Deliberate Practice - Methodology and Practice Skills

Jonathan Curtis

Silver Member
Hi all,

I have always been fascinated by the act of practising. Ahead of research for a new book, I have made this the topic of this week's Snare Drum Virtuoso Podcast episode.

In it, I talk about the five pillars of deliberate practice:
- Goals
- Focus
- Feedback
- Repetition
- Reinforcement

I then go on to discuss engagemenet with the artform on a deeper basis, and how this is at least as important as the act of practising itself.
I hope you enjoy!

https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/snaredrumvirtuoso (available on Spotify, Apple Music, and Amazon).

YouTube version:

J
 
Last edited:
I listened and enjoyed your podcast on my walk today. What great insights!You mentioned a few researches that you follow. Could you share their names and perhaps any books they‘ve written. Thank you!
 
I listened and enjoyed your podcast on my walk today. What great insights!You mentioned a few researches that you follow. Could you share their names and perhaps any books they‘ve written. Thank you!

Thanks Paul!

A good starting point for many of the broader concepts in Andrew Huberman of Stanford University. He has a major podcast and YouTube series that covers many of the cutting edge models.

Beyond that, I’ll see if I can find my collection of citations and get back to you. A lot of this was based on research I did for this book, which has a comprehensive citation list.
 
I hope to have a chance to listen later this week. As a hobbyist semi-pro player, working a day job 40+ hrs a week, I try to use my practice time with sticks in my hands. But I've got a full semester of private instruction with a percussion department professor behind me. So I KNOW what to work on before my daily time-slot arrives. So maybe I'd like to see "Preparation" in the list above.

FWIW, there have been times when I've been ready to hit things with sticks but I wasn't prepared with whatever book I was into at the time (or whatever technique is presented on video DVD or Youtube). There's a lot of work behind the scenes in learning WHAT to practice. Of course my practice habit is working on technique simultaneously with composition and coordination. Sometimes that isn't a 50/50 endeaver, like right now I'm learning a significantly different trad grip, and it's 20/80 within a time-slot that's 30-60 minutes a day, and 60 minutes of jam session once a week.

So maybe what I'm saying is, I'd like to ... I'm hoping to hear in the podcast something about an approach for those that have hobbyist short term goals (hey I have to believe I'll be good enough one day to drop the engineer job, but for now I'm okay executing in a performing jazz ensemble at the local college).
 
I hope to have a chance to listen later this week. As a hobbyist semi-pro player, working a day job 40+ hrs a week, I try to use my practice time with sticks in my hands. But I've got a full semester of private instruction with a percussion department professor behind me. So I KNOW what to work on before my daily time-slot arrives. So maybe I'd like to see "Preparation" in the list above.

FWIW, there have been times when I've been ready to hit things with sticks but I wasn't prepared with whatever book I was into at the time (or whatever technique is presented on video DVD or Youtube). There's a lot of work behind the scenes in learning WHAT to practice. Of course my practice habit is working on technique simultaneously with composition and coordination. Sometimes that isn't a 50/50 endeaver, like right now I'm learning a significantly different trad grip, and it's 20/80 within a time-slot that's 30-60 minutes a day, and 60 minutes of jam session once a week.

So maybe what I'm saying is, I'd like to ... I'm hoping to hear in the podcast something about an approach for those that have hobbyist short term goals (hey I have to believe I'll be good enough one day to drop the engineer job, but for now I'm okay executing in a performing jazz ensemble at the local college).

Actually, I think you will find something of use. When discussing deliberate practice, I talk about how the most important first step is setting an achievable and measurable goal. When somebody has limited practice time, this step become the most important.

Please let me know, once you've had chance to listen.
 
Actually, I think you will find something of use. When discussing deliberate practice, I talk about how the most important first step is setting an achievable and measurable goal. When somebody has limited practice time, this step become the most important.

Please let me know, once you've had chance to listen.
Just had a chance to listen and I think while everything you covered was insightful and .... useful, I think my take on preparation as far as the method books plays a part in that "deliberate" practice.

Enjoyed the podcast and loved your playing!

EDIT: I guess going back, I can say I did hear the part about shorter practice slots with more consistency/frequency, ie daily vs every MWF vs 8 hrs once a week. And that applies to the hobbyist with limited time outside of a day job. One could say the hobbyist has the benefit of being forced into shorter practice slots. But it isn't easy. I can tell you I have a drumset in my bedroom, across from my computer desk where I work from home. In the corner is a practice pad next to a music stand. When I take a break from working, I grab the sticks and work on the pad for a few minutes. Not everyone has all that in one place. Anyways, keep rockin!
 
Last edited:
Question: Can you elaborate on bars 9 and 11 of Solo No. 128 in The All American Drummer? For example, for bar 9, if I convert the 'LL' to 'L' and ignore the 'RR's, I get this:

RLLLRLLL | RLLLRLLL |

Now if the 'R' in the above are the quarter notes in 2/4, one can play that comfortably at say 60-70 bpm (don't understand why the solos in this book don't have tempo markings). But just adding 'R' in there as a substitute for the 'RR's we were ignoring and you get something a bit more challenging (2nd line below). Then replace 'R' with the intended 'RR' for the original composition (3rd line):

Code:
>           >   >           >
R...L...L...L...R...L...L...L...
R...L.R.L.R.L...R...L.R.L.R.L...
R...LLRRLLRRL...R...LLRRLLRRL...
1...e...&...a...2...e...&...a...

Is this the correct interpretation? If so, I think the useful tempo for such a piece is now around 50-60 bpm.

Thx ~
 
Last edited:
Question: Can you elaborate on bars 9 and 11 of Solo No. 128 in The All American Drummer? For example, for bar 9, if I convert the 'LL' to 'L' and ignore the 'RR's, I get this:

RLLLRLLL | RLLLRLLL |

Now if the 'R' in the above are the quarter notes in 2/4, one can play that comfortably at say 60-70 bpm (don't understand why the solos in this book don't have tempo markings). But just adding 'R' in there as a substitute for the 'RR's we were ignoring and you get something a bit more challenging (2nd line below). Then replace 'R' with the intended 'RR' for the original composition (3rd line):

Code:
>           >   >           >
R...L...L...L...R...L...L...L...
R...L.R.L.R.L...R...L.R.L.R.L...
R...LLRRLLRRL...R...LLRRLLRRL...
1...e...&...a...2...e...&...a...

Is this the correct interpretation? If so, I think the useful tempo for such a piece is now around 50-60 bpm.

Thx ~

I'm not quite sure I follow.

The easiest way to get the basic feel for bar 9 (and 11) is as follows.

Begin with four 16th notes: 1 e + a, R L R L.

Now, the scond and third strokes each become LLRR, four 64th notes in the space of one 16th note: R llrr llrr L R llrr llrr L, the e and the and of each beat have four strokes each.

Thanks for the kind words, anyhow!
 
@rhumbagirl Johnathan already answered correctly to you, in any case your "tab/numerical" deduction was correct too.

Regarding the tempo, since you asked, I play it for you at 1/4 note = 60bpm (UPDATED to 70 bpm) but you can play it faster or slower, I don´t think it is too important as long as the subdivision of the whole piece is all fine and uniform ...

Good luck!

Doing Measure 9 of Wilcoxon´s Solo 128:

ejemplo wilcoxon B 124 incognito. SMALLjpg.jpg
 
Last edited:
will listen to this when i mow the lawn tonight...I love the study of practicing!!!
 
I'm not quite sure I follow.

The easiest way to get the basic feel for bar 9 (and 11) is as follows.

Begin with four 16th notes: 1 e + a, R L R L.

Now, the scond and third strokes each become LLRR, four 64th notes in the space of one 16th note: R llrr llrr L R llrr llrr L, the e and the and of each beat have four strokes each.

Thanks for the kind words, anyhow!
Yes this is equivalent to what I'm saying!

Thx ~
 
Regarding the tempo, since you asked, I play it for you at 1/4 note = 60bpm but you can play it faster or slower,
I might disagree slightly here. The tempo is limited by how well one can execute the double-stroke roll at tempo AND catch the accent on the 'a' of the beat.

Anyways, we need to outlaw matched grip playing for sure HA HA!
 
I might disagree slightly here. The tempo is limited by how well one can execute the double-stroke roll at tempo AND catch the accent on the 'a' of the beat.

Anyways, we need to outlaw matched grip playing for sure HA HA!
It is understood in what I wrote, since if you execute it wrong it would no longer be the notes that are written, I tryed at 60bpm (later at 70 bpm on request of my girlfriend) because that´s was the speed you suggested.

Anyway, whatever reason you play it good luck on it 👍

Post your example, with Traditional, Matched or any grip you like!


Regards!
 
Last edited:
It is understood in what I wrote, since if you execute it wrong it would no longer be the notes that are written, I tryed at 60bpm because tht´s was the speed you suggested.

Anyway, whatever reason you play it good luck on it 👍

Post your example, with Traditional, Matched or any grip you like!


Regards!
Since you asked. This is a rough take since I didn't have a chance to warm up.

 
You are trying to bounce those 64ths, not articulate each of them, right?
Yes, bounce. I don't see how the physics can let you integrate with a fast bounce like this in a meaningful discernible way. Of course I could lower my stick height with the accents and maybe that would transfer the energy to the roll part better.

BTW, I didn't hear accent on the 'a' in yours. Your video is also harder to watch from the side angle. Just sayin :)

EDIT: Somehow I managed to record this in 2160 at 60fps. Although I see no difference in viewing it at 1080p. Enjoy the 42 seconds!!

(also, I'm still trying to integrate the new trad grip with my double stroke rolls anyway, so not too interested in digging into that right now... it'll get there)
 
Watcht it again, I just updated to 70bpm. After watching it....slow it down and 1) see if I do any bounced stroke and 2) if you don´t hear the accent.
To me bounced strokes belong to the family of the press rolls (no press rolls in the whole "150 Wilcoxon´s" book), but whatever, anyway. I think it is nice you did it, honestly!, I wanted to see how you study, I know you are serious about it!!!

Greetings!

P.S.: I never warm up!
 
Last edited:
Question: Can you elaborate on bars 9 and 11 of Solo No. 128 in The All American Drummer? For example, for bar 9, if I convert the 'LL' to 'L' and ignore the 'RR's, I get this:

RLLLRLLL | RLLLRLLL |

Now if the 'R' in the above are the quarter notes in 2/4, one can play that comfortably at say 60-70 bpm (don't understand why the solos in this book don't have tempo markings). But just adding 'R' in there as a substitute for the 'RR's we were ignoring and you get something a bit more challenging (2nd line below). Then replace 'R' with the intended 'RR' for the original composition (3rd line):

Code:
>           >   >           >
R...L...L...L...R...L...L...L...
R...L.R.L.R.L...R...L.R.L.R.L...
R...LLRRLLRRL...R...LLRRLLRRL...
1...e...&...a...2...e...&...a...

Is this the correct interpretation? If so, I think the useful tempo for such a piece is now around 50-60 bpm.

All these old solos are wishy washy with the rhythm. There's a lot of ordinary stuff they don't know how to write, and people are supposed to get it by feel. I would play those 10 st. rolls, and the fast 5 st. rolls next to them, with a sixtuplet pulsation. They occur in the vicinity of some 16th triplets later in the piece, so it makes sense in context. It's straight out of Three Camps, and I have a feeling that's the they're expected to be played.

Here, I recorded the solo, tempo is 74 bpm:

 
All these old solos are wishy washy with the rhythm. There's a lot of ordinary stuff they don't know how to write, and people are supposed to get it by feel. I would play those 10 st. rolls, and the fast 5 st. rolls next to them, with a sixtuplet pulsation. They occur in the vicinity of some 16th triplets later in the piece, so it makes sense in context. It's straight out of Three Camps, and I have a feeling that's the they're expected to be played.
Yeah, that triplet pulse for the 10 st was what I first thought of, but I went with what I was written. Thx for the insight. I see the quintuplet form for the 11 st role as well. Thx ~

(so yeah, if 10 st is performed as sixtuplet then makes sense the tempo can be faster - since the figure is spread out more over the quarter note)
 
with a sixtuplet pulsation.
Nice playing Todd!

It might be what you say OR NOT for several reasons (I rather not discuss them).

Beyond that, I enjoyed your version! I finished this book (did it all on my own) when I was 15 y.o. (1973) and I don´t practice these type of things at all (even doing other excersises on pad) only play it with students eventually. For a beginner/intermediate they give a sense of accomplishment and a bit of competitive edge which is good for them to prepare for the really serious things.

Anyway Todd, I just did again the previous fragment, in the way of 64th not bounced notes, this time at 1/4 = 70 bpm.

Best regards!
 
Back
Top