Rebadging Drums

MrInsanePolack

Platinum Member
When, in your opinion, is it okay to rebadge a drum/drums? Obviously to try and scam anyone is a no no. But what about a drum that doesn't exist. For example, if I wanted any other size drum for my Midtown kit, there aren't any. But Export has tons of sizes. Roadshow has some different ones also. Would changing the badge to match be wrong or no?

Or say you have a vintage kit that is missing a drum. An exact replica is built from parts. Is it allowed the "correct" badge?

I'm out to lunch on this. Part of me says who cares, and the rest says liar! Thoughts?
 

alparrott

Platinum Member
When, in your opinion, is it okay to rebadge a drum/drums? Obviously to try and scam anyone is a no no. But what about a drum that doesn't exist. For example, if I wanted any other size drum for my Midtown kit, there aren't any. But Export has tons of sizes. Roadshow has some different ones also. Would changing the badge to match be wrong or no?

Or say you have a vintage kit that is missing a drum. An exact replica is built from parts. Is it allowed the "correct" badge?

I'm out to lunch on this. Part of me says who cares, and the rest says liar! Thoughts?
Me personally, I wouldn't rebadge. The drum is what the drum is, and the badge is a stamp of authenticity IMO.

In your example, I definitely wouldn't rebadge because you'd be trying to pass off one budget drum as another, which to me is like putting a Coors Light label on a bottle of Bud Light. What exactly is being proven?

I have an actual set of Ludwig Standards that I rehabbed, to which I added a floor tom. I put a decently matching wrap and Standard lugs on a Ludwig 3-ply shell from approximately the same era that came with a Keystone badge and classic lugs. It never in a million years even occurred to me to put a Ludwig Standard badge on it.
 

MrInsanePolack

Platinum Member
In your example, I definitely wouldn't rebadge because you'd be trying to pass off one budget drum as another, which to me is like putting a Coors Light label on a bottle of Bud Light. What exactly is being proven?
Hahaha that's a great analogy! I have no plans on growing the kit anymore, it was just an example. It has a badgeless MIJ tom of unknown origins. It's gonna stay that way. Cymbals are another story.

I want a case of Bud Light in Coors Light cans so I can see if anyone even notices.
 

beatdat

Senior Member
I agree with alparrott. If it's just for you and you don't intend to sell them, then it's probably not a problem. But, if you were to sell them... well, you're pretty much asking to be sued for passing-off and/or trademark infringement.
 

GruntersDad

Administrator - Mayor
Staff member
I have a Gretsch Renown kit and a Catalina Maple 16 inch floor tom. Why in the world would I go to the go to the trouble of finding/buying 2 Renown Maple badges. what would a reason be. It just doesnt matter. God forbid I bought your re-badged drum and found out about it later.!!!!
 

JohnPloughman

Silver Member
My own opinion.

I don't care if it is for "yourself". A forgery is a forgery. You …… whomever the "you" may be... will not live forever. In all likelihood, "you" will get offed suddenly, without any sort of planning or the wrinkled skin of old age. Subsequent to that, a host of strangers will be pawing over your drums at an estate sale, yard sale, or they will be given to a family member or … truth is the person they are left to, most likely wont be keeping them. That person will know a lot less about them than "you."

Exports are the subject of the original post. However... this trends to a lot of different things. A Ringo bowling ball Jazzfest is a right pricey item. Lots of guys have made clones. A Rogers Dyna-Sonic wood is a right pricey item. Lots of guys have made clones. Many of those drums have all correct parts. A shell that might be more or less correct, and edges that can range from good to hideous. All of that to get a look. I have seen one of those end up in the hands of a person who spend real money for a 500.00 build. "You" went all out and made it look like a real one in every respect. "You" die. Someone less than expert puts your drum value at $3000.00... and it sells to someone who really is an expert... or not... and it sells again and eventually.. someone who can spot a fake knows "you" built a fake drum and it got passed off as real.

I hate clones. Build what you must, but at least brand it as a replica internally to reduce future confusion.
 

GetAgrippa

Platinum Member
Wow rebadging Drums-I love the concept. The perfect treatment for GAS-like methadone. Tired of your cheap ole piece of crap drum kit well upgrade for a fraction of the cost by simply changing "badges"-maybe wraps too. Course you need to do it double blind-so get a friend to change badges and wraps for you-even better. That way you will not have done anything unethical and you get a brand new high end drum kit to boot ;) I don't think y'all are seeing the upside to this. A treatment for GAS-it's inexpensive-heck I bet insurance will cover it.
 
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lsits

Gold Member
I don't know about re-badging the actual drums, But I think that a bass drum head that just had the word "Kirkland" would be pretty cool. I wonder if Costco would get upset about it?
 

KEEF

Senior Member
My ocd would mean I HAD to have matching badges...if ever I went to sell i would simply offer full disclosure:
"xyz tom is non- original, badged to match"

Don't see any issue as long as you're honest about it.
 

mikyok

Platinum Member
If the brand matches that's all I'm fussed about. More OCD about period specific badges. My luddy has every badge from 66 - 82 (84 if I include the 402 which has a large keystone Chicago badge).

It's not getting sold anytime soon, not really worth that much anyway. It's my project.
 

PorkPieGuy

Platinum Member
I heard of a sort-of local guy who was taking lower-middle-line kits, exchanging the hardware between them, and then he got his own custom badges made with his "company's" name on them and sold them as "custom" drums. Horrible.

Anyways, in your scenario, part of me is like "Do whatever you want; they're your drums. If you sell them, offer full disclosure."

However, what happens AFTER you sell them to someone and then he/she decides to sell them? Would the next owner give full disclosure?

Then I thought, maybe you could take a ballpoint pen and write on the inside of the shell something like "This shell is a _______ shell made by _______ company. It has been rebadged to match _____________ drum set. The original color was _____________." Then sign your name and date. Even if you do that, someone could paint over it or hide it with coated drum heads.

You could always rebadge it, play it, and then when it comes time to sell the whole drum set, list the drums and the tom separately and restore the tom back to its original color, lugs, etc. You could list the set on CL and then put the tom on Reverb.

If it were me, I'd just play a mismatched kit.

Just a thought.
 

KEEF

Senior Member
I heard of a sort-of local guy who was taking lower-middle-line kits, exchanging the hardware between them, and then he got his own custom badges made with his "company's" name on them and sold them as "custom" drums. Horrible.
That's just wrong....and I hope he got what was coming to him!

However, what happens AFTER you sell them to someone and then he/she decides to sell them? Would the next owner give full disclosure?
Then the morality issue of being honest passes to the 'next owner' - you've done the right thing, you can't be held responsible for other peoples deceptions further down the line?
 

GetAgrippa

Platinum Member
I tell you fellas/gals you make me feel better about the world with all the "honesty" concerns. This is a global website so a pulse. Just when I thought "altruism" dead in the world I can come to DW and read about someone receiving "free cymbals" or "drums given away" and then too high standards of "honesty and integrity". I wish you would all run for some political office we need such high standards across the globe. Something as simple as a "drum badge".
 

AzHeat

Platinum Member
Then the morality issue of being honest passes to the 'next owner' - you've done the right thing, you can't be held responsible for other peoples deceptions further down the line?
Yup, this is like donating to charity. You’re responsible for making sure the organization does what you think they do. When you donate, if someone makes off with the cash or donated item after the fact, it’s on them.
 

T.Underhill

Pioneer Member
By most logic presented here no one should ever re-wrap a drum to match a kit because the 3rd owner after you suddenly keel over might get confused and sell it as a legitimate black oyster or blue onyx drum. Gimme a break. If you're not trying to rip anyone off as saying it's 100% authentic, this is not an ethical dilemma.

Same applies to custom and vintage cars. You how many SS, RT, and GT clones there are worldwide? They may or may not have the same drivetrain and interior to match performance and look. It's on a buyer to check "numbers matching", build sheet, and whatever else.

Personally I don't see the point in re-badging to match other badges as long as the style and color relatively matches. Grommets are a hassle and it doesn't raise the drum's value.
 

Lee-Bro

Senior Member
Same applies to custom and vintage cars. You how many SS, RT, and GT clones there are worldwide? They may or may not have the same drivetrain and interior to match performance and look. It's on a buyer to check "numbers matching", build sheet, and whatever else.
Except that vehicles are registered property. Putting Camaro body kit and badges on a Chevette doesn't make it a Camaro and the title/registration will still stay Chevette.

There are MANY unscrupulous people out there making counterfeit vintage drums and guitars right now, not to mention counterfeit current high-end gear too. I think rebadging is the same as counterfeiting.

Swapping lugs out so you have a more uniform look is one thing*, but taking what is essentially the "registration" off and putting another one is like rolling back the mileage or trying to hide the fact that a car has a salvage title.

*I have a couple Tama Rockstar toms in Dark Blue finish that is the same as my Granstar II kit. I put Granstar lugs on the Rockstars so they would match, will re-install the Rockstar lugs if I ever sell them, did NOT swap badges, and because I'm meticulous, my gear inventory has notes about the lug swap.
 

Smoke

Silver Member
Yeesh - can't remember the last time I did a drum badge verification check on some kit onstage. Why not get a nice piece of smooth aluminum (aluminium) sheet metal, cut it to the *exact* shape of your original badges, polish it up nice and glue it on with a dab of hot glue.

Nobody would EVER notice from the dance floor, and if you ever got called on it, it would be a huge laugh - a naked drum badge. "You got me, it's my Earle Downtown tom. Good luck finding another."
 

jack wilson

Junior Member
By most logic presented here no one should ever re-wrap a drum to match a kit because the 3rd owner after you suddenly keel over might get confused and sell it as a legitimate black oyster or blue onyx drum. Gimme a break. If you're not trying to rip anyone off as saying it's 100% authentic, this is not an ethical dilemma.

Same applies to custom and vintage cars. You how many SS, RT, and GT clones there are worldwide? They may or may not have the same drivetrain and interior to match performance and look. It's on a buyer to check "numbers matching", build sheet, and whatever else.

Personally I don't see the point in re-badging to match other badges as long as the style and color relatively matches. Grommets are a hassle and it doesn't raise the drum's value.
I agree with you. Perhaps a lot of oddities, but they definitely don’t raise values :) My friend bought a homemade drum from an apprentice, a cheap barrel was very urgently needed. As a result, it did not look very good, but it sounded as it should, as required :)
P.S. Your avatar is beautiful!
 
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