Using a Metronome/Click on stage

petey

Member
Been thinking about it. All I have is a Korg MA 30 for home practice. Been looking at the Tama Rythym Watch

I have a great meter, I'm not playing any sequenced music, I just need a general idea of the BPM for maybe 10 songs because we play 5 sets a night of 50 different cover tunes.

Who plays with what?
 

New Tricks

Platinum Member
I couldn't do it unless I could switch it on and off.

1. There are many songs where the fills are difficult to keep 100% in time. You may have great meter but it only takes a milisecond to get out of whack.

2. In a LOT of cases, you will be constantly trying to pull or push the lead man into your time when maybe you should be playing in his time.

I have a set up where I can turn a click track on/off with the strike of a stick. I sometimes use it to keep things in check. If the song sounds good, I just play it.

It is great to run a click in rehearsal though. It's humbling and will help everyone get on the same page.
 

bermuda

Drummerworld Pro Drummer - Administrator
Staff member
I was in one group where I checked tempos before most songs, and I used a korg Beatlab, because I could key in the tempo and press start. It wasn't ideal, because it tried to do too much... getting a straight click meant lowerng the sliders for the subdivisions it always tried to play. But, I only used it to get the bpm, not play to it, so I guess it wasn't so bad.

Soon after, I got a keypad metronome app for my iPad and that was actually much better. Soon after that, I stopped playing with that band. :)

So my answer is, get an app with a numeric keypad entry.

Bermuda
 

Living Dead Drummer

Platinum Member
I use a click live 100% of the time.

If it's a gig with no tracks I feed a signal in from a Yamaha DTX Drum Module to an 8 channel mixer. The whole system is hard wired together in a road case.
I also put a direct feed of the live band onto a separate channel. This way I can control the volume of the band vs. the click in my ears.

If it's a song I know the band struggles with in terms of tempo, I turn them down and play off the click. Otherwise the click sits low in the mix just to keep things steady.

It takes a lot of time and practice, but once you learn to groove with metronome it's great!
 

bermuda

Drummerworld Pro Drummer - Administrator
Staff member
Maybe alpha numeric so you can store the BPM's by song name
Unless you can put the songs in setlist order and cursor with one click to the next tempo, it's faster to have a printed setlist with the songs in order and their BPM, and key those 2 or 3 #s and press start. 4 keystrokes tops... much easier than cursoring through an alphabettical song list.

If you do find an app that will store 30+ songs, you have to program it. And, you'll probably still use a paper setlist. Much simpler to be flexible and just key in tempos as needed.

Bermuda
 

SgtThump

Platinum Member
I now use an android app named "visual metronome." As the name implies, it's for playing to a visual display instead of a click sound. Takes some practice, but it's great.
 

cave.

Junior Member
I bought a used DB-90 and it works really well. Holds up to 50 presets and has options for foot pedals (start/stop & change presets). I think I got mine for $60
 

Dave_Major

Silver Member
Been thinking about it. All I have is a Korg MA 30 for home practice. Been looking at the Tama Rythym Watch

I have a great meter, I'm not playing any sequenced music, I just need a general idea of the BPM for maybe 10 songs because we play 5 sets a night of 50 different cover tunes.

Who plays with what?

Clicks live are great for just that.

I have p[layed with preprogrammed tracks with clicks and without clicks, just the click etc etc.

Playing with clicks even for the first 8 bars removes the 'that song was faster' conversation.

If your meter is great (we can all improve though so keep working on it) then you should stay steady for the rest of the song.

I couldn't do it unless I could switch it on and off.

1. There are many songs where the fills are difficult to keep 100% in time. You may have great meter but it only takes a milisecond to get out of whack.

2. In a LOT of cases, you will be constantly trying to pull or push the lead man into your time when maybe you should be playing in his time.

I have a set up where I can turn a click track on/off with the strike of a stick. I sometimes use it to keep things in check. If the song sounds good, I just play it.

It is great to run a click in rehearsal though. It's humbling and will help everyone get on the same page.
Don't agree woth your first point. Thats why we practice with a click ALL the time. So that you work out the tendnacy to speed up/slow down in those tricky passages.

Vinnie, weckl, thomas lang and many others play very complex passages with great feel and in time. If you can't play it in time then practice more. Simple
If your band can't play with you when you are in time they aren't going to play nicely when you are playing without a click.

I bought a used DB-90 and it works really well. Holds up to 50 presets and has options for foot pedals (start/stop & change presets). I think I got mine for $60
DB90 is great. Love it as a practice tool only thing is it is a bit quiet using it without an amp.


D
 

petey

Member
Thanks for the Insight, All!

I like the idea of a 'Visual Metronome' app, way cool. I just want something (for now) to be able to punch in the BPM and hear the click for a few seconds, get the idea and then GO.
For these next couple gigs, since I have no In Ear headphone (and like to wear ear filters to protect my hearing) I may just use the little Korg for a quick reference before each song

Eventually, that DB-90 looks like it might be a new purchase for me!
 

New Tricks

Platinum Member
Unless you can put the songs in setlist order and cursor with one click to the next tempo, it's faster to have a printed setlist with the songs in order and their BPM
I'm technologically spoiled and lazy. I like to push buttons :) If I was using a tempo setting tool, it would be laid out per set list.


Why drum if you need a click? Never understood that.
To teach you to drum better.?


Don't agree woth your first point. Thats why we practice with a click ALL the time. So that you work out the tendnacy to speed up/slow down in those tricky passages.
If you have never had problem playing difficult fills with a click, why do you need one?


Vinnie, weckl, thomas lang and many others play very complex passages with great feel and in time.
And that relates to anything or anyone here because ? It always cracks me up when people refer to Vinnie, like you are his buddy. I don't know who he is but I assume he is a WAY above average pro drummer. (hmmmmm,,,,new thread idea. Look for it :)


If your band can't play with you when you are in time they aren't going to play nicely when you are playing without a click.
False. VOLUMES of excellent music is played every day without perfect tempo. Not even a trained ear will pick up slight BPM changes. An average listener can't even pick up a 10 BPM variation throughout a song.
 

Dr_Watso

Platinum Member
I now use an android app named "visual metronome." As the name implies, it's for playing to a visual display instead of a click sound. Takes some practice, but it's great.
A few times at practice, I was watching the digital equalizer readout and noticed that the click in the mix has it's own space that's visible on the levels readout. I figured out where the constant click was represented on the meter, and was able to follow the music by "watching" the click even though I had taken it out of my ears. I actually much preferred not having that damn noise in my ear, and playing really didn't feel awkward at all.

I suspect I've sort of been doing the same thing for a while now. Ever looked up into the audience and watched them all dancing or bobbing along, then "followed" it for a while? I sometimes do the same thing if I see a guitar or bass player tapping their foot in time as they play. It's cool to have visual representation that you're on the same page.
 

bermuda

Drummerworld Pro Drummer - Administrator
Staff member
Why drum if you need a click? Never understood that.
Using a metronome to recall a pre-agreed-upon tempo is not the same as playing to a click.

Playing to a click is done to keep the drummer (and the rest of the band) in sync with a pre-recorded track or video.

If a drummer is being forced to use a click because his time is poor, then there must be a reason he hasn't already been replaced.

Bermuda
 

Dr_Watso

Platinum Member
If a drummer is being forced to use a click because his time is poor, then there must be a reason he hasn't already been replaced.
I've been able to stay on board more than a few projects with my perfectly timed, hilarious, and immaculately humble jokes.

Guitarist: Hey!... This drummer sucks!

Me: Did you guys hear the one about the depressed drummer that attempted suicide? ... He threw himself behind a train!

Guitarist: LOL! What were we talking about, again?



Something like that, anyway.
 

bermuda

Drummerworld Pro Drummer - Administrator
Staff member
There's a difference between fluctuating a little, and egregious speeding-up or slowing down. If the variance can be detected by another member whose parts are easily affected by fluctuating tempos - guitarists and singers tend to be most sensitive to this - then it's a problem.

Bermuda
 

drum4fun27302

Gold Member
I have tempo advance. I have a song list on paper with a tempo written next to each song. With that app , you can just tap it on the iPhone and it shows the tempo. Keep on adjusting your tapping until you reach the desire number and voilà !!!
 

porter

Platinum Member
I used to use a click on my phone (believe the app was by FrozenApe) that had good setlist support but the app was a total mess on Android. Now I just perform without one because I practiced enough to be confident in my time, but I use Mobile Metronome whenever I just need a quick check. If it had good setlist support, if I needed a click, and if it weren't important enough to use my Macbook with backing tracks, I'd use it more.

If you have never had problem playing difficult fills with a click, why do you need one?
This is like saying "if you never had trouble getting up stairs in crutches, why do you need them?". It could be a psychological effect, a simple matter of support, or something else. Note that I am not using "crutch" in the negative sense as it is commonly used.

Notice also that Dave said that we practice with clicks to work out the errors, he wasn't saying that that means we work it out until it's perfect and then some.

False. VOLUMES of excellent music is played every day without perfect tempo. Not even a trained ear will pick up slight BPM changes. An average listener can't even pick up a 10 BPM variation throughout a song.
Gradually, anyway, and his original point wasn't that- it was that if bandmates have issues playing together when the drummer is playing to a click, they are going to likely have even more issues if the drummer isn't.
 

New Tricks

Platinum Member
Notice also that Dave said that we practice with clicks to work out the errors, he wasn't saying that that means we work it out until it's perfect and then some.
Miscommunication somewhere I guess.

He said he didn't agree that
There are many songs where the fills are difficult to keep 100% in time. You may have great meter but it only takes a milisecond to get out of whack[
That made no sense to me because the statements seem factual.


his original point wasn't that- it was that if bandmates have issues playing together when the drummer is playing to a click, they are going to likely have even more issues if the drummer isn't.

From a different point of view (mine :) ), it would be easier because the drummer could simply adjust to their tempo. It's been my experience that it is a LOT easier playing without a click. The music will certainly move around a bit. Perhaps it's just fing a comfortable level based on many individual factors.
 

Dave_Major

Silver Member
If you have never had problem playing difficult fills with a click, why do you need one?

I'm not saying i;ve never sped up or down and I don't have perfect time. I don't think anyone does. What i was stressing is that we practice with a click so that we can perform passages that are hard in time. If it is not in time then we aren't doing our job right. IF a fill is dragged, rushed or stutters then the band notices and the feel goes. Irregardless of a click being there or not if you can't play it without stumbling through it and messing up the time then you need to work on it more. I practice with a click in everything i practice to help me play better time when I play without one. It also prepares me for the studio work i do and anything else where a click is required.


And that relates to anything or anyone here because ? It always cracks me up when people refer to Vinnie, like you are his buddy. I don't know who he is but I assume he is a WAY above average pro drummer. (hmmmmm,,,,new thread idea. Look for it :)

I am not his buddy however he is referred to by his first name in the same way Tony and Buddy are...what's wrong with that? Everyone know;s who I am talking about. He may be way above the average pro drummer but he also plays ideas and concepts far and above what most drummer can play and he does it in time.
Just because we aren't as good as Vinnie or Weckl or Jojo Mayer is no excuse not to play in time and to excuse messing up a complex fill or passage.





False. VOLUMES of excellent music is played every day without perfect tempo. Not even a trained ear will pick up slight BPM changes. An average listener can't even pick up a 10 BPM variation throughout a song.
Lots of great music is played with and without clicks, live and in the studio. The ability to play everything with and without a click is an essential tool for a drummer today. Some songs can move and sound great some can't. The OP asked if he should use a click for those songs where the tempo needs to be exact.


From a different point of view (mine :) ), it would be easier because the drummer could simply adjust to their tempo. It's been my experience that it is a LOT easier playing without a click. The music will certainly move around a bit. Perhaps it's just fing a comfortable level based on many individual factors.[/QUOTE]

If a band can't follow your time then you are always on a losing battle. If a bass player drags and then you go to meet him and then he drags again and you move to him again the song will slow down and drag which is totally different from a laid back feel.

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D
 
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