Lots of chops..? Nothing wrong with that..

oldskoolsoul

Silver Member
After reading thread number 11.225 about the money-beat (or playing without fills), i think is time for a “play as much notes as you can”-thread..

Learn all about beat displacements you can, learn all about metric modulation you can, learn to play the most complicated fills you can……start a gospel-chops course….transcribe every Chick Corea Electric Band-tune yourself…..play 2,5 minute fills in a 3 minute song…...or whatever…

Just make sure that everything you learn, you can play in time…

After that, everything becomes a matter of taste..

I posted this before, because i guarantee you, you will be perfectly able to play Dua Lipa with only “4 on the floor”, if you can also play Dua Lipa like this…

Actually, i say that you will play an even better “4 on the floor”, if you can also play Dua Lipa like this..

(The name “Dua Lipa” can be changed into any “money-beat”-artist you want btw….)

 
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Rock Salad

Junior Member
That you? I think it is. I agree, learn everything you can find time to learn. But hey- play music with other people too. Bonus if they can keep up with you!
Money is money in my book, everybody know what it is. Some people don't really care about money so much

 

Xstr8edgtnrdrmrX

Well-known member
I am also in the camp that the money beat is not the be all/end all of drumming...it is not the bellwether for how to define a great drummer...

it is a tool; it is just as effective, or ineffective as any other beat especially if it is used in the wrong place, or too much

I like it when a player, or song can utilize the money beat AND some trickery. Any of the Vinnie C. stuff with Sting is real great examples of that...or early tim "Herb" Alexander in Primus

Joe Morello has ALL KINDS of sick money beats on the Take Five album that are not in 4/4

Dino Campanella's playing on any Dredg album, but specifically Catch Without Arms is a GREAT example of money beat sprinkled with trickery in exactly the correct way

Portoy got it righht on Dream Theater's Falling Into Infinity for me as well

so yeah...there is more than one money beat, and they are all great whe used the right way
 

oldskoolsoul

Silver Member
..That you? I think it is..


No, lol..

Thats Gianluca Pellerito..

The idea of the thread is more that i am not getting at all why there is constantly, in all sorts of variations, the hammering about the importance of the money-beat at this place..

Like, if this forum taught me 1 thing, then is that i am completely sick of hearing again and again and again and again and again and again and again how important the money beat and getting hired is..

There is way and way more to the craft of drumming than only nagging about a money-beat and money and getting hired and not-getting-hired-because-you-play-no-money-beat….

All those chops monsters that people complain about on this forum are perfectly able to play a money-beat, but they got allready bored by that when they were 10 years old and decided to expand their abilities on the set…..to push their abilities further….to grow…to get better….

But yeah………..….money beat….important….yawn….yes…..

If money is that important to someone, starting to play drums was a bad decision allready anyway….lol..
 

Jeff Almeyda

Senior Consultant
Unpopular opinion alert:

The reality is that most amateur drummers are terrible and are lucky if they can do even the money beat at a pro level.
Any good college or pro drummer can lay down grooves and fills from the simple to the complex with good feel.
Most aging rock guys have lousy chops and loose time feels. Comes with the territory I guess lol. Maybe that’s why they all harp on the money beat.
 

Jeff Almeyda

Senior Consultant

KEEF

Senior Member
There's a reason that Dua Lipa (The name “Dua Lipa” can be changed into any “money-beat”- 'mainstream' artist you want btw….) doesn't want that type of playing on their records. That's why these guys are only bashing about in their bedrooms and the (best) 'serve the song' guys are getting hired to play stadium tours......
But it's all about what YOU want to do - if the dream is to stay at home and just make you tube videos rather than play in front of actual people - and that can be a viable way to make a living these days - then oldskool is right, learn to fit in as many notes as you darn well can.
I fall into the aging rock guys category so this youtube chop fest does nothing for me, but each to their own - no denying the kid can play.
 

Al Strange

Well-known member
I honestly don’t have a dog in this fight. If someone wants to blaze chops all the time, that’s entirely up to them. Bright kids will always learn from their mistakes anyway so no need to tell people how to play. As @KEEF alludes to above, if your dream gig is AC/DC you’re unlikely to be the kind of player who wants to blaze all of the time anyway and vice versa for more choppy genres. As an aging rock drummer my advice fwiw is play how you play and the gigs will come your way, or not. Learn from that, enjoy the instrument and express yourself in as musical a way as possible. :unsure:
 

Xstr8edgtnrdrmrX

Well-known member
yeah...the kid in the video needs some "life experience" for sure as far as how to use busy playing and fills.

but again, the spirit of what @oldskoolsoul is still true. The money beat is just a viable tool, and not a "pedestal worthy element".

The list of drummers who made money off of busy playing is just as long - and credible - as the list of guys who played the money beat.
And the list of drummers who misuse both beats is probably longer...

And beat usage also does not define skill. For me, skill is defined by wisdom. Skill is knowing when to use the correct tool, and knowing how to use the correct tool.

AND, making up excuses as to why one style of playing is more important than the other just because of wanting to avoid the work needed to be successful at one is also an issue for me. I know A LOT of "money beat only" guys who jump on that bandwagon just b/c they don't want to practice

I see the same thing in the bass world: the "basses should only have one string" guys...sort of a cop out in my brain.
 

cbphoto

Gold Member
In my youth, when I first heard Mitch Mitchell I thought he was “busy”. A few years later I hear Billy Cobham‘s Spectrum and literally wanted to quit drumming. After dropping out of college, I go see Jeff Beck for the specific reason of seeing Richard Bailey on drums, only to be disappointed then blown away by a young Simon Phillips and his open-hand wizardry.

Thank God they didn’t play the money beat.
 
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Hewitt2

Senior Member
These threads can be tricky as they can be devoid of context i.e. who is the audience and what is the music we're talking about?

So long as the music grooves, that's really all that matters. If you are able to do that while throwing in some chops then good on you. But if I'm playing singer/songwriter arrangements, for example, I'm going to need to take a backseat.
 

someguy01

Well-known member
Busy playing or lots of chops or whatever you want to call it is fine and dandy, when it actually serves the song. Most of what I have seen on YT is chops for the sake of chops and the "look what I can do" yet it does nothing to serve the music. I've seen the "metric modulation challenge" videos as well, and it's the same thing; cool that you can do that but it doesn't serve the song.
I've found through attending a lot of concerts that the only people who care about the drummer's chops, are other drummers.
Everything has it's place and time.
Doing something just for the sake of doing it accomplishes very little and can sometimes begat undesired outcomes.
 
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