math help with triplets

bud7h4

Silver Member
Just want to make sure I have this right -

32nd note triplets (Edit: I meant16th triplets) are 1.5 times the speed of 16th notes played in the same tempo.

What is the 16th note bpm equivalent of 16th note triplets played at 180 bpm?
In other words, you're playing 16th triplets on the kicks, now continue at that foot speed and turn the triplets into 16th notes. What would be your bpm?

I say 270, since the 16th triplets you were playing are 1.5 times the speed of your 16th notes.

180 x 1.5 = 270
 
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Boomka

Platinum Member
I think you've got your subdivisions mixed up and, therefore, your premises are faulty. Sixteenth-note-triplets are 1.5x the speed of 16th notes. This is always the relationship between the duple version of a subdivision and its triplet counterpart. Your second premise is similarly false because 32nd note triplets would actually be 1.5x faster than 32nd notes at the same tempo. Perhaps an easier way is to illustrate this by the rate of subdivisions (i.e. the number of notes) per beat.

32nd note triplets are 12 notes per beat.
32nd notes are 8 notes per beat.
16th note triplets are 6 notes per beat.
16th notes are 4 notes per beat.

Given that, to answer your question as it is:

180x12 = 2160

2160/4 = 540

540 BPM

But, I'm pretty sure you mean "16th note triplets" and not "32nd note triplets" based on the proportions you're using.

Assuming I'm right, the calculation with the correct rates/proportions is:

180x6 = 1080

1080/4 = 270

270 BPM


Lemme guess: this has has something to do with single stroke, or double pedal, speed.
 
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bud7h4

Silver Member
Lemme guess: this has has something to do with single stroke, or double pedal, speed.
Correct. My metronome doesn't go above 260 bpm so I'm practicing 32nds between 120 and 135 bpm.

But I'm also incorporating 16th triplets from 170-180 bpm and wanted to know what bpm they would be in if they were 16th notes.
 
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Boomka

Platinum Member
You don't need your metronome to go any higher, just count bars of 4/4 as bars if 2/2 and your metronome goes to 520...
 

Dr_Watso

Platinum Member
I'm not sure exactly what is going on here, but you should practice your triplets with some space instead of trying to line each note up with a different division click.

Pick a speed, keep the met at quarters and play triplets within them. At some speeds, you can also do trips with a 8th note value, but beyond that, things aren't very musical anymore.

I tell people to do the same thing with normal divisions. If you're practicing 8ths or 16ths, you're better off using the metronome as quarters and putting the notes in yourself.
 

bud7h4

Silver Member
You don't need your metronome to go any higher, just count bars of 4/4 as bars if 2/2 and your metronome goes to 520...
I'm just using, for example, a 125 bpm click to practice 16ths at 250. Simple enough. My confusion was all because I thought 16th triplets were refered to as 32th triplets.


Originally Posted by Dr_Watso
I'm not sure exactly what is going on here, but you should practice your triplets with some space instead of trying to line each note up with a different division click.

Pick a speed, keep the met at quarters and play triplets within them.
Yes, this is what I do, I was just trying to determine what bpm my 16th triplets would be if played as 16ths. It is much easier to calculate than I was making it out to be, since I was mistakenly thinking in 32nd notes.


So 16th note trips at 180 would be 16th notes at 270.
 
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Dr_Watso

Platinum Member
I was just trying to determine what bpm my 16th triplets would be if played as 16ths. It is much easier to calculate than I was making it out to be, since I was mistakenly thinking in 32nd notes.
Okay, but when would you need to know that to play or even learn music? Note values are what's in play here, not literal base subdivisions. If you're playing eighth note triplets, that means that those three notes fit into a quarter note at the given BPM. So one bar of fully played eighth triplets is 12 notes, even though usually you can't have more than two eighth notes per quarter note.

It's kind of pointless, and doesn't work out to try and tag them as 16ths or any other division. Odd groupings like 3's kinda throw the system off, except that we assign them a note value so everyone can be on the same page and we can write them along-side the normal note values with the little brackets indicating that these are groups of three, regardless how the note is written with the one bar at the top of the note.

I guess what I'm wondering is what you're doing with this weird math to convert groups of three into a metronome counting groups of 4? The best way to develop your feel and ability with trips is by using quarters on the click and fitting your trips between them.

If you want to trip out for a moment, check out half note triplet counting. So much space and not easy to get down at first!
 

bud7h4

Silver Member
I guess what I'm wondering is what you're doing with this weird math to convert groups of three into a metronome counting groups of 4?
Don't think "music" or application in this case. This is only about hand/pedal speed. Whether I'm playing 16th triplets at 180 or 16th notes at 270, the speed is the same. Not the values, just the speed.

I'm practicing 16ths at 270 bpm, and wanted to make sure that setting the metronome at 180 and playing triplets that my foot speed was still the same as 16ths at 270.

By originally mistakenly refering to 16th triplets as 32nd triplets, I was all mixed up, hence my pathetic original post, lol.
 

Boomka

Platinum Member
Don't think "music" or application in this case. This is only about hand/pedal speed. Whether I'm playing 16th triplets at 180 or 16th notes at 270, the speed is the same. Not the values, just the speed.

I'm practicing 16ths at 270 bpm, and wanted to make sure that setting the metronome at 180 and playing triplets that my foot speed was still the same as 16ths at 270.
Well, be careful because unless you're playing either of these things with just your feet alone -- which is highly unusual in the wild -- I wouldn't guarantee that your absolute footspeed will translate 100%. Once you add in the element of coordination with your other limbs to play particular grooves at particular tempos, you may find that there is only a rough correlation.
 

bud7h4

Silver Member
Well, be careful because unless you're playing either of these things with just your feet alone -- which is highly unusual in the wild -- I wouldn't guarantee that your absolute footspeed will translate 100%. Once you add in the element of coordination with your other limbs to play particular grooves at particular tempos, you may find that there is only a rough correlation.
That's good advice. I'm playing in time though, either with a metronome or music. It also occured to me that by keeping the same speed and going from notes to triplets and vice versa, you're just superimposing the pattern. Portnoy does this quite often. I'm pretty sure that's not a polyrhythm but it has that effect.
 
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