Closest Match to Bill Stewart Ride?

RobertM

Platinum Member
I’m revisiting an old topic. I’m trying to find a ride that has a Bill Stewart sound and would like to know what you all would suggest.

I’m thinking Bosphorus SW Syncopation rides, maybe Zildjian 20” special dry crash cymbal, Agop Lenny White Epoch ride, Agop signature ride?

Would Paiste Dark Energy I in lower weights work for jazz?
 

Alain Rieder

Silver Member
Zildjian K Custom Dry Complex is meant to be what you're looking for, if you can find one.
I do have one.

 

s1212z

Silver Member
There are several others beyond these videos I forgot that replicate the underside lathe for the Bill sound, the PFs are probably sold at this point. Probably most important is his grip stiffness along with a tighter than normal wingnut screw on the cymbal stand. If I had to guess, Bill's choice is probably on the thinner side in the 2200s but IDK...I imagine he had the best pick possible, haha.



 

jaymandude

Active Member
I just heard a few new lighter 22 Renaissance in Maxwell’s NYC ( Good hands drum shop) that sound like those. The owner of the shop and I agreed on that , and I have a version II so I kind of know the sound.

Call them if you’re serious, they sounded good. Also, I have a bunch of Paiste. No way on that. Absolutely no way.
 

jda

Gold Member
^ hmm, a one-off thin Intermediate 22" old K with a chunk out flap ; )

``````

reminder
there's a side stick in old Ks -that's unlike any other cymbal- in that- you side stick- that harmonic (like guitar pick harmonic ) swells- and continues- (this the unique part - > whilst the ride stick pattern also goes along (the side stick swell is independent- unaffected- by continuing on with the stick ride)
It's like two cymbals-at once) within one. The side stick crash and the ride pattern exist separate
I can display it very easily with a 22" old K. I think it's because there are many hump and valleys (subtle but there) in old Ks. Where two sounds techniques actually can exist -fully independent of each other- at one time. Modern cymbals- most- are too neat and QC'ed- not all AK's
; an old K can sidestick swell harmonic activated sound and stick sound again at the same time- that's unusual.
Usually the side stick in a cymbal shuts down quick- like an 8th note; old K is more like quarter note; and is unaffected by returning to stick ride.
very few side stick like an old K. some new AK's do. the 22" Dark Medium has some of it (lots of lumps and a valley..) but that is overall way heavy of a cymbal. (and the bell is too large)
Someone ask PF to put a Kerope or smaller lower height style bell- he'll know what you mean- on a Cindy Dark Medium (again he'll know what you mean) and you may have a 22 Old K 60s.
PF told me once it was a challenge making that cymbal (suitable for club or arena was the order) and that it could have been in the K Con Series. If you take the arena aspects (mostly the cup some of the weight) away, from a Dark Medium it could would be in line with a 60s old K.
sorry went slight Ot

10/8/22 edit: all cymbals (I just checked..have the side stick/independent/ swell/ to tip sound/ I got a lil overexcited there myself (ha!
 
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s1212z

Silver Member
I just heard a few new lighter 22 Renaissance in Maxwell’s NYC ( Good hands drum shop) that sound like those. The owner of the shop and I agreed on that , and I have a version II so I kind of know the sound.
Do you recall what weights were you playing on the 22 Rens? My Ren is probably heavier side to the DCll, but yeah its got that razor taper that can slice tomatoes and flex. Profile does look similar though I think the Ren bell looks a bit beefier. Actually looks like the DCll flattens out on bell top but the DCl did not (?) and edge hammering quite a bit different...never heard both in the same room, would be nice to compare.
 

jaymandude

Active Member
Do you recall what weights were you playing on the 22 Rens? My Ren is probably heavier side to the DCll, but yeah its got that razor taper that can slice tomatoes and flex. Profile does look similar though I think the Ren bell looks a bit beefier. Actually looks like the DCll flattens out on bell top but the DCl did not (?) and edge hammering quite a bit different...never heard both in the same room, would be nice to compare.
I think it was almost 200 grams lighter than mine, around 2400. They might be on the reverb site now. You’re right about the Ren bell being bigger but the overall vibe was there
 

jda

Gold Member

jda

Gold Member
That Renaissance is not the one I am referring to in my post. Just saying :)
I knew that; was the only on reverb (too heavy by 200g I knew... Just thought I'd THROW it out there ; )
 

jda

Gold Member
bookmark


thru bass choruses side stick he's playing with happen;
that ride- appears- to have- dremel's all ? +/- over it?
Mezzrow Jazz Club - New York City - 12/25/21
(maybe it's one of his quieter old Ks he brought to the piano bar? (lol
 
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s1212z

Silver Member


there's a Renn ..Renn Kon..
That's about the weight on my ren, I'd agree with the description regarding that it plays much lighter, probably because the thinner taper and heaviness towards the bell. Definitely has distinctive 'zones', not just the length of the profile but the four cluster at the 12/3/6/9 position and subtle differences towards the 2-3" from the edge. It's the polar opposite of my thinner Kerope 22 which has a defined sound over a broad length. I suspect it's because the thick to thin gradient versus something more uniform.
 

jda

Gold Member
but cha need "more dremel"..


bookmarquis de sade
that in Dec 2021- that gig was an antique- 22" old K - I'll bet a drink at Mezzrow (which I imagine ain't cheap. lol
bout 17.50
 

jaymandude

Active Member
That's about the weight on my ren, I'd agree with the description regarding that it plays much lighter, probably because the thinner taper and heaviness towards the bell. Definitely has distinctive 'zones', not just the length of the profile but the four cluster at the 12/3/6/9 position and subtle differences towards the 2-3" from the edge. It's the polar opposite of my thinner Kerope 22 which has a defined sound over a broad length. I suspect it's because the thick to thin gradient versus something more uniform.
I’ve heard some great Keropes, and have a nice 19. But the majority of the rides at any weight don’t work with my touch, or what I’m hearing. Nice cymbals tho.
 

toddbishop

Platinum Member
^ hmm, a one-off thin Intermediate 22" old K with a chunk out flap ; )

Absent 60 years of aging and getting beat on, I'd be looking at a med-thin Turk, either Bosphorus (not Master) or Cymbal & Gong. Not Agop or Mehmet-- too funky. Or just get any decent 22" jazz cymbal that isn't too goofy and play it like Bill Stewart. A Mel Lewis Agop. A C&G with a heavy patina.

This kind of request is hard-- we're not hearing what he's hearing, or what we would hear if we played it. Do you have the kind of cymbal technique to sound like Bill Stewart?

Like a friend of mine studied with Danny Gottlieb, and Gottlieb had Mel Lewis's old A. that everybody loves-- friend said I played it and it sounded like s*, Danny played it and it sounded like s*.


Pretty Tony sounding cymbal there.
 

jda

Gold Member
Check Al Foster also at the mezzopiano; downtown
 
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