The Drummer Is Always To Blame For Sound Issues

mattmc3287

Active Member
My rock band played our first full gig a few weeks back. The venue has recently completed massive renovation to add a stage, a second bar, a huge dance floor, and a couple more bathrooms. What was not included in the renovations was any kind of sound treatment to the room in which the stage is located. This room is probably 2500-3000 sq ft with 20ft metal ceiling. The walls are cinder block and the floor is concrete. There is also no PA equipment provided by the venue, just lights. We were the first full band to play in this room and it was the first our first time running our full PA setup in a little over a year. Long story short....it was a nightmare trying to get a decent mix. I muffled everything with tape (including cymbals) to the point that there was little to no tone differentiation between toms and cymbals which is exactly what you want when you spend thousands of dollars on gear and hundreds of hours practicing and tuning. Even still, the guitar player (also my brother) was constantly throwing around passive aggressive comments about how loud the drums are and that we wont be able to get the vocals loud enough without feedback (while simultaneously refusing all of my offers to help adjust levels and EQ). We were able to get a halfway decent sound after the first few songs. at least we got the vocals to come through nice and string anyway, the band sounded a bit muffled and everything but my snare was pretty much muted out front. Whatever, it was a good show and I was happy we got the vocals to cut through because that's really the most important thing.

Fast forward to last night. We were all at my house getting the practice room put back together and decided to try a different setup. Recently we have been running in ears for practice but it just hasn't been quite what we were hoping (because, you know, the drums are just too loud) So, we tried going back to the old school method of putting everything through the mains. I was exhausted and not really feeling practice as I have been rehearsing and gigging my butt off the last couple months, so I only set up hats and ride with one up and one down and played about 30% of the volume I normally do when we practice. Basically just holding tempo and the back beat. Guess what? Still couldn't hear the bass and now we couldn't hear the vocals either. I just sat there grinning whilst watching my brother fumble around trying to adjust the board having inadvertently proven that my volume is not the sole culprit for our sound problems. Also, as we were sitting around chatting afterwards everyone agreed that they dont like practicing with me playing that way... "it changes the whole feel of our band and we need your energy" Oh reeeeaaaalllly? Ya dont say...
 
Drummers often get no respect. Peace and goodwill.
 
Totally agree with Stroman. I will add that energy when playing quietly comes from accent placement, dynamics and an ability to push or pull with the beat with the hands while playing on the beat with the bass drum. It helps to use light sticks, put a towel over the bass drum or use rods/brushes to help keep the volume down.

Jazz drummers are masters of playing quietly when needed.
 
One of the most challenging things, as a drummer, is to play quietly with good energy.

You can play quietly with good energy, and to me it's less about having a specific skill you need to develop, and more about having the sort of really good control that will help you everywhere (also need cymbals that don't take too much energy to excite)... but it's going to be a different feel that may or may not fit with your musical context.

Quiet funk with appropriate energy? For sure. Quiet metal or punk rock? Not going to sound right.
 
I’ve been to a couple of jazz jams and was told my ride cymbal (Zildjian K Custom Special Dry) made hearing aids distort. I ended up playing brushes the whole time. Once the keyboardist complained my sweeping on a ballad was too loud. She was just using her keyboard speaker with no amp.
 
One of the most challenging things, as a drummer, is to play quietly with good energy.
Agreed. I am improving with that aspect of my playing in my other band. More motown type stuff just kind of lends itself to that. But playing Kickstart My Heart or Welcome to the Jungle at low volume with high energy is still a work in progress. Though, I like the general concept of stripping down the kit for practice. Forces more dynamics and creativity which is always a good exercise.
 
Totally agree with Stroman. I will add that energy when playing quietly comes from accent placement, dynamics and an ability to push or pull with the beat with the hands while playing on the beat with the bass drum. It helps to use light sticks, put a towel over the bass drum or use rods/brushes to help keep the volume down.

Jazz drummers are masters of playing quietly when needed.
I am determined to one day put intentional time and energy into developing the skills required for jazz drumming. I have much respect for jazz drummers. The grooves and tempos they can carry at low volume and the limb independence is incredible.
 
Being in a band with a family member can be a recipe for trouble. I hope it works out for you!

🙂
We've been in bands together on and off for 25 years. There have definitely been moments where I thought I just couldn't do it any longer and there have been some major altercations over the years. I'm still not sure I can continue playing with him long term, but for the time being all is well so I will just be grateful for that and enjoy the gigs as they come.
 
Precisely why I joined a sound engineer for a tour in 2006- so I could learn and not be dependant on "sound guys".

I still do sound production to this day.
 
The thing is you really can’t play rock drums properly quietly just as you cant play jazz with an acoustic piano and up right bass really loud. The correct interactions are just lost. Trying to fit a square peg in round hole is always going to lead to compromise which in turn equals dissatisfaction all around. If a fellow musician said I don’t like this cymbal or that drum I would just walk. You are being bullied and will have to take crap week on week. Life is too short.
 
The thing is you really can’t play rock drums properly quietly just as you cant play jazz with an acoustic piano and up right bass really loud. The correct interactions are just lost. Trying to fit a square peg in round hole is always going to lead to compromise which in turn equals dissatisfaction all around. If a fellow musician said I don’t like this cymbal or that drum I would just walk. You are being bullied and will have to take crap week on week. Life is too short.
Overall I think you are right.

i would say there are exceptions.

Baard Kolstadt on 'The Sky Is red' shows use aggression at quiet dynamic.

Billy Cobbham shows us loud blistering jazz.
 
One of the most challenging things, as a drummer, is to play quietly with good energy.
My old bass player blamed me for everything: Too loud, too soft, missed the stops, don't know the songs well enough...you name it.
When I asked the guitar player & singer if these issues bugged them too (assuming they heard all this), and they were confused. They had no issues with how & what I played, and they later found out the bass player just didn't like me.

So he tried to make the situation so intolerable that I'd quit, so I'd be the bad guy for leaving and not him for firing me. It all started with me being blamed for everything, so watch for that.
 
The grooves and tempos they can carry at low volume and the limb independence is incredible.

Well, it's a different thing. Playing rock stuff at really low volume can definitely be harder than high volume, whereas playing obscenely uptempo spangalang at a very high volume is... close to impossible; it just pairs with low stick height. Some things are harder to play loud, other things are harder to play soft. Being good at playing the easier-to-play-loud stuff loudly does not mean you will necessarily have an easy time playing the easier-to-play-soft stuff loudly. And being good at playing the easier-to-play-soft stuff softly does not mean you will necessarily have an easy time playing the easier-to-play-loud stuff softly.
 
Baard Kolstadt on 'The Sky Is red' shows use aggression at quiet dynamic.

Eh, I wouldn't say that's a quiet dynamic personally.

Billy Cobbham shows us loud blistering jazz.

Not to mention, of course, Buddy Rich. Jazz, and especially big band jazz, if it's a faster song, tends to sound better with more energy on the drums. It's just pretty difficult to do.
 
My old bass player blamed me for everything: Too loud, too soft, missed the stops, don't know the songs well enough...you name it.
When I asked the guitar player & singer if these issues bugged them too (assuming they heard all this), and they were confused. They had no issues with how & what I played, and they later found out the bass player just didn't like me.

So he tried to make the situation so intolerable that I'd quit, so I'd be the bad guy for leaving and not him for firing me. It all started with me being blamed for everything, so watch for that.
Boooooo for passive aggressiveness. Booooooooo!
 
Eh, I wouldn't say that's a quiet dynamic personally.



Not to mention, of course, Buddy Rich. Jazz, and especially big band jazz, if it's a faster song, tends to sound better with more energy on the drums. It's just pretty difficult to do.

The Sky Is Red

Have a look starting at 4:04

Dynamics drop to pp range

guess the question is what we mean by 'rock drums'...

my point being that all styles can be played at all dynamics convincingly...but that really is my personal interpretation as you alluded to.
 
Back
Top