frustrated..

[jimtyler]

I watched the video in question when it was first posted.

My thought was it wasn't recorded very well. The melody was difficult to hear thru a video camera mic or whatever was used. For the most part, it just sounded like "drums."
If you want the melody to stand out, you need some better mics to capture your ideas.

So I didn't leave a comment, because I was trying to think of something nice to say without coming off like a jerk, and couldn't find the words, and then got distracted by something else, and never went back.

As far as being frustrated, yeah, well so am I, as are thousands of other drummers out there who are trying to get recognized for something. Did you comment on my clips I've posted? No, I think not. Have you commented on all of the 100's of clips posted in the "Your Playing" section? Doubtful. If you're not willing to comment on others clips, why should they comment on yours?

You make a very good point. The recoeding was crappy, I grant you, it was a live clinic with a cheap Kodak Z16 video camera with no other micing. I should invest in some better quality video production (overheads, multicamera views etc.)
And you are right, I seldom comment on other drummer posts. I do every time I hear something new and original. I''ve listened to nearly thousands by now. They all sound like the same drumming that was going on in 1970, or how fast my feet can go or look at me doing rudiments on the set. Listening to drumming can be very boring.
There are some greats out here, and I always enjoy listening to them, but who wants to listen to somebody copying someone else? Talk about unoriginal!
I know I'm just a B drummer doing something different, but that's the point, it's different. I would rather be trying something totally different and failing miserably than doing what's been done before a thousand times.
Give me a drummer pushing any kind of boundaries and I love to listen and will comment.

 

[nathaniel_h]

Thank you. Point taken and understood. Just a little frustrated when nobody even watched.
It is just a drum forum, I need to take things more realistically.
My focus will be on practicing, doing something better melodically, and not care if anyone else notices. The only person I can truly satisfy is myself, and I am definitetly not satisfied with where drumming is right now.

That's a great way to handle it! A lot of the most popular YouTubers out there have the same philosophy. I'm sure the people who aren't popular are the ones who wanted to be popular from the start, and only did videos because of that sole reason.

Good luck on your endeavor, I do find your work very creative.

 

[JohnnyG]

You know Jim, I watched your stuff and with all due respect for the time you spent developing your direction, I didn't find it appealing either. That is no knock to your abilities, which are substantial. But truth be told, I'm not crazy about drum sounds applied to melodies. The tones aren't pure enough for me, and it's hard to make a good sounding chord. Now I'm not too sophisticated musically but I do know what lubes my gears. You are very far ahead of the pack here, with not a lot of appreciation for what it is you do. It seems like a lonely road to go down, playing melody on a rhythm instrument.
I realize how negative this sounds, but I can't lie about music. I do admire your vision and your dedication.

I would have to agree almost word for word with Larry's post. One of my main reasons for not liking karaoke is the god awful sounds of off key voices. I feel that you have a great grasp on what you are doing but the drums aren't or didn't sound quite tuned to me, let's say in the way a piano or at least steel drums are tuned. I know it is a lot of work and time but I watched and just wasn't moved to post any thing about the video. At least you weren't the object of the usual abuse one would find on Youtube. I would also suggest the posting for the reason of sharing your work and not for getting a lot of feedback. Just believe in your self and drum on.

 

[Migaluch]

Cool i think you have an interesting style. I noticed you don't use mics? I think the whole concept of melodic drumming would sound better to people if you had a miced set. Other than that, i get what you are trying to accomplish and i think it is going well. Keep it up i like it!

I also liked the "Pirate Grip", its pretty funny. i'll give that a go also.

 

[Adam B]

More originals. Less poppy covers. And by less poppy covers, I mean no more poppy covers. Your originals are infinitely more interesting.

 

[Pollyanna]

Jim, I've always enjoyed your posts and have commented on all but the last. I was probably busy at the time and it slipped down the list by the time I returned.

I do think DED makes a good point about giving and receiving, though. There are a number of people who post in the Your Playing area who don't provide feedback for others. I find drum covers very boring but I enjoy it when drummers either do something different or present their playing with a band.

 

[DrumEatDrum]

More originals. Less poppy covers. And by less poppy covers, I mean no more poppy covers. Your originals are infinitely more interesting.

Agreed.

For the life of me, I can't understand why anyone would record themselves playing along to a CD and then post it. But I guess I'm in the minority here.

 

[Migaluch]

Agreed.

For the life of me, I can't understand why anyone would record themselves playing along to a CD and then post it. But I guess I'm in the minority here.

Well, this summer i will be taking lessons and i would like to post a video of me playing to show you guys my progress, but is there anything that is better than a cover? Should i just put together some cool beats and play them? Then again, you were pretty harsh on atlantarules so should i even post anything at all???

 

[Brundlefly]

you are joking? Exactly what melodic song has Bozzio ever played? Don't get me wrong, Bozzio is a huge influence, but he never went all the way melodic, sorry. He plays some nice beats on a killer set, but he has never gone melodic in his life. Melodic means playing a melody. I prefer something recognizable, Terry wants to make up his own and call it melodic. Sorry here, but could do those beats too if anyone in the world was interested. It is was more interesting to try actual melodic pieces.

I'm going to differ with you here. As a drummer into melodic playing myself, I find Bozzio's stuff holds up as real songs that I can listen to as wholly independent pieces of music. The only difference I can find between what he's doing and what you are doing is that you are mostly playing songs written by other people that are well known to your audience, while Terry plays exclusively original pieces (to the best of my knowledge).

You seem to be using personal taste to draw a line of distinction for what qualifies as melodic drumming, while at the same time complaining that people aren't responding positively to your chosen direction for what are likely the very same reasons. As such, you weaken your own cause.

Probably the bigger point to be made is that I would have hoped that you, as a pioneer of a new direction in drumming, might recognize that the last thing melodic drumming needs as it struggles to gain legitimacy are fellow melodic drummers dissing each other because of their differences of approach. There are just too few of us for that to be a positive contribution to the cause for melodic drumming... of which you appear to be a staunch advocate.

 

[DrumEatDrum]

Well, this summer i will be taking lessons and i would like to post a video of me playing to show you guys my progress, but is there anything that is better than a cover? Should i just put together some cool beats and play them?

I'd just think one would better served joining a band, going to a jam session, writing a song.
Sure, I played along to tapes as a kid (dating myself here), it's a good way to learn. But playing along to CDs doesn't automatically translate into ability to play with other musicians.
The CD is not relying on you as the drummer to drive the band, and if you goof, the CD keeps going, where as in the real world if you good, you might throw the whole band off.
Still, it's a great practice tool, but I don't see the point of publishing practice to world.
But obviously, thousands of people on Youtube disagree. So what do I know.

Then again, you were pretty harsh on atlantarules so should i even post anything at all???

Huh? I've only been in Atlanta once, for a brief afternoon.

 

[jimtyler]

you are joking? Exactly what melodic song has Bozzio ever played? Don't get me wrong, Bozzio is a huge influence, but he never went all the way melodic, sorry. He plays some nice beats on a killer set, but he has never gone melodic in his life. Melodic means playing a melody. I prefer something recognizable, Terry wants to make up his own and call it melodic. Sorry here, but could do those beats too if anyone in the world was interested. It is was more interesting to try actual melodic pieces.

If there is one post I can ever take back it was this one. I've always loved Bozzio, I would not still be playing anymore if it wasn't for hearing him do his thing. And the background musician quote was way out of line. I was wrong. I really came off as an a##ho@@ and I apologise.
Sober now, not so frustrated. Thank you for all the great, considerate responses..

 

[Larry]

All is forgiven here Jim. We all know you're a good dude. What happens in Vegas stays in Vegas ha ha.
You need a better recording, in fact I would delete that video (so no one can dismiss you) and produce a video that does you justice.
Close ups and awesome sound. Anything less won't do for your stuff.

 

[Migaluch]

I'd just think one would better served joining a band, going to a jam session, writing a song.
Sure, I played along to tapes as a kid (dating myself here), it's a good way to learn. But playing along to CDs doesn't automatically translate into ability to play with other musicians.
The CD is not relying on you as the drummer to drive the band, and if you goof, the CD keeps going, where as in the real world if you good, you might throw the whole band off.
Still, it's a great practice tool, but I don't see the point of publishing practice to world.
But obviously, thousands of people on Youtube disagree. So what do I know.



Huh? I've only been in Atlanta once, for a brief afternoon.

I was talking about Atlanta Rules, a member here on DW. Some people were really harsh on him for posting a video of him playing, so i was worried that i should not do the same.

 

[danlikesdrums]

Hi Jim

being frusteated is ok but then again we need to take it slowly surely it hurts but there is sumthing you can do go to a perfesstion teacher and have him acress you and then he can see what your wat you need help with and what not but remember it takes time no one is perfect everyone is a learner even me I came from a musical background and mom and brother were both musicans expert my mom was a singer and I understand how it feels no one is judging you let whatcums out of you flow but that time you will be in the zone and yeah but remember less is more we cant all be perfect its not right.

 

[brownie1969]

Hi Jim

being frusteated is ok but then again we need to take it slowly surely it hurts but there is sumthing you can do go to a perfesstion teacher and have him acress you and then he can see what your wat you need help with and what not but remember it takes time no one is perfect everyone is a learner even me I came from a musical background and mom and brother were both musicans expert my mom was a singer and I understand how it feels no one is judging you let whatcums out of you flow but that time you will be in the zone and yeah but remember less is more we cant all be perfect its not right.

I concur...."perfesstion" teachers could do the world some good.

 

[jimtyler]

Hi Jim

being frusteated is ok but then again we need to take it slowly surely it hurts but there is sumthing you can do go to a perfesstion teacher and have him acress you and then he can see what your wat you need help with and what not but remember it takes time no one is perfect everyone is a learner even me I came from a musical background and mom and brother were both musicans expert my mom was a singer and I understand how it feels no one is judging you let whatcums out of you flow but that time you will be in the zone and yeah but remember less is more we cant all be perfect its not right.

Thanks.. I really do appreciate your post! And I agree, whatcums out of me is more important than you know!

 

[Pollyanna]

Thanks.. I really do appreciate your post! And I agree, whatcums out of me is more important than you know!

Jim, does whatcums out of you flow when you're in the zone? .....



Edit: I like Dan's comment to the effect of ... "no one is judging you. Let it flow and then you will be in the zone.

 

[Andy]

I was talking about Atlanta Rules, a member here on DW. Some people were really harsh on him for posting a video of him playing, so i was worried that i should not do the same.

Atlanta Rules posted his stuff in the General Discussion section, twice. That raised a few comments. A couple of guys were a bit harsh, but the majority were helpful & repectful. You should post your stuff IMO, & expect the usual mixed bag of comments. After all, what's the point of posting stuff, only to seek positive remarks. Positive critisism is always expected, however, positive critisism can be negative in a constructive & balanced way.

 

[Pollyanna]

Atlanta Rules posted his stuff in the General Discussion section, twice. That raised a few comments. A couple of guys were a bit harsh, but the majority were helpful & repectful. You should post your stuff IMO, & expect the usual mixed bag of comments. After all, what's the point of posting stuff, only to seek positive remarks. Positive critisism is always expected, however, positive critisism can be negative in a constructive & balanced way.

I suspect part of it was his posting in the high traffic area of the site, putting an unfair focus on his posting over others who posted in the right place.

If anything, I think people usually avoid criticising and prefer to encourage instead, maybe too much at times. Hard to be sure because drumming is such a confidence game.

 

[mrchattr]

I'm glad that the attitude in here has gotten a little less rough, that's nice to see.

As far as the OP, there are two things I want to say. One that has been addressed, at least a little bit, is that melodic drumming is, while not a commonly done thing, nothing new. Whether it's Bozzio doing his stuff (and again, if you haven't, look at how his latest kit is tuned, it's all based on actual scales and tuned exactly), or guys I've seen playing the Super Mario Brothers theme or, yes, even the Star Wars theme (I've seen it before), it's being done. That's not to knock it, but simply to say that if it's the direction you want to go in, spend some time doing some serious research into it. There are a lot of cool things out there that can help, from better cameras to better mics to better tuning of the drums (your kit isn't exactly in tune for that song, it was a little rough to be frank...more a great idea than a great execution), to trying different sticks or mallets that don't mute the tones of the drums so much. When I solo, I tend to think melodically, play melodies, build on them, etc, and from that I have learned a lot about how to make the drums sing melodically, as opposed to just thumping like, well, drums. Learn what these guys that are doing this do to tune exactly to notes, etc.

The second thing I have to address is that, at the end of the day, it's YouTube. Who cares if no one sees it? I started a thread on here about all the reasons that I think YouTube is a great tool, but also a really bad thing for a lot of up and coming drummers. If you start basing your musical worth off what random people on the internet do or don't say, well, that's just sad. You want to explore something relatively new? Do it, for yourself! If others love it, great! If not, who cares, you are doing something true to yourself, and that's all that matters. Many of the greatest innovators in music were disliked during their times.