Ludwig, I would like my drums please

tamadrm

Platinum Member
Between this thread and this one:

http://www.drummerworld.com/forums/showthread.php?p=922470#post922470

I would steer clear of all things Ludwig until they get their act together.

In a time when people are hurting for jobs, why can't Ludwig hire a few to help their back log. It doesn't take much skill to screw on some lugs and put on heads.
In all fairness,that was the drumshop/internet vendor that created that situation,and substituted a B stock drum for an A stock ,hoping the customer wouldn't notice.None of that business was Ludwigs fault,who clearly put a cut B/O badge on that drum,that had only a slight cosmetic issue.Thats why there is now a long wait for A stock Black Beautys,because Ludwig will no longer sell cosmeticly defective drums to the public.

The reason Ludwig dosen't hire more personel is that they don't control their yearly buget....their parent company Selmer does.

FYI..Pearl also sells B stock drums.

Steve B
 

Soupy

Silver Member
In a time when people are hurting for jobs, why can't Ludwig hire a few to help their back log. It doesn't take much skill to screw on some lugs and put on heads.
Except it does take skill, otherwise you end up with the original set of drums I received, with a bunch of light scratches marring the finish. Sadly, there are a lot of fools who couldn't work a screwdriver without hurting themselves or the drum.
 

Andy@MIT

Senior Member
In all fairness,that was the drumshop/internet vendor that created that situation,and substituted a B stock drum for an A stock ,hoping the customer wouldn't notice.None of that business was Ludwigs fault,who clearly put a cut B/O badge on that drum,that had only a slight cosmetic issue.Thats why there is now a long wait for A stock Black Beautys,because Ludwig will no longer sell cosmeticly defective drums to the public.

The reason Ludwig dosen't hire more personel is that they don't control their yearly buget....their parent company Selmer does.

FYI..Pearl also sells B stock drums.

Steve B
Hate to disagree Steve, but you are misinformed. The reason for the proliferation of B Stock Ludwig's, in particular the Black Beauties stems from the fact that there is still literally ONE GUY doing the black nickel plating. For whatever reason, it is apparently a difficult process to get the finish up to Ludwig's specs. Thus there are many drums that don't meet "A Stock" quality. Given the strong demand for BB's (and this goes back the entire decade I've been in and around retail), Ludwig has been seizing the opportunity to sell the B-stock drums at a discount instead of taking the loss and scrapping them.

Has nothing to do with retailers at all. It's all about the fact that the BB is a great drum, tons of drummers want it, but it is difficult to produce them 100% up to spec 100% of the time.
 

tamadrm

Platinum Member
Hate to disagree Steve, but you are misinformed. The reason for the proliferation of B Stock Ludwig's, in particular the Black Beauties stems from the fact that there is still literally ONE GUY doing the black nickel plating. For whatever reason, it is apparently a difficult process to get the finish up to Ludwig's specs. Thus there are many drums that don't meet "A Stock" quality. Given the strong demand for BB's (and this goes back the entire decade I've been in and around retail), Ludwig has been seizing the opportunity to sell the B-stock drums at a discount instead of taking the loss and scrapping them.

Has nothing to do with retailers at all. It's all about the fact that the BB is a great drum, tons of drummers want it, but it is difficult to produce them 100% up to spec 100% of the time.
I didn't know there was only one guy doing the plating.The reason I pointed to the retailer in this case, is that is where the problem began.He clearly took a B stock drum,and tried to pass it off as a A stock drum,hoping the buyer wouldn't notice.That is not Ludwigs fault.and I never said it was.

Your statement is exactly the point that I was trying to make.I have no problem with B stock drums and I agree its a great opportunity to own a legendary drum at a discounted price.Scrapping a perfectly good players drum dosen't make sense.

The production quotas this indivual is under must be intense,so there is little wonder why there are so many B stock drums.Given my former training as a journeyman die maker /machineist ,I understand that this is not a walk in type of job and it does require training.But the thinking behind having only one individual who is trained to make your flagship snare drum is questionable at best.

My understanding was that Ludwig ONLY wants A stock drums on the market,and has cut back on production to achieve that end.

I'm a long time Ludwig fan,but Selmer needs to dig in their pockets a little deeper,and hire some more staff.Ludwig makes great drums,but people only remember the bad things they hear,thats reality.I'm sure that out of a few hundred great drum sets,maybe one or two have serious issues.So far I've only heard about a half dozen cases at most,having problems with Ludwig,and the majority saying their drums,have no problems at all.



Steve B
 

KarlCrafton

Platinum Member
ONE GUY doing the plating?
They don't do it in-house do they?

I know there was one guy doing the Hammering on shells, but for plating?

That process, from what I've seen in video's is a "more than one guy" type deal.
 

bog_72

Senior Member
The only way a company such as this makes changes is if their image is bruised.Calling a lawyer doesnt leave a scratch.They know youre not going to follow through with any legal proceedings that would far outweigh the value of the drums.Going through your local shop you purchased them through,and hoping they make some noise is a dead end road as well.The store is not going to strong arm a partner.They will appear upset to your face,but be as kind as can be to the company.

If you want to change a companies quality issues,you have to use the Better Business Bureau.A company receives a grade from the BBB when complaints are made,and not taken care of to their standards.So if only one person complains,and they fix it immediately,they would receive an A grade.If thousands complain and they take their time the way they have with you,they would have a hard F.I havent looked them up (Ludwig) but im assuming they have a decent grade if they dont take QC seriously.Its when you get a crap grade that companies buckle down.

I guarantee you that if you make a complaint to the BBB,you will either have your drums within a week,or a full refund.It becomes active,and they will immediately respond to avoid it effecting their grade.I have experienced it first hand.my job got an F because of poor customer service.That grade hit the local papers and the company did a total overhaul.Fired the president,and restructured the entire company.All because a handful of people contacted the BBB.

I understand not wanting to make waves.I also understand were not talking about the walmart greeter forgetting to say hello....were talking about that work of art weve been saving up for,but you would be doing the company a favor.For all we know the people are great their,but are being forced to cut corners.I think its our responsibility to help them out.
 

zambizzi

Platinum Member
ONE GUY doing the plating?
They don't do it in-house do they?

I know there was one guy doing the Hammering on shells, but for plating?

That process, from what I've seen in video's is a "more than one guy" type deal.
One company, not "one guy." This shortage has been going on for a while, it seems. When I bought my new BB almost two years ago, I wanted one with tube lugs. I had to settle for one w/ imperials (which I eventually threw tubes on) because the one *company* that does the plating, wasn't keeping up with demand. That's what I was told, anyhow.
 
S

sticks4drums

Guest
One company, not "one guy." This shortage has been going on for a while, it seems. When I bought my new BB almost two years ago, I wanted one with tube lugs. I had to settle for one w/ imperials (which I eventually threw tubes on) because the one *company* that does the plating, wasn't keeping up with demand. That's what I was told, anyhow.
I got mine with tube lugs. :p
 

Dirtcity

Member
I can't chime in here as well as most of my experiences with Ludwig are used gear. But first off, I want to say that Ludwig is my favorite drum brand, my favorite drum sound(s), and I'm overall a Ludwig fan boy.

That being said, these QC mistakes happen, and Ludwig is trying to turn their name around. Should they get out the door? No, but they do. Hopefully Ludwig does whatever is in their power to make it right.

Every company has their issues. I've ordered several drums new from Pearl that had slight issues, but they didn't make much of a difference in sound so I kept them. There's also a Ludwig Classic Maple at my local music shop with a sign that says MADE IN USA, and the kick drum has an air bubble under the wrap. I hate to see any company have issues like that, but hopefully they end up making it right.

A friend in the food industry brought up the statistic that if someone has a bad experience at a restaurant, they will tell 11 people. If they have a good experience, they will tell 2. I can only hope that for every negative experience with any drum brand, especially Ludwig, that there are more positive experiences that we aren't hearing about.
 
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