Imagine if...

ottog1979

Senior Member
So I have a take on this. Non-drummer musicians and the audience may not know the technicalities, mistakes and perfection of drummers, but they do know what feels good. That's the biggest and most important measure. Mistakes can, and often do, get in the way of making the music feel good. But there can also be play with perfection that doesn't feel that great. The end goal is not about the technicalities, it's about conveying the FEELING. (Authentically, I might add.)
 

larryace

"Uncle Larry"
Larry:

Maybe you are hoping for one of us to make the following comment:

“I have played with great musicians, and I’ve played with some really bad musicians. And it seems to me nobody knows how great a drummer I really am. My talents are always evaluated based on the band I’m playing with. I wish more musicians and people in the audience were intimate with drums and how to play them. Then everyone would know what a great a drummer I am.”

There, is that what you wanted to hear. I suspect there are some famous drummers who feel this way.

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Thanks Jim.

Sorry, but I wasn't looking for that at all. It's not about me at all, it's literally about everyone else in my mind when I play drums. The musicians and the audience and the management. When they are happy, and it's easy to tell, well that's my goal.

Still, I'd be lying if I said I didn't think we could get maybe just a little bit more consideration.

I was just taking that to the extreme.
 

Andy

Administrator
Staff member
Non-drummer musicians and the audience may not know the technicalities, mistakes and perfection of drummers, but they do know what feels good.
This is exactly where it's at!

This is why I don't do performance clinics. The less I play, the more my status as a pro is preserved!
You do yourself a disservice Jon, I've heard you play :)
I completely get you though. Every player has a certain skill set. Some have incredible technical facility. Some have great delivery & interpretation skills. Some are highly cooperative with a strong work ethic. Each of these categories will get you work. Very occasionally, the top few have all that & more.
 

Zaxx

Member
Here's one possible definition of a good drummer or indeed any musician: one who can cover their mistakes in such a way that they seem deliberate! I know I'm now defining myself as a 'good drummer', but I'll stick my neck out and say I certainly do it - that dropped snare beat can be plastered over with a cascade of out-of-time cymbal splashes and picked up on the following bar, that mistimed cymbal crash turned into a beat-and-half that brings you back in tempo and so on. I work with a guitarist who's an expert at this; if he plays a wrong note in a solo he'll immediately play it again - perhaps several times with varied dynamics - so it sounds clever and delberate - then bends or slides it to where it should have been in the first place. Everyone thinks he's just dropped in a bit of bebop harmony!

One other thing: I own a single-headed Flats Pro kit for gigs that are short on space. I've plastered the clear bass drum head with logo stickers to prevent people from checking out my pedal work too closely - it's always the first thing to go by the end of the gig if I'm not on form. :giggle:
 

Rattlin' Bones

Gold Member
They don't???

Just humor me here. The UK guys can humour me as well.

To put things into perspective, imagine if every audience member knew everything you are doing, knew every mistake you're making, every off the mark hit, every timing error....but also all the good things. All of it registered. They all understand drums.

Right now we operate in relative anonymity. I've run into my fair share of fine musicians who are at a loss when it comes to talking drums. If they don't know, the audience doesn't know even more.

So which way would you prefer it?

Anonymity kind of like it is now or would you prefer that everyone is fully aware and focused on everything you're doing at all times?

Like I said, humor me please
 

Stroman

Platinum Member
This question reminds me of a conversation I had with a friend who happens to love music, but isn't a musician.

I was describing an interesting syncopation in a Cage The Elephant song, and she asked if I always thought about music that way, meaning do I analyze what I hear. I said yes, I usually do. I also enjoy it for what it is, but I can't help thinking about it when I hear something like that.

She said, "I'd hate to experience music that way. I just want to hear it, not analyze it."

That was profound to me. I believe thinking about music is the musician's realm, and I'd hate to saddle the listener with that burden. ?
 

Xstr8edgtnrdrmrX

Well-known member
I have always approach playing like everyone in the audience knows what I am doing...like there is an expectation of perfection. Possibly b/c I grew up in a family of musicians and was always under scrutiny. But I actually feed off of that "inner competition". I also think doing competitive band stuff in high school burned that mindset in too.

I have never wanted recognition for playing though...like at shows, when we are done, I try to "hide" in the merch booth, or in the back of the venue. I never got into music for the recognition...I got into it for the personal challenge of playing. I do enjoy when other people are moved by what we do in a band, and I realize that musical endeavors for the audience are more social than anything else, but being an introvert, "social" is always the last thing on my mind in an activity.

And going off of @Stroman comment about his friend, I find absolute enjoyment of listening to music analytically...again, because I like how the bits and pieces work and fit together. It is interesting how people hear and find different things in artistic endeavors...part of enjoying the song for me is seeing how the artist put it together
 
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Bozozoid

Well-known member
This is why I don't do performance clinics. The less I play, the more my status as a pro is preserved!

As for playing with Al, drummers are a severe minority in the audience. :) Besides, I'm really only concerned with what the boss thinks of my playing, and so far so good after 40 years!
Bermuda..thats impressive. I've seen you on many award shows over the years. 40 years!..trying to get inside the minds of all the various drummers you've had to emulate. I've wondered SO many times how lucrative that gig would be but I'll be a gentleman.
 

Sakae2xBopster

Well-known member
When I'm attending a concert I usually listen on two different levels, simultaneously. On the one hand, I'm taking in the whole experience and enjoying how the band functions together as a unit. At the same time, I always have one eye on the drummer, constantly critiquing everything they are doing. (Sorry, Bermuda, but to me as an audience member every show is a performance clinic to some extent!) I'm constantly comparing the performer's superior skill set to my own, trying to learn new techniques. I saw Michael Jerome a couple of years ago with Better Than Ezra, and his paying really got me thinking about how I use my side snare and cowbell.

 

CommanderRoss

Silver Member
Just humor me here. The UK guys can humour me as well.

To put things into perspective, imagine if every audience member knew everything you are doing, knew every mistake you're making, every off the mark hit, every timing error....but also all the good things. All of it registered. They all understand drums.

Right now we operate in relative anonymity. I've run into my fair share of fine musicians who are at a loss when it comes to talking drums. If they don't know, the audience doesn't know even more.

So which way would you prefer it?

Anonymity kind of like it is now or would you prefer that everyone is fully aware and focused on everything you're doing at all times?

Like I said, humor me please

Anonymity is KING!!
I played with a guy in a duo set up that swore the audience heard every mistake. Then when they'd come up after the show & compliment us on a great performance, he was bewildered.:rolleyes:
As most of our gigs were at a bar, I didn't really care either way. I knew maybe 3-4 audience members heard mistakes, but the rest didn't.
Having fun & playing the role was all I needed to get out of it. Any money was a bonus.

As long as we were bringing people into the place to buy drinks. food and the rest...all was good.
Oh...and once the alcohol kicked in, we were perfect. :LOL:
 

Push pull stroke

Platinum Member
Bermuda..thats impressive. I've seen you on many award shows over the years. 40 years!..trying to get inside the minds of all the various drummers you've had to emulate. I've wondered SO many times how lucrative that gig would be but I'll be a gentleman.


He had a day job until the late 90s. *shrug* but there are definitely drummers you’ve heard of who live in their mom’s basement when not on tour. LOL
 

Juniper

Gold Member
I’ve told this story before on here but many years ago I had some guy start a conversation with me at the bar at a venue, eventually asking me what I thought about the band that had just finished.

....I headed to the bar as I was a little thirsty and sweaty as I was the drummer in that band.

And yes, he was being serious. We had a whole conversation about the pros and cons of the (my) band and he didn't realise I was the drummer and I didn't point it out either. Way too much fun to be had.

I was rather critical, he seemed to enjoy it - which was nice to hear.

From them on I ‘got it’ about the drummers role. Especially since it was a tiny venue, we played for about an hour and I just spent a few minutes on stage (alone) setting down my gear.

I still chuckle when I think about that.

However back to the point. I’d much prefer people enjoy the music, as long as my bandmates are happy with how I did and the audience have a good time that’s all that matters. It’s always about the music.

I’m not fussed if people appreciate my playing and/or understand it, very happy to be anonymous and invisible.
 
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