Don't see one of these everyday

wildbill

Platinum Member
Yeah, that looks like what I've read before - linked to from cymbalholics - so I'm pretty sure it's legit. That's a very good-looking cymbal you got there - seems like a score to me!

The guy who posted the original ad replied and said it was around 7000 grams. Not quite 12k but quite a beast nonetheless!
Ha ha - 15 and a half pounds. Yep, that'd do some damage to your toes (if not take 'em off), if you dropped it on them.
You could get your weight lifting sessions in on your practice breaks - ha.



... I wonder how it sounds.

I'll bet that 30 incher sounds like The Voice of the Gods.
 

MikeM

Platinum Member

wildbill

Platinum Member
The lathing and hammering......... particularly the distinct lathe lines.

I own several and have owned a bunch more. I just know what they look like.

OK, thanks. I guess most of my Zildjians are "A's" then. When I bought some of them decades ago, a local drum store owner/guru picked out, and included the cymbals with the kit I bought, and didn't really say what they were, except to say they were Zildjians.

For some reason, I thought the moniker 'A' was more recent. Didn't have a clue then, and don't know much more now - ha ha.
 

Pocket-full-of-gold

Platinum Member
For some reason, I thought the moniker 'A' was more recent. Didn't have a clue then, and don't know much more now - ha ha.
The ink stamp moniker 'A' is recent, but the A (or Avedis) series cymbal is as old as the US arm of the company itself. Until only a few decades ago A's or K's were all that was available from Zildjian. Originally the A's were made in the US with the K's being made in Turkey. Around '68 both lines started to be manufactured in the States. Everything else in the Zildjian line (A Custom, K Custom, Z, Z Custom, Z3 and all the entry lines) came later (late 80's onwards). The history is a lot more involved, but that gives you a general overview.

If you have a cymbal from the 80's or before, it's either gonna be an A or a K. The two are easy to tell apart.

Zildjian have a timeline on their website if it's of any interest: http://zildjian.com/About/History/Historical-Timeline
 

tamadrm

Platinum Member
I was thinking 60's by the with of the lathing grooves.I think 60's A Zildjians were some of the best they ever made.:)

Steve B
 

wildbill

Platinum Member
...Zildjian have a timeline on their website if it's of any interest: http://zildjian.com/About/History/Historical-Timeline

Yes, it's of interest - thanks for that. When I think cymbals, I think Zildjian.

Can't help it - ha ha.

I've been looking at a fair amount of new and used cymbals lately, and notice that while many sound and look similar, the new ones are noticeably thinner and lighter than the older ones. Maybe that's what's caused some of the increase in breakage?
Either that, or the newer generations are harder hitters.
 

MikeM

Platinum Member
... the new ones are noticeably thinner and lighter than the older ones. Maybe that's what's caused some of the increase in breakage?
Either that, or the newer generations are harder hitters.
Funny you say that because the general consensus seems to be that today's Zildjians are heavier than they were a generation ago. I don't happen to agree with that (not entirely, anyway), though Zildjian does make some pretty thick cymbals (Mediums & Rocks have always been heavy). But they also sell a lot of Fast Crashes (paper thin) and Thins (thin, of course).

Bottom line is that Zildjian (and everyone else) have always pretty much offered thinner and thicker cymbals simultaneously. It's worth it to spend some time on their websites or grab their full-color marketing propaganda. Familiarize yourself with the relative weights and what they call them. That way, next time you hit an A Custom Crash, you'll know why it sounds sorta thin - because it is! (unlike the the A Custom Projection and Medium Crashes, which are thicker)
 

wildbill

Platinum Member
The thickness measurements I gave in post #11, I got using a dial calipers, like this: http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/MITUTOYO-Dial-Caliper-4LA83
Check enough thicknesses and you can develop 'calibrated fingers'.

I haven't actually brought the calipers into a store and mic'd up new ones though, so it could be that I have pre-concieved notions.

And also - I was referring mostly to ride cymbals, because that's where my focus has been lately. Zildjian does make some pretty thin crashes though.

EDIT: Just took a peek at the Zildjian site, and for new cymbals, they use generic terms such as medium, heavy, thin, paper thin, and so on. Useful, but not real specific.



.
 
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tard

Gold Member
I noticed he said in the ad that it was made in Canada by Robert Zildjian before the split and he changed the Canadian plant to Sabian. Just for the record the Canadian Zildjian plant only made K series and the A series was made in the USA plant.
 

MikeM

Platinum Member
The thickness measurements I gave in post #11, I got using a dial calipers...

And also - I was referring mostly to ride cymbals, because that's where my focus has been lately. Zildjian does make some pretty thin crashes though.

EDIT: Just took a peek at the Zildjian site, and for new cymbals, they use generic terms such as medium, heavy, thin, paper thin, and so on. Useful, but not real specific.
The only problem I can see using calipers like that to gauge thickness is you're missing the data points that tell you about the taper. If you had outside calipers with arms long enough to reach up the bell, you could take a dozen or so measurements between the bell and edge to build your own picture of how the cymbal is tapered. One of the nice things about Sabian's website is it gives a little cross-section cartoon to give you an idea of the taper and profile. It's never going to be exact, though. There's a human lathe operator in most cases that shaves off metal and he determines the exact taper that way. That's also why generic terms like thin, medium-thin, medium, etc are used - there's not really a better way to do it, IMO. Even putting a gram weight on a cymbal is only one piece of information that doesn't tell you the whole story. That's why you need to actually play them so you can hear what they sound like and how they respond under the stick.

For example, the Omni cymbals are thick like a ride cymbal at the part of the bow closest to the bell (out to roughly half way out), but then it tapers down sharply so that it's really thin at the edge, which makes it crashable. That's kind of a unique cymbal design that's all in the taper. Their gram weights are probably very similar to other medium weight ride cymbals.
 

wildbill

Platinum Member
You've got a good point there.
I imagine a lot of different shapes and tapers have been tried. Maybe someone's even tried some type of mild reverse taper. Although it seems that could lead to trouble at the thin areas.
Probably a lot more to it than meets the eye.
 

MikeM

Platinum Member
Just for the record the Canadian Zildjian plant only made K series and the A series was made in the USA plant.
Are you sure about that? I was under the impression that all the Ks were made there, but also some As. I thought I read somewhere that Neil Peart's 22" A Ping Ride was made in Canada. I'll try to verify that.
 

tard

Gold Member
Are you sure about that? I was under the impression that all the Ks were made there, but also some As. I thought I read somewhere that Neil Peart's 22" A Ping Ride was made in Canada. I'll try to verify that.
Pretty sure, Avedis Zildjian started his company in Quincy Mass. making all the A's there and when production of the K's was ceased in Turkey they moved it all to Meductic NB. where they had been making the 2 different Zilco's, non hammered rolled ones and the hand hammered ones . When it became Sabian any unfinished K pies became Sabian HH's.

From: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sabian

The settlement gave Robert Zildjian the Canadian factory that had been producing the K. Zildjian line (all manufacturing in Turkey having ceased by this time).
 
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