Scouting for new hats.

Winston_Wolf

Platinum Member
Zambizzi, have you considered pairing a hat bottom with a crash cymbal? The biggest issue I've found with Sabian's hi hats lately is the top cymbals are just too heavy for my tastes.

I've had really good results with an HH Sound Control crash and AAX Studio crash as top cymbals. For me the thinner tops with a med-heavy or heavy bottom sound great and are pretty versatile.
 

zambizzi

Platinum Member
Zambizzi, have you considered pairing a hat bottom with a crash cymbal? The biggest issue I've found with Sabian's hi hats lately is the top cymbals are just too heavy for my tastes.

I've had really good results with an HH Sound Control crash and AAX Studio crash as top cymbals. For me the thinner tops with a med-heavy or heavy bottom sound great and are pretty versatile.
Yeah, I had the same complaint. When I first got into Sabian cymbals, I bought the Groove Hats. I thought they sounded excellent but they felt like crap under the sticks and hi-hat pedal...the top is manhole cover thick. This is why I ended up w/ the AAX X-Celerators. They have a classic sound and the top is thin.

I didn't get a chance to play the Fusion Hats before buying, just going based on the Sabian sound clips. I'm praying that the top isn't a thick one, even though it's described as "Medium".
 

MikeM

Platinum Member
Yeah, I had the same complaint. When I first got into Sabian cymbals, I bought the Groove Hats. I thought they sounded excellent but they felt like crap under the sticks and hi-hat pedal...the top is manhole cover thick.
FWIW, I've noticed the same thing. I played on a friends AAX Stage hats 10 years ago and absolutely loved them, so a couple years ago I bought (ordered online) my own pair. I only owned them for about a week before sending them back for just that reason. Then a couple months ago, I was playing on someone else's kit with AAX Stage hats that were very old looking and they were excellent - not too heavy, very responsive, felt good under stick and foot... I don't get what Sabian has done with their formulas.
 

zambizzi

Platinum Member
FWIW, I've noticed the same thing. I played on a friends AAX Stage hats 10 years ago and absolutely loved them, so a couple years ago I bought (ordered online) my own pair. I only owned them for about a week before sending them back for just that reason. Then a couple months ago, I was playing on someone else's kit with AAX Stage hats that were very old looking and they were excellent - not too heavy, very responsive, felt good under stick and foot... I don't get what Sabian has done with their formulas.
Yeah...really strange, given the trend toward "vintage" these days - thinner, darker *everything*.
 

Deathmetalconga

Platinum Member
I listened to the recording and I think your hats are too dark and don't cut enough. Maybe some of it has to do with the recording, as the guitars seemed low in the mix as well. I use a Yamaha Pocketrak for practice recordings and it tends to overemphasize the highs. A good studio recording, or hearing them live, is the only way to know for sure. But those are my thoughts.
 

zambizzi

Platinum Member
I listened to the recording and I think your hats are too dark and don't cut enough. Maybe some of it has to do with the recording, as the guitars seemed low in the mix as well. I use a Yamaha Pocketrak for practice recordings and it tends to overemphasize the highs. A good studio recording, or hearing them live, is the only way to know for sure. But those are my thoughts.
Ya think? From behind the kit, they're much, much too bright. What prompted me to find something else was some of the recordings I had been going over, where the hats are just too prominent. It's not volume necessarily, I can play them lightly...it's a question of tone. I played some Istanbul Mehmet hats w/ these guys (house kit) and they were much darker, yet still cutting. That struck me as a great sound, right away.

Now, the top is pretty thin on the AAX X-Celerators, which lends them to being a little "slushy" sometimes, and not as articulate and crisp as I'd like. Is that what you're hearing, maybe?

These hats don't sound dark to me, at all, but like you said - the recording doesn't tell the whole tale. This was recorded in a very bass-heavy, small room, using a Zoom H2 recorder.
 

Winston_Wolf

Platinum Member
I agree the Xcelerators sound too bright and cutting for what you're working on now, but I think the only way you're going to find something noticeably darker is to go thinner on the top cymbal or larger than 14". Or both.
 

Deathmetalconga

Platinum Member
Ya think? From behind the kit, they're much, much too bright. What prompted me to find something else was some of the recordings I had been going over, where the hats are just too prominent. It's not volume necessarily, I can play them lightly...it's a question of tone. I played some Istanbul Mehmet hats w/ these guys (house kit) and they were much darker, yet still cutting. That struck me as a great sound, right away.

Now, the top is pretty thin on the AAX X-Celerators, which lends them to being a little "slushy" sometimes, and not as articulate and crisp as I'd like. Is that what you're hearing, maybe?

These hats don't sound dark to me, at all, but like you said - the recording doesn't tell the whole tale. This was recorded in a very bass-heavy, small room, using a Zoom H2 recorder.
I think the solution is to have someone else sit behind your kit during a practice and you listen - if someone can at least bang out something simple enough for you to get an idea. As you know, everything sounds much different behind the set and the only way to know for yourself is to hear for yourself.
 

mrbling

Silver Member
could always have tried my AAX-celerators in filthy finish :p

sound pretty good with their patina building up mellower than a new set for sure. not too keen on sabians nowdays despite being in love with them in my early days so cant help with subjective input but good to see youve got a pair on the way
 

zambizzi

Platinum Member
I think the solution is to have someone else sit behind your kit during a practice and you listen - if someone can at least bang out something simple enough for you to get an idea. As you know, everything sounds much different behind the set and the only way to know for yourself is to hear for yourself.
Oh I have...I've had these hats for 3 yrs. I've heard YOU play them. Haha! I still think they're way too bright for old school funky music. I just listened back to the clip I posted here...it's definitely not representative of their true sound.
 

Spectron

Silver Member
some cool groovin' there man....

I agree, you need meatier sounding hats, darker with a hint of trash....

14 hhx/ hhx legacy
14 Meinl Byzance dark
14 Zildjian regular k's
14" K special Dry hats
Istanbul ....

Lot's of choices...BTW those aax's sound pretty good to me
a little too "pretty" if you know what I mean....needs more dirt...

Those istanbul
 

zambizzi

Platinum Member
some cool groovin' there man....

I agree, you need meatier sounding hats, darker with a hint of trash....

14 hhx/ hhx legacy
14 Meinl Byzance dark
14 Zildjian regular k's
14" K special Dry hats
Istanbul ....

Lot's of choices...BTW those aax's sound pretty good to me
a little too "pretty" if you know what I mean....needs more dirt...

Those istanbul
Thanks! Right...yes...more dirt, more trash. I think I'll get cut PLUS that w/ the HHX Fusion hats that I ordered. I'll know in a couple of days. ;)
 

Solaris

Silver Member
Good luck with the Fusions Zambizzi, would be keen how they sound. We have the 13 and 14 AAXs at work and I have to say I'm not a big fan of how bright they are.

It's a bit late to chime in my two cents, but I would have suggested checking out the HHX Stage hats and the Evo hats. We have a pair of stages at work, and I'm thinking I should have gone with those over my HHX X-celerators. They are much more mellow and warm than the X-celerators, which can be a little too crisp at times. They have the slightest bit of trash to them as well which sits beautifully when playing on them half open, but are also articulate and tight, great for fancy foot work in funk grooves.
 

zambizzi

Platinum Member
They arrived while I was home for lunch, today. Awesomeness! I gave them a little test run before heading back to work. The top is as thin as the AAX X-Celerator top that I have, so that was a relief. The bottom is unlathed, unfinished, and THICK. It's hammered, so it's not wildly bright, and there are two extra holes drilled on the outer-edge of the bell so there's no air-lock effect.

They're HHX, all the way...dark, bright, complex, cutting AND subtle. In other words, they're versatile. I like them a lot! I can't wait to set them up on my kit and get them recorded, to see how they sound with everything else.

Thanks again Shane! They shipped out very fast and they're perfect...and cheaper than I could find them anywhere else (including eBay.)
 
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