Udrilled,virgin base drum pros&cons
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wraub
Gold Member
So far, I prefer the toms-on-bass approach.
The toms are where I want them, and I have to believe that the system was designed with load stresses in mind, if simply to avoid warranty work.
My drums are made by a company known for analyzing everything possible, so I have no problems with my "drilled" bass drum.
I also believe that any potential loss is negligible at best, and is lost in a mix of other drums and other instruments.
Also, also, I believe that most listeners won't really notice or care, as long as the music is good.
The toms are where I want them, and I have to believe that the system was designed with load stresses in mind, if simply to avoid warranty work.
My drums are made by a company known for analyzing everything possible, so I have no problems with my "drilled" bass drum.
I also believe that any potential loss is negligible at best, and is lost in a mix of other drums and other instruments.
Also, also, I believe that most listeners won't really notice or care, as long as the music is good.
petrez
Senior Member
Well, coming from a metal drummer's perspective on double bass kits, I'm used to virgin kicks in a setup with a rack. Just looks cleaner to me (and more high-end, as some others have mentioned. You rarely see cheap kits with virgin bassdrums, but yes, it is a very superficial point, and only I would probably notice it anyway at a gig), even though there is no notable difference in sound, I muffle the bassdrums anyway. However, I also like the practicality of the bassdrum mount when gigging in situations I would rather not bring the rack. Using stands, it's way easier to get everything nice and within reach, and with less stand clutter on the floor, when you can mount the crash cymbals to the bassdrums, and have a double tom stand in the middle. Just makes the setup looks cleaner. I'm not sure I would like to get a high-end kit with tom mounts for that reason alone though, but it was a nice feat. to use when I gigged with a cheaper kit earlier.
Oh, Hey! I should have recognized the name/profile pic. Thanks for the compliment (again) and good to see you over here.
C.M. Jones
Diamond Member
I also believe that any potential loss is negligible at best, and is lost in a mix of other drums and other instruments.
Also, I believe that most listeners won't really notice or care, as long as the music is good.
Right on the money, Wraub. That also goes for many aspects of tuning, shell selection, and cymbal choice. Drummers get caught up in pedantic nuances and attempt to convince themselves that audiences share their neurotic preoccupations. It just doesn't work that way.
I implore everyone to recite the following affirmation three times:
I'm a drummer and no one notices me. With the exception of other drummers, no one cares about my equipment, neither its quality nor its sound. People just want to enjoy themselves, and as long as I can keep a beat, I can support that goal.
There. Doesn't that feel better?
wraub
Gold Member
This a thing I have long known as a working bass player-many players obsess about gear because of the nuances of sound, which is fine, but the nuances can get lost in a live situation, and can be almost guaranteed to in a bar or club gig.
This is fine, as the average patrons just demand aural wallpaper to background their drinking and dancing, or for that one song to sound like it always does. It's not that they don't want it to sound good- it's more like, if it sounds good enough, the rest doesn't matter. You might care if you're playing a $10,000 bass or a drum kit made of (your favorite material here) but they just want the music to not be terrible- and this is often debatable.
This is fine, as the average patrons just demand aural wallpaper to background their drinking and dancing, or for that one song to sound like it always does. It's not that they don't want it to sound good- it's more like, if it sounds good enough, the rest doesn't matter. You might care if you're playing a $10,000 bass or a drum kit made of (your favorite material here) but they just want the music to not be terrible- and this is often debatable.
C.M. Jones
Diamond Member
This a thing I have long known as a working bass player-many players obsess about gear because of the nuances of sound, which is fine, but the nuances can get lost in a live situation, and can be almost guaranteed to in a bar or club gig.
This is fine, as the average patrons just demand aural wallpaper to background their drinking and dancing, or for that one song to sound like it always does. It's not that they don't want it to sound good- it's more like, if it sounds good enough, the rest doesn't matter. You might care if you're playing a $10,000 bass or a drum kit made of (your favorite material here) but they just want the music to not be terrible- and this is often debatable.
We're 700 percent on the same page.
Yamaha Rider
Platinum Member
Yamaha Rider
Platinum Member
MIT needs to do a random blind-test and get it peer reviewed and settle this once and for all.
Yamaha Rider
Platinum Member
'Aesthetically' I think you meant to say. 'Ascetically' means, well, 'for purists who insist on virgin bass drums, etc.' ?
wraub
Gold Member
I know this because I used to gig with a thousand dollar active bass, and now I play (well, did) with a Squier bass I bought at a pawn shop for $49.99 (out the door!!) and no one noticed or cared, apparently. It's more about the music than the instrument, scientifically proved!! ?
Not sure where you are, because private profile, but it's too bad we can't put a band together- the gear may not look great, but I bet we'd sound pretty good.
and no one noticed or cared, apparently. It's more about the music than the instrument, scientifically proved!! ?Not sure where you are, because private profile, but it's too bad we can't put a band together- the gear may not look great, but I bet we'd sound pretty good.
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Morrisman
Platinum Member
An important thing to consider is whether the kit is going to be packed up and down constantly for gigs, or if its going to be set up once in a studio. Also if a kit is going to be shared or just used by one person.
For a gigging kit, the tom mount is quick and easy, as long as you can get the toms where you want them. For a studio, set up time is less important, but the ability to tweak and fine tune the set up makes seperate stands useful.
For a gigging kit, the tom mount is quick and easy, as long as you can get the toms where you want them. For a studio, set up time is less important, but the ability to tweak and fine tune the set up makes seperate stands useful.
Yamaha Rider
Platinum Member
Re-read that comment and pray it never gets taken out of context and used in a court case against you, mr Agrippa. ?
C.M. Jones
Diamond Member
I know this because I used to gig with a thousand dollar active bass, and now I play (well, did) with a Squier bass I bought at a pawn shop for $49.99 (out the door!!)
Not sure where you are, because private profile, but it's too bad we can't put a band together- the gear may not look great, but I bet we'd sound pretty good.
Ha! Don't get me wrong; my gear is in top shape. I just believe gear to be an overemphasized dimension of drumming. It's fine if drummers want to languish over their equipment choices, but it's important to recognize that listeners are largely indifferent toward (and oblivious to) the features of your setup.
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Larry
"Uncle Larry"
This forum is first and foremost, a gear forum. It's like the subject of 90% of the threads. So things get discussed to death, again and again.
The gems are hidden in between the gear discussions. Gear is a topic that can be discussed rationally, unlike other subjects.
I really like the personal side of things here, the community, because the gear discussions can only go so far.
I like calling people by name here. It's pretty cool.
The gems are hidden in between the gear discussions. Gear is a topic that can be discussed rationally, unlike other subjects.
I really like the personal side of things here, the community, because the gear discussions can only go so far.
I like calling people by name here. It's pretty cool.
C.M. Jones
Diamond Member
Heck yes. I think the sense of community here is overwhelmingly genuine. I wouldn't participate otherwise. I also believe gear is fun to think about, discuss, and acquire. I've never met a drummer who doesn't love drums, cymbals, heads, and, most important, sticks. It's noteworthy that we don't touch our drums while playing, with the exception of bongos and so forth. Our sticks are extensions of our hands in that sense and are arguably our most important implements.
Equipment becomes problematic only when it serves as a destructive source of stress or as a distraction from drumming itself, namely in the form of fabricated self-consciousness that sparks feelings of inadequacy and the need to "upgrade" incessantly. Any player prone to such self-induced pressure would probably be better off devoting that energy to sharpening his technique and skillset. Great drumming translates to all gear, and it's a commodity you can't buy on Sweetwater or Musician's Friend.
roncadillac
Platinum Member
I firmly believe that how many mounts/attachments/etc you have on your bass drum impacts it's resonance, projection, and tone significantly less then simply having it sit on the ground does.
I was never a believer in risers and I've owned bass drums ranging from 16" to 28" with all of them sitting on the ground except for my most recent kit (pearl midtown) which has a thick 7/8" tube mount on the bottom for a riser, another 7/8" tube mount up top for the rack tom, and I mounted an old school style cymbal arm plus a cowbell to it and simply lifting it off the ground has caused it to be one of the most resonant, punchy, and loud bass drums I've ever owned... And it's 16". A vast majority of my other bass drums were virgin (or converted to virgin) and even the best never had so much 'life'.
I was never a believer in risers and I've owned bass drums ranging from 16" to 28" with all of them sitting on the ground except for my most recent kit (pearl midtown) which has a thick 7/8" tube mount on the bottom for a riser, another 7/8" tube mount up top for the rack tom, and I mounted an old school style cymbal arm plus a cowbell to it and simply lifting it off the ground has caused it to be one of the most resonant, punchy, and loud bass drums I've ever owned... And it's 16". A vast majority of my other bass drums were virgin (or converted to virgin) and even the best never had so much 'life'.
