I've been given a song list

rhumbagirl

Senior Member
rhumbagirl -- Let me add my congrats on landing the gig. You're gonna kill it!!

As usual, C.M. nailed it with his advice. Here's proof: 4/5 of the originals doing a cover of their own original...
The drummer does take liberties with fills. There really aren't any on the original if I'm not mistaken...ahhh...the magic of looping in the studio.

Edited to correct stupidity and repetitiveness:mad:
Just try to ignore the corny antics of the orchestra (or at least try to).
Ignore the corny antics of the orchestra (or at least try to)
Thanks Planoranger! Yeah, that live version sounds good despite (or because of) significant departures from the original recording - BD on all quarters and using one hand for the hihat pattern between beat 1 and 2. The video doesn't capture if the drummer is using one or two hands for the tom part but one can figure those details out themselves.

I think this is the toughest tune. There's also a lot of 16th note patterns in disco that have intricate accents that can be difficult. We probably can all accent alternating groups of two 16th notes like this:


Code:
|1...2...3...4...|1...2...3...4...|
 >>  >>  >>  >>   >>  >>  >>  >>
|RLRLRLRLRLRLRLRL|RLRLRLRLRLRLRLRL| HH
But slip in the 'a' every other quarter note and it gets astronomically more difficult (Le Freak):

Code:
|1...2...3...4...|1...2...3...4...|
 >> >>>  >> >>>   >> >>>  >> >>>
|RLRLRLRLRLRLRLRL|RLRLRLRLRLRLRLRL| HH
 

planoranger

Junior Member
...The video doesn't capture if the drummer is using one or two hands for the tom part but one can figure those details out themselves...
I'm not sure either. However, here's one way to figure out which way sounds best to you. You don't even need to get on a set (or even a pad) to see/hear the effect; you can tap them out on any surface. The following 2 examples are 4 groups of 16th notes in 4/4 time. Uppercase letters are accents.

RllR RllR RllR RllR
vs
RlrL RlrL RlrL RlrL

I think what you will find is the first version (which would simulate the one-handed tom part) results in a "tighter" sound; the second in a "looser" sound. In the "real world" you might need to be able to play both the one-handed version or the two-handed version depending on "environmental concerns" (e.g. does the band need a little "jump start" because the group energy is a little low? In which case I might opt for the 1st version; it gives a little forward push).

Hope this helps.
 

GetAgrippa

Platinum Member
It's a do-able list and I'm stoked for you Rhumba. Now I've moved back to Georgia I'm hoping to reconnect and gig or jam some. I hope the band meets your expectations. My last experience on Bandmix was an old garage band bassist wanting to start up a band. His idea was a list of 40 songs to learn as quickly as possible-which he attempted to work on a dozen or more each practice with an ever evolving change of lead guitar players trying out. I don't think we ever learned a single song completely and both the rhythm guitar and bassist so rusty each practice was trying to remember and relearn. I bailed after a few months of "sticking" with them-swell bunch of guys but had no focus. This could be a great time and experience, you can post some gig videos too. I can't focus as well just playing for me-but gigging and others depending on me really drives me to do my best.
 

rhumbagirl

Senior Member
I learnt "shake your body" a while ago with the help of a couple of tutorials:

Chad's take with the 8th note hihat ostinato and four on the floor kick feels the most straight forward.

(1) Chad Wright
- kick : four on the floor
- hihat : straight 8th notes except on beat 4 (due to recovery from the high tom hit on (3) 'a')
- floortom : a little stretch hit with the snare hand, but doable
- high tom : requires fast move from hihat on (3) '&' to 'a' - doable with rotation/supination of the forearm
- PROS : keeps the groove using the dominant side, therefore more likely to remain consistent
- CONS : stretch move to hit the floortom; if you suck, someone could time a tomato hit and you wouldn't know what hit you

(2) Open handed Chad Wright (hitting snare on beat 4 with LH)
- kick : four on the floor
- hihat : straight 8th notes except on beat 4 (due to hitting the snare)
- floortom : no problem with the right hand
- high tom : no problem with the right hand
- PROS : no stretch move needed to hit the floortom; eyes can stay where the fun is - the dancing crowd, or if a non-dancing crowd, those with tomatoes in their hands
- CONS : groove is using the less dominant side, so risk goes up; needs practice; snare hits are being shared over both hands and adds risk to an inconsistent backbeat sound; the 16th note variation for beat 1 using the non-dominant LH needs practice, and this is also complicated by the fact that the hihat surface is moving during the open/close pattern

(3) The same as (2) but hitting the snare on beat 4 with RH (instead of LH)
PROS : all snare hits coming from the same source - the dominant RH
CONS : the snare hit on beat 4 requires a double strike due to the high tom hit on (3) 'a' - high risk screw up for the consistent backbeat sound

Conclusion: Option (2) is less risk to injury but requires more practice time. The fact that the groove has a lope involving the high tom and floortom, probably doesn't penalize having two snare hit sources. Option (1) is ready to go today if you don't mind hitting the floortom with your LH (left hand). The gig is in October so likely to work up option (2).

EDIT: Adding a floortom to the left of the hihat provides a solution to the stretch floortom strike in option (1). It also adds lope to the groove by providing an alternative tom source.
 
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rhumbagirl

Senior Member
It's a do-able list and I'm stoked for you Rhumba. Now I've moved back to Georgia I'm hoping to reconnect and gig or jam some. I hope the band meets your expectations. My last experience on Bandmix was an old garage band bassist wanting to start up a band. His idea was a list of 40 songs to learn as quickly as possible-which he attempted to work on a dozen or more each practice with an ever evolving change of lead guitar players trying out. I don't think we ever learned a single song completely and both the rhythm guitar and bassist so rusty each practice was trying to remember and relearn. I bailed after a few months of "sticking" with them-swell bunch of guys but had no focus. This could be a great time and experience, you can post some gig videos too. I can't focus as well just playing for me-but gigging and others depending on me really drives me to do my best.
Thanks Art! A lot of things have to happen, the number one being whether the lockdown is going to draw out or not. I'm setup to record my tracks and using dropbox to share with the band**, so we should be able to get a lot of the prep and rehearsal work done without compromising one's health. Accomplishing this and doing it with video on top, will at least give me something I and the band can promo with. I absolutely love the music!!

**I've got the recording gear setup and connected. But we all know the real juice comes from knowing how to use the gear. I am still learning how to get a decent kick sound. And my post-processing is dependent on my ability to master Ableton Live. It's going to be a challenge.
 

planoranger

Junior Member
Conclusion: Option (2) is less risk to injury but requires more practice time. The fact that the groove has a lope involving the high tom and floortom, probably doesn't penalize having two snare hit sources. Option (1) is ready to go today if you don't mind hitting the floortom with your LH (left hand). The gig is in October so likely to work up option (2).
I'm glad you found your voice for the tune. Go get 'em!!!
 

C.M. Jones

Well-known member
Chad's take with the 8th note hihat ostinato and four on the floor kick feels the most straight forward.

(1) Chad Wright
- kick : four on the floor
- hihat : straight 8th notes except on beat 4 (due to recovery from the high tom hit on (3) 'a')
- floortom : a little stretch hit with the snare hand, but doable
- high tom : requires fast move from hihat on (3) '&' to 'a' - doable with rotation/supination of the forearm
- PROS : keeps the groove using the dominant side, therefore more likely to remain consistent
- CONS : stretch move to hit the floortom; if you suck, someone could time a tomato hit and you wouldn't know what hit you

(2) Open handed Chad Wright (hitting snare on beat 4 with LH)
- kick : four on the floor
- hihat : straight 8th notes except on beat 4 (due to hitting the snare)
- floortom : no problem with the right hand
- high tom : no problem with the right hand
- PROS : no stretch move needed to hit the floortom; eyes can stay where the fun is - the dancing crowd, or if a non-dancing crowd, those with tomatoes in their hands
- CONS : groove is using the less dominant side, so risk goes up; needs practice; snare hits are being shared over both hands and adds risk to an inconsistent backbeat sound; the 16th note variation for beat 1 using the non-dominant LH needs practice, and this is also complicated by the fact that the hihat surface is moving during the open/close pattern

(3) The same as (2) but hitting the snare on beat 4 with RH (instead of LH)
PROS : all snare hits coming from the same source - the dominant RH
CONS : the snare hit on beat 4 requires a double strike due to the high tom hit on (3) 'a' - high risk screw up the consistent backbeat sound

Conclusion: Option (2) is less risk to injury but requires more practice time. The fact that the groove has a lope involving the high tom and floortom, probably doesn't penalize having two snare hit sources. Option (1) is ready to go today if you don't mind hitting the floortom with your LH (left hand). The gig is in October so likely to work up option (2).
I'm thoroughly impressed. Your triple-tiered examination and conclusion involves more analysis than I've devoted to cover songs over the course of thirty-six years of drumming. I'm not being flippant or satirical here. You're thinking these parts out bigtime. I've always just grasped the lifeblood of a groove, then added my own sticking patterns, accents, and fills as appropriate -- not in a way that revolutionizes the song but in one that always grants me room for improvisation. I'm probably one of those drummers who never play a cover song the same way twice. The marrow is always there, just not note-for-note replication.

You're using the term "risk" a lot. The only real risk in drumming is not enjoying yourself. Have fun preparing.
 

rhumbagirl

Senior Member
I'm thoroughly impressed. Your triple-tiered examination and conclusion involves more analysis than I've devoted to cover songs over the course of thirty-six years of drumming. I'm not being flippant or satirical here. You're thinking these parts out bigtime. I've always just grasped the lifeblood of a groove, then added my own sticking patterns, accents, and fills as appropriate -- not in a way that revolutionizes the song but in one that always grants me room for improvisation. I'm probably one of those drummers who never play a cover song the same way twice. The marrow is always there, just not note-for-note replication.

You're using the term "risk" a lot. The only real risk in drumming is not enjoying yourself. Have fun preparing.
Ah, don't worry MJ, it looks worse than it is. My problem is I feel I have to share what's going with others here on DW. I'm not going to do this for every song I come across. I do type well, and I enjoy talking technical. As long as I have time that is - not likely now that I have this song list in front of me, and add to that the disco drum sound, mixing, recording, etc. This one tune deserves the extra attention IMHO.
 

C.M. Jones

Well-known member
Ah, don't worry MJ, it looks worse than it is. My problem is I feel I have to share what's going with others here on DW. I'm not going to do this for every song I come across. I do type well, and I enjoy talking technical. As long as I have time that is - not likely now that I have this song list in front of me, and add to that the disco drum sound, mixing, recording, etc. This one tune deserves the extra attention IMHO.
Type away! This thread stands to become one of the more intriguing sagas in the forum.
 
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