Sorta disappointed in what I hear out there...

picodon

Silver Member
Too amazing to be appreciated by the majority of drummers and ignored by many who FEAR people like him, specially if they are kids... was 8 on the video and now is 13 and is amazing!
Alex you lost me completely there, I don't get how you associate fear with music. I'm glad for any 13 yr old or 8 yr old to be amazing and if these kids were already in the pocket in the womb, burying their moms heartbeat click, I couldn't agree more with that and fear is undoubtedly the very last emotion that that would invoke in me. I wish my parents had bought me a kit at that early age.

Having said that, I totally understand Bo's criticism of showing off, as if music were a contest. The way I'm reading his post is, in the end I don't think he was criticizing anyone in person, "chops drummers" or anything specifically drum related per se. It's that nasty self promotion through social media that I can't stand either, which spreads like a cancer and which is why I deleted my facebook account years ago. If anyone needs a flame suit to criticize that, that means we've been much more facebooked already than we think.
 

Alex Sanguinetti

Silver Member
Alex you lost me completely there, I don't get how YOU associate fear with music. I'm glad for any 13 yr old or 8 yr old to be amazing and if these kids were already in the pocket in the womb, burying their moms heartbeat click, I couldn't agree more with that and fear is undoubtedly the very last emotion that that would invoke in me. I wish my parents had bought me a kit at that early age.
I didn´t say I (me) was in fear, I KNOW a ton of drummers are. I don´t know you and I of course I wasn´t talking about you...and I also wasn¨t talking about Bo of course.

I myself love the kid and watch and COLLECT every clip from him I see.

Have you read the message? do you play? do you play professionally?

Best regards!
 

Erberderber

Senior Member
I didn´t say I (me) was in fear, I KNOW a ton of drummers are. I don´t know you and I of course I wasn´t talking about you...and I also wasn¨t talking about Bo of course.

I myself love the kid and watch and COLLECT every clip from him I see.

Have you read the message? do you play? do you play professionally?

Best regards!
Hi Alex, I think you misunderstood Picodon's point. He didn't say you were in fear, he said that you associate fear with music, which is a totally different thing. Picodon didn't understand the way you think some musicians fear other musicians. Of course some people feel inferior when they see musicians far more competent than them, but it's not fear.

I agree with Picodon that fear should not be associated with music. Music is an art (subjective) and should therefore be enjoyed, appreciated, criticized, and developed, but not feared. It is not a sport (objective).
 
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Alex Sanguinetti

Silver Member
Hi Alex, I think you misunderstood Picodon's point. He didn't say you were in fear, he said that you associate fear with music, which is a totally different thing. Picodon didn't understand the way you think some musicians fear other musicians. Of course some people feel inferior when they see musicians far more competent than them, but it's not fear.

I agree with Picodon that fear should not be associated with music. Music is an art (subjective) and should therefore be enjoyed, appreciated, criticized, and developed, but not feared. It is not a sport (objective).
I don´t think music should be associated with fear (unlless you made me listen to most bands, joke, but really serious at the same time, they hurt my ears), but reality is something else...
 

Vandalay

Member
I guess I'm what a lot of people call a "boring drummer"; I strive to stay in the pocket, my fills aren't flashy, I have a simple one-up one-down set. when I play at open mics, I see guys trying desperately trying to be Carter Beauford or Neil Peart, while I try to be Hal Blaine..

I totally agree about drum videos on social media. Many of them seem to have a "if you can't play this 15/8 groove, you're not a drummer" vibe to them. I watch them and wonder "when are you gonna actually use that?" I don't have the experience many of you do, but I don't remember drumming being a competition.
 

Jml

Senior Member
I guess I'm what a lot of people call a "boring drummer"; I strive to stay in the pocket, my fills aren't flashy, I have a simple one-up one-down set. when I play at open mics, I see guys trying desperately trying to be Carter Beauford or Neil Peart, while I try to be Hal Blaine..

I totally agree about drum videos on social media. Many of them seem to have a "if you can't play this 15/8 groove, you're not a drummer" vibe to them. I watch them and wonder "when are you gonna actually use that?" I don't have the experience many of you do, but I don't remember drumming being a competition.
Agree 100%. I always thought the job of a drummer is to keep time and serve the song. I don’t drum to be Neil Peart or John Bonham. I drum because I enjoy it and I like music. Everything else is just noise.
 

GetAgrippa

Platinum Member
Well ya got yer laypeople in the audience and ya got yer musicians. The later listen to different elements than the former. There's a lot more of the former and they like it when a drummer pulls off slick chops-because I guess they don't know better LOL. They can be terrible all evening but pull off a slick solo for the save. Now probably most of your bread and butter gigging drummers are keeping time-playing their part so that you don't notice them but there are some "famous" players , we all know, who just scream "LOOK AT ME" (and hot dang I agree) and oddly enough most of the gigging drummers are always talking about these more famous players with all the slick moves. It's a heck of a predicament. Seems to me each have their place-there are more bread and butter-and everybody can't be famous-and what would gigging drummer have to take about , So it all seems to work.
 

beyondbetrayal

Platinum Member
I think the chops / groove issue is there are many types of drummers. Are you trying to play in a band, or are you trying to get likes and followers on instagram/youtube. I love watching chops, but when I listen to music it needs to be tasteful and in the right spot. I feel a song of groove and a drummer pulling out a tasty lick at an appropriate spot is much better than a guy displacing beats and playing in his own time signature for half the song. At the same time, I love seeing people able to do that over a backing track MEANT for it.

Playing 2 and 4 isn't boring if the song calls for it. If you are in a techdeathmetal band it might be. Everything in context. I wouldn't want to hear a jazz drummer not do any comping for an hour either.

Rather than chops I prefer "texture". Try playing with new sounds you can get out of the kit and creativity.
 
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JosephDAqui

Silver Member
Bo, I just read your original post and I couldn't agree more. You're approaching the instrument as musician, not as a "ham" looking for likes or attention. Social media has only made the problem more large-scale and far reaching.

I remember being a dumb kid in a prog-metal band (80's) doing crazy things in crazy time signatures/changes and I was even a teacher. I figured out later that I was a terrible timekeeper, musician and overplayed to disgusting degrees. Once I heard Tony Thompson play in the Powerstation, I stopped what I was doing and re-learned how to play - small kit, click track and R&B band, and I'm so glad I did.

Fast forward to today - I play for an original hardcore metal act, and I see a lot of kids just play their instrument for other drummers in the audience and not the song - working too hard to impress the drum geeks in the audience (we have opening bands - mostly guys in their 20's and 30's).

Honestly, I could care less what the drum geek thinks, I care about the people grooving, moving, headbanging or in the mosh pit feeling what we are feeling as a cohesive unit. If regular, non-musicians like what we are doing I'm happy, if other musicians like it, even better.

I really hope for the future, that at least some of our younger counterparts will learn from their mistakes (like I did) and focus on the groove first.
 

TMe

Senior Member
I think the chops / groove issue is there are many types of drummers.
Exac-a-lac-tly.

When I hear people putting down drummers, musicians, whatever, they're usually pointing out what the person is NOT doing. That doesn't make sense. Why would I criticize a drummer for not being able to play tuba? If a groove drummer plays a good groove, I'm not going to criticize him or her for not having a ton of flashy chops. Similarly, I'm not going to criticize a chops meister for not having a great groove. In a perfect world, we'd all have both. And we'd all be able to play tuba. Such a cool instrument. Why don't we hear more tuba and less electric bass? But I digress.
 

donzo74

Junior Member
When I hear people putting down drummers, musicians, whatever, they're usually pointing out what the person is NOT doing
Yeah, I can remember back in high school getting to listen to the judges tapes from our marching band competitions. The best judges would listen and grade you on what you actually played and did during your performance. The worst judges would always point out things you could have done but didn't and things they think you should have done. It seemed like they were deducting points just because your book wasn't scored the way they would have written it rather than objectively evaluating what you did play and whether it was clean or not.

In a perfect world,...we'd all be able to play tuba

And I did get to play SOME tuba in HS. One part of one song that only required using one valve. Nailed it! =)
 

Channing

Member
For me personally, most of the videos I post on my Instagram are videos of me attempting drum solos. Like, it’s just me in my practice room, so I’m going to play some wacky thing I’d never play onstage or with my band(s). So if you just watched my insta videos it would give you a completely different idea of my playing than what you’d get if you went to one of my shows. I consider myself a ‘pocket drummer’ rather than a ‘chops drummer’ and anyone who’s ever played in a band or jammed with me would agree, however, my Instagram doesn’t really reflect that at all. I’m starting to get a couple videos of me with my bands on stage playing real music though, so that’s probably good. But the ones of me just playing random licks in my practice room are just that. They’re not music.
 
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