Ludwig's new Signet 105 drum line!

bobdadruma

Platinum Member


Can you explain that please?

We're assuming the lug nut is of traditional design. By what's being said here we assume there could/should be a channel cast in the metal section which would hold the lug nut in place during tuning/tension, or is the plastic piece part of this function?

What we're getting is w/o the plastic piece the lug nut is held in place, but also hearing if there's no tension/rod and plastic piece not in place, the lug nut would fall out.
les, it appears that the lug slips into the lug casing through the side hole and the plastic plug is then inserted to hide the access port.
 

Les Ismore

Platinum Member
Ok, the piece that you are talking about is a simple plastic plug that is installed in the lug to aesthetically conceal a hole.
The claim is the plastic piece 'is not' purely aesthetic, its functional, holding in the lug nut, but we're also hearing that without it, the lug nut will still function unless there's no tension/rod, then lug nut will fall out.
 

bobdadruma

Platinum Member


The claim is the plastic piece 'is not' purely aesthetic, its functional, holding in the lug nut, but we're also hearing that without it, the lug nut will still function unless there's no tension/rod, then lug nut will fall out.
The lug nut would only fall out if you removed the plastic plug and the tension rod from the lug casing.
The shoulder tube of the plastic plug will hold the lug nut in place.
 

Les Ismore

Platinum Member
The lug nut would only fall out if you removed the plastic plug and the tension rod from the lug casing.
The shoulder tube of the plastic plug will hold the lug nut in place.[/QUOTEesthetic


So its not just aesthetic, it holds the lug nut in place.

Tho we're hearing that without the plastic piece, the rod/tuning/function would not be effected.

We're then to assume the lug nut jams up against the metal casing of the lug when tension is applied, or in the case of a proper design there's a channel in the metal part of the lug that secures the lug nut during tuning.


It's sole purpose is to hold the barrel nut or threaded tube (lug nut) into the lug.
Or as Harvestdrum sez: "It appears its designed like this incase the barrel nut gets damaged and needing replacement."

So an access hole to the lug nut on the outside, the back (shell side) of the lug from the pic shows the lug nut is not acessible from the back, the plastic part is basically a 'lug nut access hole cover' is what were getting its 'function' is.
 
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bermuda

Drummerworld Pro Drummer - Administrator
Staff member
We're assuming the lug nut is of traditional design. By what's being said here we assume there could/should be a channel cast in the metal section which would hold the lug nut in place during tuning/tension, or is the plastic piece part of this function?
Correct - the plastic piece has nothing to do with the lug nut when the rod is in use.

What we're getting is w/o the plastic piece the lug nut is held in place, but also hearing if there's no tension/rod and plastic piece not in place, the lug nut would fall out.
Correct - the plastic piece has nothing to do with the lug nut when the rod is in use. When the rod is unscrewed to change the head, IF the plastic piece was not there, I would assume the nut could fall out. I see no likelihood of the plastic piece falling out on its own, even with determined coaxing from me, it would not budge.

Bermuda
 
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So if the plastic part has absolutely nothing to do with function/tuning, and even if it fell out it would not effect the lug at all, how does that relate to " It appears its designed like this incase the barrel nut gets damaged and needing replacement."?

Without ever seeing the lug myself in person, I could tell you the plastic piece is integral to the design, LUGWIG wouldn't put it on for aesthetic purposes, my guess would be its a lug nut retainer. So, if it failed, or fell out it'd seem logical the lug nut and its performance would be effected.

If any of the drums were set up, tuned and ready to play and for some unknown reason the black plastic insert came out, the tuning would not be affected.

Now, no heads or no tension rods screwed into the barrel nuts and the plastic insert came out then the barrel nut could fall out.

I'm guessing that if one were too mess up a barrel nut, maybe stripped threads or crushed so that a tension rod could no longer be threaded in one could replace the barrel nut. This is what I was referring to when I said it was designed for below.

The barrel nut can not spin in side the lug and the plastic piece has nothing to do with this.
 

Red Menace

Platinum Member
Signet 105 thread AKA the Watch Bermuda feed the trolls thread.

Now lets all bother him about some other minute feature of this new kit ad nauseum. Those tension rode look prone to failure. I think the stickers on your guy's upright bass may be affecting his tone John.
 

bermuda

Drummerworld Pro Drummer - Administrator
Staff member
So its not just aesthetic, it holds the lug nut in place.

Tho we're hearing that without the plastic piece, the rod/tuning/function would not be effected.
Correct, and correct.

We're then to assume the lug nut jams up against the metal casing of the lug when tension is applied, or in the case of a proper design there's a channel in the metal part of the lug that secures the lug nut during tuning.
No assumption, that's exactly what it does, as with every other swivel-nut lug I know of.

Or as Harvestdrum sez: "It appears its designed like this incase the barrel nut gets damaged and needing replacement."
If the plastic piece can be removed, then yes. I guess if the nut was damaged, that would be a suitable incentive to force the plastic piece out. But rather than buy a nut, order a replacement plastic piece, and run the risk of injury to hands, I'd just order an entire lug.

So an access hole to the lug nut on the outside, the back (shell side) of the lug from the pic shows the lug nut is not acessible from the back, the plastic part is basically a 'lug nut access hole cover' is what were getting its 'function' is.
Well, that's partially correct. It does provide access to the nut, but it also serves to hold it in place.

Bermuda
 

Les Ismore

Platinum Member
It appears from the pic in post #291 the design is access to the lug nut from the front. It also appears there's no way the lug nut will fit through the hole in the back, they needed to keep that hole small for structural reasons since the lug is being supported by the lip on its end when in the shell.

So that would clear this up: Even if the plastic part would fall off or get bumped off (which would be hard to do) it would not affect the lug at all.


As mentioned if the tension rod was removed and the plastic piece was out, the lug nut would fall out. It easy then to assume the plastic piece also functions as a lug nut holder. That being so, you'd probably have to have a tension rod inserted into the lug nut and manipulate the nut to remove the plastic piece, dislodge the lug nut from that plastic piece... and that could be the reason for the hole in back. It'd be best to attempt this while the lug is on the drum.
 

bermuda

Drummerworld Pro Drummer - Administrator
Staff member
"Les", I'll talk to you in 5 years about the lug, per our agreement.

Bermuda
 

drummerjims

Senior Member
Ok guys I ordered the "Giga Beat" kit in natural teak and I received it today. I think Bermuda has done a great job at clearing things up for people but I want to take some of the heat off of him here. I live in my apartment so I really haven't got to play these drums yet. even though before my neighbors come home I did get the bass drum tuned in and as far as I can tell it sounds Killer. But right now I want to talk about build quality Pluses and Minuses.

Lets start with the actual shells. I did the full inspection on these bad boys. I checked the edges which are very smooth and even. And the shells are very much so in round. I have played held and serviced Classic maples and I must say that these shells are much light due to the fact that they are super thin they do have a little bit of give to them but not an alarming amount due to this I have noticed that they are very resonant. and giving the the "DW" style tap test the shells themselves have a very pronounced tone to them when you give them a tap. Also going back to the edges there was no filler that I could see in the bearing edges which I understand happens a lot and it might happen on some of the drums made for this line but mine are filler free.

On my holes there was blowout but I will get more into that later. The finish on the shells is very dull but really is quite nice in person even from a distance. I wish more companies would offer this "green" finish as an option. I am not an environmental nut but I appreciate the step to make this world greener. The finish is kind of rough but I am personally ok with it even though I prefer a super smooth finish.

Now lets get to the lugs. These little guys are solid, and the black plastic caps are much smaller than they look in person. Also everything that Bermuda has been said about the plastic cap is true. The function of the black cap is very minimal and as far as i can tell the lugs would be functional without them.

Other Hardware - I love the bass drum claws these claws are the most solid claws I have ever had on a drum set. They are cast and very heavy duty but are nice and small and fit the rim perfectly like a glove The Tension rods and rims are standard, and the floor tom legs and the triad mounts are very solid. I want to check out these mounts more later but as of now I don't have an opinion other than they are solid as are the floor tom legs.

Now for my biggest beef The bass drum spurs. Honestly I like the build quality and even though I don't like that they elevate the front of the bass drum it doesn't really bother me that much. The problem I have is that when I fold them up the spur ends wont close up all the way because they rest on the bass drum rim. I will take a picture of this later. It is very small but for some reason It really makes me mad (oh well I will get over it)

Assembly:

I spent 3 hours putting this kit together far from the 20 minutes they say but to be fair I did go over each drum for a long time. Also they were so well packed that it almost took me 30 minutes to take them out of the boxes and get everything organized. These lugs are a tight fit at first I thought I was going to crack the drum trying to shove it in (insert joke). I actually like that it is like this it means it will not fall out however this is were a very slight problem arose I pushed one in at a wrong angle and got slight blowout on the inside of the shell. I hope this clears up why this is happening. Its not a big problem and it wont be a problem at all if you pay attention to what you are doing. Like I said it was a very small amount of blowout and it does not bother me. I have never owned a drum set without a little bit of blowout.

putting on the heads. it wasn't until the last drum head that I really figured out how to get the lugs and rods lined up easily because the lugs do move from side to side. No that I have it down I see no added time in changing drum heads however at first it did take a few extra seconds per lug.

Overall even though I have been sold on these since I played them a few weeks ago at Guitar Center I was honestly surprised by the build quality. I would not call these a cheaper alternative to a classic maple or something comparable these are really their own thing. They sound different, and they look different. But they have a high quality sound, and in my opinions they have a quality look to them. I do believe that they are a little gimmicky but for some reason I chose them over drums more than twice there price. They spoke to me and they might to you as well. If you are wanting to buy a new kit do yourself a favor and go check them out. You might come to the same conclusion that I did. But even if you don't, you owe it to yourself to go and try out as many drums as you can because that is the only way to know what you really want.

P.S. other kits I tried out and considered buying were, Gretsch Brooklyn, Yamaha Recording Custom, Gretsch Renown, Ludwig Maple Classics, Tama B/B, and Pearl Session Studio Classics.

Even though though all of these drums sounded great the Signets really did it for me.

I hope you enjoyed this rant. If punctuation is off I apologize I have had very little sleep. If any of you have any more questions about them please let me know. I will continue to update my views on them as I spend more time with them, and when I am done with that I will get back to you in 5 years.

Thank you,
Goodnight,
Jimmy
 

bermuda

Drummerworld Pro Drummer - Administrator
Staff member
Thanks for the overview, you definitely got into them more than I did! Then again, my drums were already assembled. :)

And yes, I know what you mean about the kick spurs resting on the head-rim/hoop. I suspect it has a bit to do with the shells being a little undersized. Not really a problem, but I did notice it when 'stowing' them for the first time.

Thanks again Jim, I know you'll dig the drums!

Bermuda
 
Thanks too Jim! I ment to post some extra pics of the drums but I've been busy. So....a few pics ( not the greatest quality ) coming up.

Signet box
 

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