Soundproofing - Acoustics In Small Spaces

ZootELoops

Senior Member
Yes, the overall concept I understand, but is it not true, if I control/diffuse the internal sound (waves) to some extent, the overall amplitude (and some frequency) would be minimized outside? Wouldn't that equate to a quieter sound (db reading)?

I am looking into the plug idea, but will probably just go withone sheet of the thickest particle-board/plywood I can find with a backing (facing the window pane) of some foam-like material (either an egg crate mattress pad or styrofoam construction board. (I do like the handle idea however and will do that for sure).

I may have an old egg crate pad in the closet that will cost me nothing - and since I've already spent about $125 on thick curtains and another $100 on the acoustic blankets, I've spent about all I am willing to - at this point. Let them complain first ;)
 

John Hile

Junior Member
jonescrusher, Decoupling can be accomplished in a few different ways.
1 - Double Stud Wall (Room within a Room)
2 - Staggered Stud Wall (2x4 Studs on 2x6 plates)
3 - Resilient Clips and Hat Channel

It is true that airspace is your friend. Keep in mind though that if you are remediating an existing wall and you want to add decoupling using Resilient Clips and Hat Channel that you have to start with a stud wall. If you add decoupling to a finishes wall you will end up with a triple leaf effect that will make the wall worse.

You want to put insulation in the cavity in the wall if it is not already there. Simple cheap Pink R-13 is fine for walls. The use of Mineral Fiber or mineral Wool as insulation costs more and will not yield any better performance I am familiar with and did check out the Auralex link and they have some great products for interior room control, but basically the only product they have for sound isolation is Sheetblock which is just 1Lb/sq.ft MLV (Mass Loaded Vinyl). For the money and performance, I would just use another layer of 5/8" drywall. (2.2lbs/sq.ft) (Heavier walls stop more sound.)

ZootELoops. You mentioned that you have a shared wall with another unit. It would be safe to assume that this is a Double Stud Wall and you would not have to decouple it again.

The things you are doing will reduce the dB level in the higher frequencies, but in the lower, not so much. A standard dB A weighted measurement will not tell you which frequencies are loud, and which are not

For your window plugs: Plywood > Plywood > Foam > Window

Foam is basically like insulation in a wall in that it absorbs mid-high frequencies. If you put the foam between the panels you will have a triple leaf (Plywood > Foam ( basically airspace) > Panel > Airspace > Window. Having 3 panels with a little airspace between is not good.

Here is a link to some really good easy to read articles on sound and sound isolation:

http://www.soundproofingcompany.com/index.php?/library/articles

I hope this helped
 

John Hile

Junior Member
Thanks

I find that sound isolation can be easily explained and great results can be attained very economically if proper thought and planning goes into your project. And I'm more than happy to help out.

Great forum!

Take care
 

ZootELoops

Senior Member
John,
I've decided that my best bet to reduce the noise leaving my house through the window is to install removable window-plugs. Given the space considerations of the existing window treatments (and the continued ability to open windows, etc), I am considering, a single 3/4 inch particle board with 1/4" weatherstripping foam to seal the side edges as well as insulate the side that butts against the glass. I have only 1 1/4" between the mini-blinds and the window, so I am unable to stack multiple boards and really make it sound-proof.

Given this scenario and your experience, realistically how much with this reduce the noise outside? I am assuming it would be better than with nothing, but not as good as multiple boards. Is it worth this step, or will this not make enough difference?
 

John Hile

Junior Member
My first though is that you should find something heavier than particle board. Mass is going to be your only defense.

Will this reduce sound transmission? Yes.

How much? I couldn't tell you for sure. The windows are the weakest link in any wall so attenuating them will have some benefit, and would be better than nothing.

Another option would be to use 3 layers of 1/4" plywood (As opposed to drywall due to durability) with 2 damping layers and that would get you even better results, and your panel would still be 3/4" total. (This is what I would do) 1/4" Plywood > Damping > 1/4" Plywood > Damping > 1/4" Plywood.

I hope this helped.

John
 

Geoff_fry01

Member
sorry if this sounds negative but sound proofing is simply NOT cheap....

MASS stops noise nothing like acoustic foam/egg crates is going to make any noticeable difference to bass frequencies...

Cheapest MASS type product you can buy is Plasterboard (Gypsum I think you guys call it? )

BUT it is not a Quick job and is not all that cheap when you start to add in green glue, ventilation, rockwool, thick fire doors then (for acoustics only, internal wall treatment)

If you are REALLY into this then get on the Johnlsayers website and start reading like mad...

I have a soundproof studio in my house (not completely soundproof but “enough” to keep the wife and neighbours happy) it was a garage conversion.. and I knew nothing about this subject till I read johnlsayers info…. BUT including builders work, flooring decor etc it cost $1000’s not $100’s…

If you want a quicker and prob cheaper price fix.. buy a Roland electric kit..

cheers
Geoff
 

ZootELoops

Senior Member
sorry if this sounds negative but sound proofing is simply NOT cheap....

MASS stops noise nothing like acoustic foam/egg crates is going to make any noticeable difference to bass frequencies...

Cheapest MASS type product you can buy is Plasterboard (Gypsum I think you guys call it? )

BUT it is not a Quick job and is not all that cheap when you start to add in green glue, ventilation, rockwool, thick fire doors then (for acoustics only, internal wall treatment)

If you are REALLY into this then get on the Johnlsayers website and start reading like mad...

I have a soundproof studio in my house (not completely soundproof but “enough” to keep the wife and neighbours happy) it was a garage conversion.. and I knew nothing about this subject till I read johnlsayers info…. BUT including builders work, flooring decor etc it cost $1000’s not $100’s…

If you want a quicker and prob cheaper price fix.. buy a Roland electric kit..

cheers
Geoff
Thanks for your candor, Geoff - but that's like saying you can't get a "sportscar" for less than $100K. I am not looking for complete sound isolation, as I explained, just tips for cheap ways to reduce the sound. .. and I already have a Roland kit.

I am not investing thousands of dollars into a separate soundproof studio - I just want to be a good neighbor.
 

John Hile

Junior Member
Hi Guys,

I also post on the Johnlsayers Forum and it is a wealth of great information. I came over to this forum as well to be able to help my fellow drummers who are comfortable here and would like to have sound isolation questions answered on this forum.

When it comes to placement of bass traps, angles and interior room treatment, I would refer to either the AVS or Johnlsayers Forums. As for answering sound isolation questions, I'm happy to help here.

Sound isolation may not be egg crate cheap, but if planned out correctly can be made economically. I've seen inexpensive, well thought out projects that perform better than those costing much, much more. It all depends on the level of sound isolation you require and planning.

I used to play on a Roland kit. They've gotten a lot better. Still, nothing like playing my Gretch!

Take care,
John
 

Geoff_fry01

Member
Thanks for your candor, Geoff - but that's like saying you can't get a "sportscar" for less than $100K. I am not looking for complete sound isolation, as I explained, just tips for cheap ways to reduce the sound. .. and I already have a Roland kit.

I am not investing thousands of dollars into a separate soundproof studio - I just want to be a good neighbor.
Like I said I really didnt want it to come over as negative... my piont is there are no other easy ways to reduce sound, other than mass... so look into the methods on the John Sayers site and try using platerboard.. its cheapish.. and works!
 

ZootELoops

Senior Member
Like I said I really didnt want it to come over as negative... my piont is there are no other easy ways to reduce sound, other than mass... so look into the methods on the John Sayers site and try using platerboard.. its cheapish.. and works!
No worries - I wish I had the space, time and money to build a separate room. Hopefully someday I can afford to live in a larger house with some land and be able to play whenever I want without disturbing my neighbors.
 

b4z

Member
I've done some soundproofing of windows that worked extremely well.
In my parents old brick house we had thick casings around the 6' tall windows. I put one layer of 1/2 drywall over the window and against the wooden window molding around the window. Then caulked it so it was airtight. Since the casing and walls were so thick I got 2x2s and built a frame about 1" from the first layer of drywall and nailed another layer of 1/2" drywall to that and caulked it so it was airtight.. No part of the second layer of drywall or 2X2s were touching the first layer.
They were decoupled except fot the sill and window casing.

My neighbor said they could hear some thumping and that was it. They figured I had started to play drums again but weren't sure. They couldn't hear cymbals, toms or snare.

The problem was the room was so small (8x12)that it was too loud for me and I ended up with towels on the toms and snare. The china would about take my head off.
Sold the set a few months later.
 

Trip McNealy

Gold Member
I've done some soundproofing of windows that worked extremely well.
In my parents old brick house we had thick casings around the 6' tall windows. I put one layer of 1/2 drywall over the window and against the wooden window molding around the window. Then caulked it so it was airtight. Since the casing and walls were so thick I got 2x2s and built a frame about 1" from the first layer of drywall and nailed another layer of 1/2" drywall to that and caulked it so it was airtight.. No part of the second layer of drywall or 2X2s were touching the first layer.
They were decoupled except fot the sill and window casing.

My neighbor said they could hear some thumping and that was it. They figured I had started to play drums again but weren't sure. They couldn't hear cymbals, toms or snare.

The problem was the room was so small (8x12)that it was too loud for me and I ended up with towels on the toms and snare. The china would about take my head off.
Sold the set a few months later.
I'll have to give that a try! My drum room is 12x11.

You NEED to wear earplugs in a room like that regardless!!! I won't even dare play my kick drum without putting in earplugs first!
 

jim

Junior Member
you could always fill your bassdrum up completely with pillows/blankets etc to lower the volume,its helped me get on with the neighbours better,it might not sound as nice but its a small compromise and you get used to the sound after a while,drywall is the only other solution that has worked for my drum room.
i could do with some advice on ventilation if anyone has any ideas.
 
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