Cymbal prices creeping up.

Rattlin' Bones

Gold Member
As far as vintage, cymbal price increases make sense to me: demand for old vintage jazz cymbals. It's hard to really find the magic in new cymbals that those vintage cymbals have; modern companies keep trying to copy it but not quite succeeding. You really want THAT sound then go find a vintage cymbal. Demand exceeds supply. A bit different than drums. With drums you have a lot more to assess: shell, bearing edges, lugs, rods, rims, and on snare the strainer. So yeah I can see why vintage cymbals would continue to appreciate while drums remain static or are depreciating. Seems a sellers market for vintage cymbals and buyers market for drums.
 

MrInsanePolack

Platinum Member
Brass and Bronze are alloys containing copper and thus, a recipe. Depending on the end-goal, the recipe can be altered to create desired outcomes like tonal qualities, conductivity, corrosion resistance or whatever.
Just like a cheesecake recipe, what has/hasn't been tried yet? (sidebar---I have a chocolate cheesecake in the oven)
We fill a 6W x 8L x 5H foot dumpster at work with copper wire scrap every so often, from re-winding motors and panel building. Never really asked how much we get for it when they take it in, but I bet it's A LOT!
Yes but copper is an element, not a recipe. The only way to make something that mimics copper in all of its properties is to make copper. If you want to make something that mimics copper, you need 29 protons, 29 electrons, and 35 neutrons. Change that formula and you have made something else that has it's own properties.

Bronze and brass have different hardnesses, electrical conductivity, color, etc. than copper. That's not a mimic.

The cheesecake is not a good example. There is no natural cheesecake. Wood is a naturally occurring thing. We can make synthetic wood, but it still is not wood and therefore does not contain the exact same properties as wood. It might look and act the same, but it's still different.
 

felonious69

Well-known member
Yes but copper is an element, not a recipe. The only way to make something that mimics copper in all of its properties is to make copper. If you want to make something that mimics copper, you need 29 protons, 29 electrons, and 35 neutrons. Change that formula and you have made something else that has it's own properties.

Bronze and brass have different hardnesses, electrical conductivity, color, etc. than copper. That's not a mimic.

The cheesecake is not a good example. There is no natural cheesecake. Wood is a naturally occurring thing. We can make synthetic wood, but it still is not wood and therefore does not contain the exact same properties as wood. It might look and act the same, but it's still different.
Right, but I was getting at cymbals are made from alloys. Obviously the cost of copper is gonna affect the pricing of their production. One part copper,1/4 part paprika...How many recipes have they tried? Someone referred to "that sound" from the seventies. Like I said, what has and hasn't been tried and what was done differently back then? Were they "mixing" more copper into the mix? Are they "mixing" in more copper now? Were the cymbals thicker or thinner or lathed and/or hammered differently?
I don't know. I am not a metallurgist.
There was a thread about 3D printed drums. Not gonna be "the same" as wood drums, but neither are the Acrylic ones. Some folks like metal snares over wood.
I'm just "discussing". I am still new to the whole drum world.
 

MrInsanePolack

Platinum Member
Right, but I was getting at cymbals are made from alloys. Obviously the cost of copper is gonna affect the pricing of their production. One part copper,1/4 part paprika...How many recipes have they tried? Someone referred to "that sound" from the seventies. Like I said, what has and hasn't been tried and what was done differently back then? Were they "mixing" more copper into the mix? Are they "mixing" in more copper now? Were the cymbals thicker or thinner or lathed and/or hammered differently?
I don't know. I am not a metallurgist.
There was a thread about 3D printed drums. Not gonna be "the same" as wood drums, but neither are the Acrylic ones. Some folks like metal snares over wood.
I'm just "discussing". I am still new to the whole drum world.
Oh okay, I misunderstood and thought you were referring to the Chinese making a copper mimic post.

In that case, the cheesecake totally works.

My cymbals are mostly old, and yes there is something about them that new cymbals just dont have. What it is, I dunno. Maybe cheesecake.
 
if the source materials and their associated costs go up, that gets passed along to us.
I don't doubt that point - I just wonder if it is really significant / the sole reason for increased prices. I suspect that new punitive duties, rising labor costs or other increases in running costs would contribute more. Do you have an example of a certain cymbal that has gone up in price by a lot this year? I don't keep tabs on those prices, so I wonder which numbers we're talking about.
Prices on commodities exchanges aren't the same as processed ingots, the shipping of said ingots, storage, insuring the now more expensive material, etc.
Processing the raw material shouldn't be more expensive just because the raw material is more expensive now. So unless there is some price gouging going on, the price of ingots should only increase by as much as the raw material's price increased, right? Storage and shipping also doesn't become more expensive - that was required before as well. I'm not saying that you're wrong because I really don't know how much the individual material and labor steps contribute to a cymbal's price but I guess that that increased price of copper would not lead to more than a few bucks of to the total costs.
 

someguy01

Well-known member
I just began twittering this year. Does anyone know how to view the twit that you responded to when someone else likes your twit?

I think I would develop a twitch disorder if I had to wake up every morning and go to work for a company with a similar sounding name.

EDIT: Change "someone" to "someone else".
Do yourself an immense favour, delete it now and never look back.
 

Drumolator

Platinum Member
There are still deals out there. Sabian has SR2 and Concept Crashes that are insanely good deals. I have bought three Concept Crashes and four SR2 cymbals, and to me they sound great. Peace and goodwill.
 

rhumbagirl

Senior Member
Do yourself an immense favour, delete it now and never look back.
It's an anonymous account, so I'm not concerned.

There's two types of social media user - those that want to build their brand (eg companies, CEOs, actors, musicians), and those that want a place to discuss topics (me).
 

felonious69

Well-known member
Do yourself an immense favour, delete it now and never look back.

I was showing pics of my drum set to a guy at work.
He started talking about FB marketplace and said I should go on there.
I said, "No, I shouldn't"
He says "Yeah, you should"
I said "Really!...No, I shouldn't."
 

iCe

Senior Member
I bought the A-Zildjian Sweet Ride pack in 2011 for €645. Today this pack costs €729. Could be inflation, but single cymbals are around €30 more expensive than when i bought them (comparing the K and K Custom cymbals i own).
 

GCRoberts

Well-known member
I asked my wife for an 8" and a 10" K Custom Dark Splash cymbal for Christmas. They listed at $300 for the two of them, but Cymbal Fusion knocked $60 off the price for holiday pricing. When they arrived she looked at them and said "that's all there is to them....and they cost that much?". I guess the smaller cymbals can make you think that. So I'm sure my wife would agree with the topic of this thread!
 

Sonorfan

Well-known member
Yeah. I guess we shouldn’t be surprised that the Chinese can make a good cymbal. Every Wuhan gong I’ve ever played sounded great. They’ve got a long history of making cymbals. But I admit to still being a little surprised at how good the Dream cymbals sound. Especially the Bliss hats.
Dream is a Canadian company that contracted with Wuhan to mfr cymbals
to their specs and over the years have expanded the lines. They are definitely a fine product at a bargain price. I have a 10 splash I bought while wintering in U.S. south 5 years ago that is v.g. I remember paying $65 and got home and it was $55 Canadian or 40% cheaper. But it was still less than the other name brands on the display.
SoI have a Pearl Compact Traveller drum kit/set I take to Jams. I had gone to lightweight Yamaha Crosstown hardware with a Hi Hat you can pick up with two fingers, so decided I wanted to use 10in hat cymbals on jams. I picked up a used Zil ZRT for $15 and it’s pure junk, sounds like hitting a brass plate, and sells new in Canada for $65...It works as a bottom hat so I’m not out much. My point here is that Ziljian has been turning out some low end crap at inflated prices and trading on their reputation whereas the new and newer guys on the block have been making some good stuff that is affordable. Dream is a perfect example and with copper going bonkers they are great options. Someone posted that the Chinese will come up with a low cost replacement for copper.. don’t rule that out. I visited China for 14 days in 2008 and had a real tour of major centers. I was amazed at their ingenuity.
Have a healthy New Year all.
 

IBitePrettyHard

Senior Member
If you've noticed and wondered why cymbals have been getting a bit more pricey, especially in the used market where prices/values are holding a bit more than in recent years, here's a 1-year pricing trend. At the close of business yesterday, copper was trading @ $3.63/pound on the commodities exchange.

View attachment 99103
Copper is now $4.57 per pound, a full dollar higher than when you started this thread. 😬 It was about $2.30 a year ago.

Get your cymbals, and brass/copper/bronze snare drums now.

Sounds like a good excuse to give your spouse. "Sorry about the kitchen remodel Honey, I gotta get this Copperphonic while it's cheap".

sBrOc2j.png
 
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MrInsanePolack

Platinum Member
Copper is now $4.57 per pound, a full dollar higher than when you started this thread. 😬 It was about $2.30 a year ago.
Jeez that's a lot. I just (yesterday) started making a copper chain mail curtain room divider. Perhaps I should have had the copper turned into a snare instead.
 

Lee-Bro

Senior Member
Time to buy a penny sorting machine.

Edited to add: Don't think you're going to get rich sorting '82 and earlier pennies for their copper. I've had this conversation many times w/ "copper bugs" who don't understand investing and trading in metals. "Copper bugs" are like "gold bugs" -people who, w/o, proper knowledge decide to buy into gold (or other semi-precious or precious metals) or other hot topic advertisements based on speculation of other uninformed "investors."

Here's a blog post which explains in easy reading why penny hoarding isn't economical: https://www.scrapmetaljunkie.com/61...ext=While the value of the,¢ each as of today.

As always, this is not financial advice.
 
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MntnMan62

Junior Member
Time for me to sell all that leftover copper pipe I have lying around. Hmmm. Maybe I'll be able to sell enough to buy ............... a new cymbal!!!
 

larryace

"Uncle Larry"
In the Philadelphia/South jersey area, plywood is 70 dollars a sheet and just 2 foot...24 inches of 12-2 romex is a dollar.

Wire that cost me 28 dollars for 250 feet 3 years ago is now 128 dollars for 250 feet.

It's killing me
 
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