Latest Purchase...Non-percussion

larryace said:
Do you have 6 open spaces in your panel?

Also, what's the 30 amp breaker and the 10 wire for, another project?

Those heaters have to be protected at no more than 20 amps
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I have 15 spaces available currently.

According to Cadet's website, if I exceed 3,840 watts I can run a 30 amp circuit up to 5,760 watts. My kitchen and living room are open area so the plan was to run them as (1) 30 amp circuit since the 3 heaters together draw 4000 watts.

Everything I bought is Cadet, so I'm assuming they are correct in power requirements.

Here is the page and the chart I got the info from:

Can I Use Multiple Heaters with Just One Thermostat?

You can wire multiple heaters to one thermostat. But that doesn't mean we always recommend it.
www.cadet.glendimplexamericas.com www.cadet.glendimplexamericas.com

By all means if this is wrong feel free to yell at me.
 
larryace said:
The monster isn't that bad.

He's just looking for acceptance. Talk to him.

Everyone is scared of him.

He's all bark and no bite.

The spiders down there could be ferocious
Click to expand...
I'm going to try to clean up the crawlspace and make it not so scary. I really do freak myself out when I'm down there.
 
V x A = W
Easy math to determine required breaker size. Also, check the main in the panel to see what the total Amp service is for the panel.
I'm sure you're aware, but just in case ya weren't.
 
MrInsanePolack said:
I have 15 spaces available currently.

According to Cadet's website, if I exceed 3,840 watts I can run a 30 amp circuit up to 5,760 watts. My kitchen and living room are open area so the plan was to run them as (1) 30 amp circuit since the 3 heaters together draw 4000 watts.

Everything I bought is Cadet, so I'm assuming they are correct in power requirements.

Here is the page and the chart I got the info from:

Can I Use Multiple Heaters with Just One Thermostat?

You can wire multiple heaters to one thermostat. But that doesn't mean we always recommend it.
www.cadet.glendimplexamericas.com www.cadet.glendimplexamericas.com

By all means if this is wrong feel free to yell at me.
Click to expand...
If the heaters themselves are rated at only 20 amps max you are not allowed to connect the wiring to a 30 amp circuit. If the heaters are rated for 30 amps then you're good. It's the heater max amperage rating that concerns me. I've never saw internal wiring in a heater that uses 10 gauge. Any wire thinner than 10 gauge isn't rated for 30 amps. I run a max of 16 feet of baseboard heat on a 20 amp 240 volt circuit, which is 2000 watts per double pole breaker.

The NEC does recognize the 30 amp circuit for baseboard heat. Me, I never encountered it. You need to read and follow the ratings on the heater itself to make the final decision. Plus working with 10 solid wire is A. Pain. In. The. Ass.

I'd do it in 12 wire at 20 amps for safety and ease of wiring. Even connected to a 30 amp circuit, the heater will draw the same wattage as it takes on a 20 amp circuit. It's when things go south electrically that the higher amperage breaker can melt insulation on thinner wire like 12 which is what they use inside the heater. Gotta plan for worst case scenario, they do happen.

You have to check the ratings of the thermostats as well. If one component (thermostat or heater) is max rated at 20 amps, that's your limit as to what amperage circuit to connect to.
 
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larryace said:
If the heaters themselves are rated at only 20 amps max you are not allowed to connect the wiring to a 30 amp circuit. If the heaters are rated for 30 amps then you're good. It's the heater max amperage rating that concerns me. I've never saw internal wiring in a heater that uses 10 gauge. Any wire thinner than 10 gauge isn't rated for 30 amps. I run a max of 16 feet of baseboard heat on a 20 amp 240 volt circuit, which is 2000 watts per double pole breaker.

The NEC does recognize the 30 amp circuit for baseboard heat. Me, I never encountered it. You need to read and follow the ratings on the heater itself to make the final decision. Plus working with 10 solid wire is A. Pain. In. The. Ass.

I'd do it in 12 wire at 20 amps for safety and ease of wiring. Even connected to a 30 amp circuit, the heater will draw the same wattage as it takes on a 20 amp circuit. It's when things go south electrically that the higher amperage breaker can melt insulation on thinner wire like 12 which is what they use inside the heater. Gotta plan for worst case scenario, they do happen.

You have to check the ratings of the thermostats as well. If one component (thermostat or heater) is max rated at 20 amps, that's your limit as to what amperage circuit to connect to.
Click to expand...
Okay, the thermostat says 22.0 amps. Its wiring is 12 gauge.

The heaters show 2.1, 4.2, and 6.3 amps depending on size of heater. Their wiring is 14 gauge. I cannot find a max amps rating.

In order run multiple heaters off 1 thermostat, I must wire it in parallel. Does this compound the power draw (1+1+1=3), or distribute it evenly (1×1×1=1)?

I could easily split the kitchen/living room into 2 circuits if needed, just need another thermostat. I would like to keep them as 1 circuit.

The instruction manual states "The maximum amperage load you can put on 1 circuit breaker is limited to either 80% of the circuit breaker capacity, or the maximum amperage rating of the thermostat, whichever is lower."

My kitchen/LR heaters would be 6.3+6.3+4.2 for a total of 16.8 amps. Is this correct as the total draw? If so, 16.8 is less than 20, but more than 80%. Or is the most its pulling is 6.3 amps because its parallel?

Here is where I got wattage, it's on the box with a sq ft equivalent. Is this output and not relevant to power draw?

20210923_130302.jpg
 
MrInsanePolack said:
Okay, the thermostat says 22.0 amps. Its wiring is 12 gauge.

The heaters show 2.1, 4.2, and 6.3 amps depending on size of heater. Their wiring is 14 gauge. I cannot find a max amps rating.

In order run multiple heaters off 1 thermostat, I must wire it in parallel. Does this compound the power draw (1+1+1=3), or distribute it evenly (1×1×1=1)?

I could easily split the kitchen/living room into 2 circuits if needed, just need another thermostat. I would like to keep them as 1 circuit.

The instruction manual states "The maximum amperage load you can put on 1 circuit breaker is limited to either 80% of the circuit breaker capacity, or the maximum amperage rating of the thermostat, whichever is lower."

My kitchen/LR heaters would be 6.3+6.3+4.2 for a total of 16.8 amps. Is this correct as the total draw? If so, 16.8 is less than 20, but more than 80%. Or is the most its pulling is 6.3 amps because its parallel?

Here is where I got wattage, it's on the box with a sq ft equivalent. Is this output and not relevant to power draw?

View attachment 108730
Click to expand...
Yes, the rabbit hole is deep.
 
cbphoto said:
Yes, the rabbit hole is deep.
Click to expand...
Sure is! Sad part, this makes more sense to me than the electrical stuff you just did. To me, that looks like colorful spaghetti.

@larryace, the 30", 500 watt heater will be alone in a bathroom. If they have their own thermostats, could I have the kitchen heater and the bathroom heater be on the same circuit? If so, I'll just do that as it keeps everything at 20 amps, and I can return the #10 expensive ass wire.
 
MrInsanePolack said:
Is this output and not relevant to power draw?
Click to expand...
No, it is power draw. Output should be listed as BTUs.
That bottom heater (4000W) pulls 33.4A. I would assume that wattage rating as well as your mentioned amp rating would be the max draw at full output.
MrInsanePolack said:
Does this compound the power draw (1+1+1=3)
Click to expand...
this is correct.
 
MrInsanePolack said:
@larryace, the 30", 500 watt heater will be alone in a bathroom. If they have their own thermostats, could I have the kitchen heater and the bathroom heater be on the same circuit? If so, I'll just do that as it keeps everything at 20 amps, and I can return the #10 expensive ass wire.
Click to expand...
Uncle Larry I drew a circuit map of what I'm thinking here. I think it will work. What say you?
20210923_150611.jpg
I had to make the white wire yellow, no white sharpie. I did label it as hot though since it's a 240 circuit. My green looks too close to black after taking the picture. Sorry about that.
 
MrInsanePolack said:
Sure is! Sad part, this makes more sense to me than the electrical stuff you just did. To me, that looks like colorful spaghetti.

@larryace, the 30", 500 watt heater will be alone in a bathroom. If they have their own thermostats, could I have the kitchen heater and the bathroom heater be on the same circuit? If so, I'll just do that as it keeps everything at 20 amps, and I can return the #10 expensive ass wire.
Click to expand...
Any combination of heaters up to 16 feet can be run on 1 - 240 volt 20 amp circuit. So yes, kitchen and bathroom heaters can be run simultaneously on a 240 volt 20 amp circuit as long as the total length of heaters doesn't exceed 16 foot total.
MrInsanePolack said:
Uncle Larry I drew a circuit map of what I'm thinking here. I think it will work. What say you?
View attachment 108738
I had to make the white wire yellow, no white sharpie. I did label it as hot though since it's a 240 circuit. My green looks too close to black after taking the picture. Sorry about that.
Click to expand...


I use baseboard heat too. It's quiet, clean, and I can pick which rooms to heat or not. Plus running out of heating oil is no fun at all. Heating my home with electric is much less expensive than when I had oil.

This diagram looks right as long as you get the connections right in the Thermostat (and everywhere else as well) You'll need 240 volt (2 pole) thermostats. I'm assuming you're running 2 heaters off one thermostat. I'm not clear on that. If your intention is to wire the kitchen and bathroom on the same stat... I would never wire those 2 rooms on the same thermostat. The bathroom *might* get too hot. Id put an onboard or wall thermostat in the bathroom at least and wire the kitchen and another bigger general area room on the same stat if you want more centralized control. I have onboard stats on every heater in my house. The only downside to that is no central thermostat. I could wire it that way, but I like the individual controls.
 
larryace said:
Any combination of heaters up to 16 feet can be run on 1 - 240 volt 20 amp circuit. So yes, kitchen and bathroom heaters can be run simultaneously on a 240 volt 20 amp circuit as long as the total length of heaters doesn't exceed 16 foot total.



I use baseboard heat too. It's quiet, clean, and I can pick which rooms to heat or not. Plus running out of heating oil is no fun at all. Heating my home with electric is much less expensive than when I had oil.

This diagram looks right as long as you get the connections right in the Thermostat (and everywhere else as well) You'll need 240 volt (2 pole) thermostats. I'm assuming you're running 2 heaters off one thermostat. I'm not clear on that. If your intention is to wire the kitchen and bathroom on the same stat... I would never wire those 2 rooms on the same thermostat. The bathroom *might* get too hot. Id put an onboard or wall thermostat in the bathroom at least and wire the kitchen and another bigger general area room on the same stat if you want more centralized control. I have onboard stats on every heater in my house. The only downside to that is no central thermostat. I could wire it that way, but I like the individual controls.
Click to expand...
Awesome!

Okay, so I can have 5 zones on 4 circuits:

Circuit 1: Kitchen and bath. Each have their own thermostats
Circuit 2: Living room. It has it's own thermostat.
Circuit 3: Kids room. It has it's own thermostat
Circuit 4: Master bed and bath. 1 thermostat for both, it's open space more or less.

That will make life easier, and I can return the #10 wire. It also keeps everything at 20 amps. Yay!
 
My math was wrong, I missed that the heaters were 240V.
 
I got new tuners, bridge, and tailpiece for my #1 guitar... I did the tailpiece swap first, and what a dramatic improvement that was... It's like a different guitar, and, fortunately, for the better. :)
 
I finally got around to finishing out the missing pieces of sound absorption in my control room/editing bay and recording room:
Two Auralex Bass Traps
Two Auralex 2-inch Wedge panels
One box of Owens Corning 703 2" rigid insulation (six 2' X 4' sheets)
8 yards of FR701 acoustic fabric
106 linear feet of select white pine 1" X 4" and 1" X 2"
I took a few leisurely days to build and assemble two clouds (5' X 3' and a 6' X 4') and a single panel (4' X 2'). The 4' X 2' is mobile for placement in the recording room and is mounted on a short C-stand with a short gobo arm so it can be lifted up and down, angled and rotated as needed.
I used four C-stands as a "lift" to get the clouds into position so I could anchor them to the joists. Worked solo without a helper on hanging them.
The Auralex products were a straight out purchase, the rest was a DIY build and assembly.
Result: I was truly surprised at how noticeable the difference was listening to my reference monitors. They are more focused, fuller and richer sounding, (especially the bass and mids). Nothing earth shattering, but definitely an improvement sonically.

Pictured below is the 5' X 3" cloud being assembled, installed and the finished product.


Cloud_Assembly.jpg

Cloud_C-Stands.jpg

Cloud_Install.jpg
 
Vintage Old School said:
I finally got around to finishing out the missing pieces of sound absorption in my control room/editing bay and recording room:
Two Auralex Bass Traps
Two Auralex 2-inch Wedge panels
One box of Owens Corning 703 2" rigid insulation (six 2' X 4' sheets)
8 yards of FR701 acoustic fabric
106 linear feet of select white pine 1" X 4" and 1" X 2"
I took a few leisurely days to build and assemble two clouds (5' X 3' and a 6' X 4') and a single panel (4' X 2'). The 4' X 2' is mobile for placement in the recording room and is mounted on a short C-stand with a short gobo arm so it can be lifted up and down, angled and rotated as needed.
I used four C-stands as a "lift" to get the clouds into position so I could anchor them to the joists. Worked solo without a helper on hanging them.
The Auralex products were a straight out purchase, the rest was a DIY build and assembly.
Result: I was truly surprised at how noticeable the difference was listening to my reference monitors. They are more focused, fuller and richer sounding, (especially the bass and mids). Nothing earth shattering, but definitely an improvement sonically.

Pictured below is the 5' X 3" cloud being assembled, installed and the finished product.


View attachment 108867

View attachment 108868

View attachment 108869
Click to expand...
Yet another use for c-stands. Nice!
 
Vintage Old School said:
One box of Owens Corning 703 2" rigid insulation (six 2' X 4' sheets)
8 yards of FR701 acoustic fabric
106 linear feet of select white pine 1" X 4" and 1" X 2"
I took a few leisurely days to build and assemble two clouds (5' X 3' and a 6' X 4') and a single panel (4' X 2').
Click to expand...
Do all your panels have a 4” depth? Did you consider 6” depth?
 
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