharing with a few people that take the time to talk to me in advance, I'm happy.
 
Like most posters to this thread I have learned that nothing good comes from loaning out your gear. On the flip side I am nervous as heck having to play someone elses gear for fear of breaking something and having to replace it. The last time I shared a kit was for a tribute to Blues Hall of famer Chico Chism shortly after his death. As our band got up to play the drummer stopped me and said play easy I have calf skin heads on the drums. I am a fairly big guy at 6'3" and 220# and I guess he thought I was a heavy hitter. I have never played calfskin heads and didn't know what to expect.I can tell you I was nothing but finesse for all three songs.......... Terry
 
SquadLeader;1177664Only last week we did a gig at a place in Wakefield...I was the only one of three support bands who had taken a full kit (always!) said:
Was it The Hop by any chance?

The only time I've had to borrow equipment was my bands first gig at a festival in Wakefield, when we were loading the van my bassist for some reason which is still unclear, decided to remove my stickbag. So when we arrived at the festival, all I had was one slightly broken stick which was rolling around in the back of the van. I managed to find another drummer and asked to buy a stick off him (I had 10mins til gig time!), he gave me an old stick which was really good of him and I got by.

But yes, I'm of the same attitude. As long as I'm there, I don't mind other drummers using my kit. I had one kid who'd just started lessons having a go on my kit before a gig, I mean it gave him a lot of enjoyment (I'd have loved to have been given a go on a decent kit when I was younger) and the worse that could happen is my heads might become a bit worn. Likewise I let a guy in his 50's have a go while his mate borrowed my guitarists guitar, he'd not played for a while but he blew me away.

I've been fortunate to meet many fantastic, helpful drummers, like a left handed drummer who my band used to support who would always set up and play right handed at his soundcheck so that I didn't have to swap his kit round for my soundcheck. Or one of my teachers who has taught me for about 3 years now and never charged me a penny, that's 2 hours every week going through rudiments and marching patterns which he's probably bored of by now, having played them for 50 years, but every week he helps me improve. Or even the drummer who won an istanbul cymbal I auctioned on ebay, realised he'd got a very very good deal so gave me an extra £10. He didn't have to, but it's these kind of things which make me more willing to share the love, as it were.

I'm not criticising anyone mind...Like others, I'm on a low income so I can't afford many breakages, but I like to help other drummers where I can because I never know when I will need help (again, as long as I'm there - I wouldn't lend my kit out to someone if I wasn't present). A lot of people treat drumming like a competition and make it difficult for you (the old "don't adjust ANYTHING, not even the height of the stool" still irritates me). Support each other, there's room for everyone!
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picodon said:
Friendship is about giving, not about lending. Giving nourishes friendship. Lending puts it at risk. At least that's how I see it.
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Totally agree with this.

I will lend things to very good friends. And when I do decide to loan it, it's with the expectation that if I don't get it back, I'm going to consider it a gift and leave it at that. I let my best friend borrow my 70's Zildjian ride cymbal about 20 years ago. He still has it and I don't have any expectation of getting it back, but that's fine with me, because I would have been just as happy giving him the cymbal. In fact we often joke about it ("Hey dude, how's my ride cymbal?" "Great, I just played it last night!")

Lending and borrowing do put your relationships at risk. That's why I never loan money to family members or friends. Because if they don't give it back, we're not going to be talking anymore! If someone I care about really needs some money, I will GIVE them some money. If they decide to pay me back, cool, if not, that's fine too because I've already considered it to be gone.
 
Why not ask this guy to "borrow" that 20" ride...and not give it back.

He knows it belongs to you,yet he hasn't even made any jesture to give you back, your own property?

THAT,I have a problem with.Taking advantage of a "friend",is not being a friend.

Steve B
 
tamadrm said:
Why not ask this guy to "borrow" that 20" ride...and not give it back.

He knows it belongs to you,yet he hasn't even made any jesture to give you back, your own property?

THAT,I have a problem with.Taking advantage of a "friend",is not being a friend.

Steve B
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This guy is like a brother, it's not as bad as I may have made it sound, and he's given me lots of things over the years. But yeah, if he was just a regular friend, I would have asked for it back a long time ago.
 
PW Carbert said:
I'm not criticising anyone mind...Like others, I'm on a low income so I can't afford many breakages, but I like to help other drummers where I can because I never know when I will need help (again, as long as I'm there - I wouldn't lend my kit out to someone if I wasn't present). A lot of people treat drumming like a competition and make it difficult for you (the old "don't adjust ANYTHING, not even the height of the stool" still irritates me). Support each other, there's room for everyone!
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My thoughts exactly. Always ready to help out a fellow drummer within reason. It can pay you back in spades!
 
Man did I ever learn my lesson! Geez!

Get this, I FINALLY got my snare back this weekend after being told 6 months ago the project wouldn't last any longer than a month. Turns out the project fell through and it wasn't being used. It was returned in exactly the same condition I loaned it out as so I'm happy and lucky. The guy is still a good friend of mine so no harm done except some worry on my part.
 
PW Carbert said:
Was it The Hop by any chance?

The only time I've had to borrow equipment was my bands first gig at a festival in Wakefield, when we were loading the van my bassist for some reason which is still unclear, decided to remove my stickbag. So when we arrived at the festival, all I had was one slightly broken stick which was rolling around in the back of the van. I managed to find another drummer and asked to buy a stick off him (I had 10mins til gig time!), he gave me an old stick which was really good of him and I got by.

But yes, I'm of the same attitude. As long as I'm there, I don't mind other drummers using my kit. I had one kid who'd just started lessons having a go on my kit before a gig, I mean it gave him a lot of enjoyment (I'd have loved to have been given a go on a decent kit when I was younger) and the worse that could happen is my heads might become a bit worn. Likewise I let a guy in his 50's have a go while his mate borrowed my guitarists guitar, he'd not played for a while but he blew me away.

I've been fortunate to meet many fantastic, helpful drummers, like a left handed drummer who my band used to support who would always set up and play right handed at his soundcheck so that I didn't have to swap his kit round for my soundcheck. Or one of my teachers who has taught me for about 3 years now and never charged me a penny, that's 2 hours every week going through rudiments and marching patterns which he's probably bored of by now, having played them for 50 years, but every week he helps me improve. Or even the drummer who won an istanbul cymbal I auctioned on ebay, realised he'd got a very very good deal so gave me an extra £10. He didn't have to, but it's these kind of things which make me more willing to share the love, as it were.

I'm not criticising anyone mind...Like others, I'm on a low income so I can't afford many breakages, but I like to help other drummers where I can because I never know when I will need help (again, as long as I'm there - I wouldn't lend my kit out to someone if I wasn't present). A lot of people treat drumming like a competition and make it difficult for you (the old "don't adjust ANYTHING, not even the height of the stool" still irritates me). Support each other, there's room for everyone!
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Apologies mate....I never saw this response originally.

It was Warehouse23, a new place in the centre quite close to The Hop I think.
 
EricT43 said:
Totally agree with this.

I will lend things to very good friends. And when I do decide to loan it, it's with the expectation that if I don't get it back, I'm going to consider it a gift and leave it at that. I let my best friend borrow my 70's Zildjian ride cymbal about 20 years ago. He still has it and I don't have any expectation of getting it back, but that's fine with me, because I would have been just as happy giving him the cymbal. In fact we often joke about it ("Hey dude, how's my ride cymbal?" "Great, I just played it last night!")

Lending and borrowing do put your relationships at risk. That's why I never loan money to family members or friends. Because if they don't give it back, we're not going to be talking anymore! If someone I care about really needs some money, I will GIVE them some money. If they decide to pay me back, cool, if not, that's fine too because I've already considered it to be gone.
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That's a great attitude to life you have there
 
As a guitar player primarily, the concept of sharing with other bands at a gig (excluding strings, picks, cables or straps) is foreign to me. I don't think I could bring myself to trust strangers with my big ticket items. I have seen it as common amungst drummers I've played with. I don't recall hearing any bad stories until now.

As far as loaning gear to friends, I do it all the time. I do have my main setup that is off limits and stays with me at all times, but I have loaned gear to other bandmates for extended periods of time. In fact, I had a piece of gear at a buddies house for 5 years. I forgot I even owned it. He made sure I got everything before I left. Same friend moved to Japan for three years and couldnt take his full stack, so I sent him a really nice Vox tube amp in the mail. Other than a strange smell, it was returned just how I sent it.

I guess what I'm saying is that I have no problem letting others borrow my gear as long as I know them. I don't lend gear with expectations though. If it is damaged, it is damaged.

Anyways, I am glad you got your snare back safe and sound, rogue_drummer!
 
I'm pretty free with things. If someone wants to try out a drum, then I'll let them. Some of the working pros around my area know that if they need something and if I've got it, they can use it for however long they need to.

Back in 2000 when I had just gotten a second Dunnett snare drum (5x13 Stainless named ARIA) I was so in love with that drum that I sent it to a friend in Arizona. Who then sent it to a friend in Ohio, who sent it to a friend in NYC, etc... for 7 weeks that drum bounced around the country and almost to the EU but I wanted to get it back.

It came back completely unscathed and that was one of the cooler things that ever happened in my drumming world. :D I would consider doing it again, with the right people.

And another time there was this now famous cat (I won't mention who) who called me one day while he was living (camping) in Vista, CA. down the street from my place. Dude called and said "Man I gotta go get a job at Toys-R-Us" and I was like "What? Are you kidding? YOU? And dude was depressed because his drums were up in LA on a gear truck. I suspect he didn't own them and needed a kit to play so I lent him a set of Corder drums for about 6 months.

Dude went on to become one of the name cats today. Maybe he'll remember that old green kit someday.
 
BillRayDrums said:
I'm pretty free with things. If someone wants to try out a drum, then I'll let them. Some of the working pros around my area know that if they need something and if I've got it, they can use it for however long they need to.

Back in 2000 when I had just gotten a second Dunnett snare drum (5x13 Stainless named ARIA) I was so in love with that drum that I sent it to a friend in Arizona. Who then sent it to a friend in Ohio, who sent it to a friend in NYC, etc... for 7 weeks that drum bounced around the country and almost to the EU but I wanted to get it back.

It came back completely unscathed and that was one of the cooler things that ever happened in my drumming world. :D I would consider doing it again, with the right people.

And another time there was this now famous cat (I won't mention who) who called me one day while he was living (camping) in Vista, CA. down the street from my place. Dude called and said "Man I gotta go get a job at Toys-R-Us" and I was like "What? Are you kidding? YOU? And dude was depressed because his drums were up in LA on a gear truck. I suspect he didn't own them and needed a kit to play so I lent him a set of Corder drums for about 6 months.

Dude went on to become one of the name cats today. Maybe he'll remember that old green kit someday.
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Just goes to show that not all hope is lost in the human race.
 
..."neither a lender or borrower be"..and.."good fences make good neighbors"...and other such cliches..

I bet I'd make an exception for life long friends...but nothing I couldn't feel ok about throwing in the street overnight and hoping I'd get back the next day.
 
I've lent breakables to a friend, but only because I knew he'd take care of them (& we were gigging together). I'd certainly have to think long & hard before lending to someone I don't know, even if I was present when they were used.
I recently got asked by a friend (who lives in London) if she could borrow my bass amp, as hers broke the previous day & she needed one urgently. I turned up with it for her at the RCM in Manchester, as she asked me to, where I discovered that the urgent reason was that the band she was in were doing their first national tour by playing support to Boy George. As a thank you I got a free pass to that gig & the one near me in Leeds the next night. The amp came back just as it had left, and her band got rave reviews.
That felt good.
 
firesgt911 said:
Just goes to show that not all hope is lost in the human race.
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Awww, thanks man! The way I see it- if someone's gonna be a douchebag and try to screw me... really, in the end they'll be the ones who get hurt. This community is tight. And when I say "I'll loan something to someone" doesn't mean that I'll give it to just anyone. They gotta have some sort of standing within a circle of people, you know...have someone who can vouch for them. Drummers are of a fraternal nature and those who are in a group are "in". And we know who the good dudes/dudettes are and the not so good ones. We try to help the not so good ones and if they are beyond help, they're "voted off the island".

Common sense. It's my biggest commodity. :D
 
I am in Malaysia. 99% of all drummers here can only afford the most basic equipment.

I have a snare on permanent loan to a jam place, I have given a couple of drummers cymbals I am not using. I have on several occations lend some of my nice cymbals or kits to a local drummer if they have a recording gig or something special comming up. My gear is there to be used and I enjoy listening to another drummer playing my stuff.
Naturally what is borrowed needs to be returned and I have not had a problem with that.

My local drummer buddies are tappers, not bashers and hit things much gentler than I do myself.

thx

jorn
 
I'm not flush with money; I have one drum kit and one only. It's taken years to put that kit together to get just the sound I want to make with drums. I value it very highly; it's a one-of-a-kind drum kit. It's also my friend.

No way I'd loan any of my gear, I don't care who it is. I might loan out a cymbal or two, depending on who I'm loaning it to, but never a drum, nor any of my hardware because every piece of hardware is set just so.

So, cymbals maybe, but drums and hardware: not a chance.
 
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