Regarding the use of metronome.

Chinmay147

Well-known member
Hello everyone! Thanks for your help with my earlier snare drum issue. I'm a beginner drummer, as you all know. I've been trying to practice 5 stroke roll. But now this is a odd sounding rudiment and thus I'm unsure of how do I use my metronome for practicing it. Should I use quarter, eighth or sixteenth notes for practicing it? Please help. Warm regards!
 
Does this video help?
It might help to play Singles first:
Code:
1+2+3+4+
RLR LRL
Then you can switch between that and the 5 stroke roll with doubles:
Code:
1e+a2e+a3e+a4e+a
RRLLR   LLRRL
As you're just learning it, I'd try all three metronome settings as you'll stay slow and want to pay attention to the placement of the second strokes of the doubles. Also start with the left hand!
Another helpful variation would be dotted quarter notes:
Code:
1e+a2e+a3e+a4e+a1e+a2e+a3e+a4e+a...
R LLRRL RRLLR LLRRL RRLLR LLRRL ...
That should prepare you for triplets which you could practice with this piece (doubles for unaccented notes): http://www.cruiseshipdrummer.com/2017/06/three-camps-isolated-parts-and-complete.html
 

MrInsanePolack

Platinum Member
I use quarter note. That's all I ever set the metronome to. I'll use half note if the song is in 3. I find it easier to listen to the least amount of beeps possible. I cant imagine trying to play a five stroke roll with 16 beeps going on.
 

Chinmay147

Well-known member
Does this video help?
It might help to play Singles first:
Code:
1+2+3+4+
RLR LRL
Then you can switch between that and the 5 stroke roll with doubles:
Code:
1e+a2e+a3e+a4e+a
RRLLR   LLRRL
As you're just learning it, I'd try all three metronome settings as you'll stay slow and want to pay attention to the placement of the second strokes of the doubles. Also start with the left hand!
Another helpful variation would be dotted quarter notes:
Code:
1e+a2e+a3e+a4e+a1e+a2e+a3e+a4e+a...
R LLRRL RRLLR LLRRL RRLLR LLRRL ...
That should prepare you for triplets which you could practice with this piece (doubles for unaccented notes): http://www.cruiseshipdrummer.com/2017/06/three-camps-isolated-parts-and-complete.html
Thanks. So when we play a five stroke roll suppose in quarter notes , how many five stroke fir in it? I opted for a new coach and he said these are odd sounding rolls. So when you play it in quarter notes, 5 number of 5 stroke rolls fit in it. I didn't understand the concept. Can you please elaborate on this?
 
You can play different rhythms with a five stroke roll. This is the standard version but don't stop there: http://www.pas.org/docs/default-source/default-document-library/pasdrumrudiments2015e3ccc06de1726e19ba7fff00008669d1.pdf?sfvrsn=0
A 5 stroke roll consists of 5 strokes, so in that example, one 5 stroke roll fits into a quarter note and it's played as four 32nd notes and one accented eight note. In the second example I posted above it's the same thing but in half time: four 16th notes and one accented quarter note.
Do you know how to read and count rhythms? Counting 1+2+3+4+ and 1e+a2e+a... loudly while playing? That's extremely helpful when learning things from various sources.
 

Chinmay147

Well-known member
You can play different rhythms with a five stroke roll. This is the standard version but don't stop there: http://www.pas.org/docs/default-source/default-document-library/pasdrumrudiments2015e3ccc06de1726e19ba7fff00008669d1.pdf?sfvrsn=0
A 5 stroke roll consists of 5 strokes, so in that example, one 5 stroke roll fits into a quarter note and it's played as four 32nd notes and one accented eight note. In the second example I posted above it's the same thing but in half time: four 16th notes and one accented quarter note.
Do you know how to read and count rhythms? Counting 1+2+3+4+ and 1e+a2e+a... loudly while playing? That's extremely helpful when learning things from various sources.
Ok will try counting aloud while playing. But is it necessary for 5 number of 5 stroke rolls to fit one bar of quarter notes to make it sound odd ?
 
I'm not sure what your teacher means by "odd" - odd as in odd meter or as in strange?
The basic version isn't odd. The primary rhythm is 1e+ 2e+ 3e+ 4e+ and the strokes on the numbers and the es are doubled which gives you 32nd notes. You can build all kinds of rhythms that consist of 5 notes and fit into one quarter note.
Here are some examples of 5 note rhythms that take up one quarter note:
fives.png
Do you understand this notation? The triplets and quintuplets are probably confusing since you're new to drumming and not all rhythms are that important - it's just an illustration. Ask your teacher about notation or read up on it if you're unfamiliar with it - it's not hard once you understand the basics and it's extremely helpful: https://www.musical-u.com/learn/get-rhythm-notate-it/ :)
 

Hewitt2

Senior Member
You should get the igoe lifetime series which will build competency in and understanding of double stroke rolls. In addition to the 5 stroke roll, there is also the 7, 9, 10 etc. all of which are interrelated.
 

Chinmay147

Well-known member
I'm not sure what your teacher means by "odd" - odd as in odd meter or as in strange?
The basic version isn't odd. The primary rhythm is 1e+ 2e+ 3e+ 4e+ and the strokes on the numbers and the es are doubled which gives you 32nd notes. You can build all kinds of rhythms that consist of 5 notes and fit into one quarter note.
Here are some examples of 5 note rhythms that take up one quarter note:
View attachment 95044
Do you understand this notation? The triplets and quintuplets are probably confusing since you're new to drumming and not all rhythms are that important - it's just an illustration. Ask your teacher about notation or read up on it if you're unfamiliar with it - it's not hard once you understand the basics and it's extremely helpful: https://www.musical-u.com/learn/get-rhythm-notate-it/ :)
Thanks for the notation,I'll try to play it and upload the link here in the reply. Please check it once and let me know if I have understood it and played it correctly. Thanks once again
 
No worries - but don't try to play the whole thing from beginning to end as it was more a question whether you can read rhythms. Just try to repeat one 5 note rhythm that covers a quarter note. The first 5 notes that cover the first quarter note is your basic 5 stroke roll as defined by the PAS: RRLLR LLRRL (the accent is written as bold). The second one is also very common: RLLRR LRRLL.
 
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mrfingers

Senior Member
If your learning it and not using the 5 stroke roll in a musical context(how many fit into measures, etc.) just set your metronome to quarter notes without accents and a speed of choice(bpm) then go. Fitting rolls into musical context is not a metronome use, in my opinion.
 

Chinmay147

Well-known member
No worries - but don't try to play the whole thing from beginning to end as it was more a question whether you can read rhythms. Just try to repeat one 5 note rhythm that covers a quarter note. The first 5 notes that cover the first quarter note is your basic 5 stroke roll as defined by the PAS: RRLLR LLRRL (the accent is written as bold). The second one is also very common: RLLRR LRRLL.
Hi was busy with work. Will do your exercise and get back to you soon
 

Otto

Platinum Member
best work/ability pay off I have had with a metronome is to put it at the fastest subdivision that I am playing at(usually 16th notes or 16th note triplets) then play along with the metronome volume fairly quiet...record both the 'nome and my playing, and try my best to 'bury' the click(that is, have my playing be right on top of the click so I can only hear what I'm playing).

once you get so you can rarely hear the click flaming with your strikes, start playing ahead then behind it so the click peeks out.

I think Voctor Wooten talks about this?..I like to mention it as I wish I would have been exposed to the concept when I was much younger.

Whats funny is that I didnt like how I sounded when I got real accurate...but I was better able to control the cyclicity of my internal pulse within the metronomic pulse after a lot more effort-leading me to a feel I am much happier with.

be careful...you might master what you practice!
 
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