toddbishop
Platinum Member
I think it's Guerin on the major funky stuff-- I haven't listened to that whole album in awhile, I never figured out who else is on what on it.
Thank you, you're very kind!
Drummer for Dirty Harry movie soundtrack? (Answered: John Guerin, Larry Bunker, and Mel Lewis)
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I think it's Guerin on the major funky stuff-- I haven't listened to that whole album in awhile, I never figured out who else is on what on it.
Thank you, you're very kind!
Super Phil
Senior Member
Always dug the music and playing on the Dirty Harry soundtrack... one of my favorite movies.
dcrigger
PRO DRUMMER
I agree with Todd re: this being primarily John Guerin.
Today i sat down a listened through a chunk of the first half of it. And tracks 2, 4, 5, 6, and 7 (there's no drums on track 1) all sound totally like Guerin in both approach and sound (particularly the toms). And considering this was 1971, both his sound and approach were very identifiable and unique.
But for instance track #3 has a very different sound and feel - and sure, it might be Guerin just sounding that way. But it could easily be any number of other players - possibly explaining the Mel Lewis mention.
As for Bunker - I'm hearing no hint of there being two drummers at the same time or anything like that - but there is tabla - which "Bunk" played. In fact, that tabla with funk drums sound they get on a number of tracks shows a year or so later on the Pat Williams "Threshold" that features Guerin and Bunker on drums and perc, respectively. And it sounds and feels _exactly_ the same.
So I would guess that all of the stuff that sounds like #2, 5 & 7 (or has the tom sounds apparent on those tracks) would be Guerin (drums) & Bunker (perc). Anything sounding different could be "who knows?"
But IMO it is the tracks like 2, 5 & 7 that have made this a memorable recording - one that continues to re-surface in these types of discussions some 51 years later.
Man - I loved Guerin's playing during this whole period. All of the TV and film scores, the Williams record, and all of the stuff with Tom Scott and the LA Express.
Today i sat down a listened through a chunk of the first half of it. And tracks 2, 4, 5, 6, and 7 (there's no drums on track 1) all sound totally like Guerin in both approach and sound (particularly the toms). And considering this was 1971, both his sound and approach were very identifiable and unique.
But for instance track #3 has a very different sound and feel - and sure, it might be Guerin just sounding that way. But it could easily be any number of other players - possibly explaining the Mel Lewis mention.
As for Bunker - I'm hearing no hint of there being two drummers at the same time or anything like that - but there is tabla - which "Bunk" played. In fact, that tabla with funk drums sound they get on a number of tracks shows a year or so later on the Pat Williams "Threshold" that features Guerin and Bunker on drums and perc, respectively. And it sounds and feels _exactly_ the same.
So I would guess that all of the stuff that sounds like #2, 5 & 7 (or has the tom sounds apparent on those tracks) would be Guerin (drums) & Bunker (perc). Anything sounding different could be "who knows?"
But IMO it is the tracks like 2, 5 & 7 that have made this a memorable recording - one that continues to re-surface in these types of discussions some 51 years later.
Man - I loved Guerin's playing during this whole period. All of the TV and film scores, the Williams record, and all of the stuff with Tom Scott and the LA Express.
Al Strange
Platinum Member
I’m a massive fan of the film and soundtrack. Great info above.
Cmdr. Ross
Platinum Member
Composers like Lalo Schifrin and Henry Mancini always used choice players for their recordings. I love the drums in the beginning of Dirty Harry & it's a groove that's most infectious.
jda
Diamond Member
He and Joni Mitchell were close and he passed away Young (64..
en.wikipedia.org
reverb.com
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John Guerin - Wikipedia
Zildjian 22" K. Istanbul Ride Cymbal - 2471g - Owned by John Guerin! | Reverb
Here is a very special 22" Zildjian K. Istanbul ride cymbal! This ride weighs in at 2471 grams and has a rich history that has been preserved in its physical and sonic characteristics with age. It is a prime example of the quintessential 22" K. Istanbul ride sound so many of us strive to achieve ...
reverb.com
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One of my favs.
Tom Scott and the LA express - album: Tom Cat.
Title track: Rock Island Rocket! So many other great tracks..
That's one of the albums I'd take with me if I had to go and live on a deserted island and could only take 10 albums!
Oh.. and don't forget the theme from Hawaii 5-0. John Guerin all the way!
green glass drum
Well-known Member
A great JG performance with LA X on this one.
Flam Sidestick....and massive hemiola.
Flam Sidestick....and massive hemiola.
toddbishop
Platinum Member
Those are great. He is the sound of the early 70s. Do you know if this is him on Newhart?
dcrigger
PRO DRUMMER
There was a thread back in 2015 on DFO that touched on these question.... At that time I posted list that I had put together of who played drums on what (there was a great YouTube channel back then that was posting scads of "Who Played That Theme" credit listings. So...
Lost in Space - John Williams, composer; Shelly Manne, drums; Emil Richards and Larry Bunker, perc
Starsky and Hutch - Tom Scott, composer; Rick Marotta, drums; Steve Gadd and Ralph McDonald, perc.
Mary Tyler Moore - Pat Williams, composer; John Guerin, drums; again Emil and Larry, perc
Magnum P.I. - Mike Post, composer; Mike Baird, drums; Jeff Gerson, perc
CHiPs - John Parker, composer; Steve Schaeffer, drums
Gilligan's Island - Shelly Manne, drums
The Odd Couple - and there it is - Earl Palmer, drums
Ironside - Quincey Jones, composer; Earl Palmer, drums
The Flintstones - Alvin Stoller, drums
Quincy, M.E - Steve Schaeffer, drums
The Rockford Files - Mike Baird, drums (as expected)
The Jeffersons - Ed Greene, drums
Sanford and Sons - Quincey, composer; James Gadson, drums
Fame - Yogi Horton, drums
Three's Company - Hal Blaine, drums
Welcome Back Kotter - Jeff Porcaro, drums
The Golden Girls - Jeff again on drums
Brady Bunch - Earl Palmer
Mork and Mindy - Harvey Mason, drums
I Dream of Jeannie - Earl Palmer, drums
Wild Wild West - brush solos - Joe Porcaro!!
Barney Miller - John Guerin
Top Cat (cartoon) - Alvin Stoller
Knot's Landing - J.R. Robinson (though I did play on the pilot -
though not on the theme - :-( )Mission Impossible - again, Earl Palmer; Ken Watson and Emil Richards, perc. and Adolfo (Chino) Valdes on bongos
Which doesn't answer your question because Newhart isn't on it....
From what I can find - that 4th season version is an outlier. Replacing the earlier version with this more funky thing. The song itself is the same (written by Lorenzo Music) but the arrangement is very different. And does indeed sound it could again, Pat Williams - and sounds again, very much like John Guerin. Though by that time, it could've also been arranged by Tom Scott - as Pat Williams having by them written so many successful themes, wasn't as available to do simply arranging work. But who knows? Anyway - sounds very much Guerin to me.
toddbishop
Platinum Member
There was a thread back in 2015 on DFO that touched on these question.... At that time I posted list that I had put together of who played drums on what (there was a great YouTube channel back then that was posting scads of "Who Played That Theme" credit listings. So...
Lost in Space - John Williams, composer; Shelly Manne, drums; Emil Richards and Larry Bunker, perc
Starsky and Hutch - Tom Scott, composer; Rick Marotta, drums; Steve Gadd and Ralph McDonald, perc.
Mary Tyler Moore - Pat Williams, composer; John Guerin, drums; again Emil and Larry, perc
Magnum P.I. - Mike Post, composer; Mike Baird, drums; Jeff Gerson, perc
CHiPs - John Parker, composer; Steve Schaeffer, drums
Gilligan's Island - Shelly Manne, drums
The Odd Couple - and there it is - Earl Palmer, drums
Ironside - Quincey Jones, composer; Earl Palmer, drums
The Flintstones - Alvin Stoller, drums
Quincy, M.E - Steve Schaeffer, drums
The Rockford Files - Mike Baird, drums (as expected)
The Jeffersons - Ed Greene, drums
Sanford and Sons - Quincey, composer; James Gadson, drums
Fame - Yogi Horton, drums
Three's Company - Hal Blaine, drums
Welcome Back Kotter - Jeff Porcaro, drums
The Golden Girls - Jeff again on drums
Brady Bunch - Earl Palmer
Mork and Mindy - Harvey Mason, drums
I Dream of Jeannie - Earl Palmer, drums
Wild Wild West - brush solos - Joe Porcaro!!
Barney Miller - John Guerin
Top Cat (cartoon) - Alvin Stoller
Knot's Landing - J.R. Robinson (though I did play on the pilot -
!!!
Mission Impossible - again, Earl Palmer; Ken Watson and Emil Richards, perc. and Adolfo (Chino) Valdes on bongos
Which doesn't answer your question because Newhart isn't on it....
They had a different way of using the tom toms-- or maybe that's just Guerin.
I had Sol Gubin and Paul Humphrey on Barney Miller-- don't know where I got that, turned it up somewhere.
Two more I'd like to find out are Medical Center and People's Court-- those both killed.
dcrigger
PRO DRUMMER
The thing is with these - like Barney Miller - and I know this has come up with Mission Impossible.
It was very common back then to re-record the theme each season - oftentimes to give it a facelift each year. And it cost very little to do so - write a new arrangement and pay for studio time... because each year the musicians received a 100% re-use fee. So you could pay the fee and use the same recording again (which many) or re-record a new, slightly different version (which also many did).
Point being - you could have different players playing on slightly different versions of the show's theme (even if they were very very similar). Plus there's the whole soundtrack album issue. Lala Schifrin released a very popular Mission Impossible soundtrack recorded - which was entirely different sessions than the TV show. Thus Chino Valdez played the MI bongos AND Emil Richards played the MI bongos.... generally the only way to figure it out is left to those with access to old contracts or.... ask the players themselves.... Yet these are all guys that play 5-15 sessions a week for decades - and knowing that a show was a hit didn't happen until months after playing the session. So these guys often couldn't remember that they played on a year earlier, let alone 50 years ago!
Heck I only played on one theme that made to air - and I had forgotten all about it until my sister brought it up a couple of years ago. It was just a long time ago, and again, most of the time you don't know a sessions going to be memorable until long after you played it.
Anyway - I love this era of TV and film drum set playing - hugely influential on me. And of course by the 80's, films (inspired by Star Wars) had all gone classical. And by 84, TV would serious catch the Miami Vice bug - as well as going more classical as well. Bringing to an end to the "Jazz in film" era that started with Anatomy of a Murder in film and Peter Gunn on TV.
Supernoodle
Senior Member
Hey I noticed this, watching old runs of The Streets of San Francisco, and Rockford files, changing versions sometimes for the better, sometimes worse. The original Streets theme was spectacular...
later version - no wah, no buzz rolls:
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You forgot the awesome theme from Alf :
Vinnie C!