Black Beauty next to Pork Pie

mikyok

Platinum Member
From that A-B vid the Pork Pie sounded better.

The BB sounded like it was tuned a bit high though.

If I was laying down brand new dollar for either of those snares I'd want a brand new head as well.
 

KamaK

Platinum Member
The difference in sound between a BB and a Pork-Max-itone is going to be fairly inconsequential.

The price difference is just as reflective of US regulations than it is Ludwig's margins. (This is both a positive and a negative)..


Disclosure -- I've used my BB for exactly ZERO recordings since getting my George Way.
 

T_Weaves

Silver Member
The difference in sound between a BB and a Pork-Max-itone is going to be fairly inconsequential.

The price difference is just as reflective of US regulations than it is Ludwig's margins. (This is both a positive and a negative)..


Disclosure -- I've used my BB for exactly ZERO recordings since getting my George Way.
Kamak, ....and which Geo Way snare is that? I'm looking for nice snare to pair with my Sonor Delite set. Preferably 5.5x14. Does the 8-lug scenario create any issues for you?
 
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KamaK

Platinum Member
Kamak, ....and which Geo Way snare is that? I'm looking for nice snare to pair with my Sonor Delite set. Preferably 5.5x14. Does the 8-lug scenario create any issues for you?
George Way Studio Maple, 6.5x14. Zero issues with 8-lug. Throw is old-fashioned, but functional. If I were going to grab a brass snare, I would look at a GW Hollywood to match my kit. I'd probably go for an aluminum Aero before that though.

Just so I'm clear.. The point isn't for you to buy a GW, its to let you know that the difference between different vendor's offerings is largely inconsequential. Yes, there is a sonic difference. No, nobody's going to be able to tell the difference unless they own/play a real BB or are A/B'ing them in the same room.

If you absolutely MUST have a BB for the sake of authenticity/nostalgia/desire, then by all means, go for it. Hell, mine is on CL for $500, and I'm throwing in an extra bunch of brand new Ludwig heads. They're great drums.
 

boomstick

Silver Member
I've long wanted a BB, but could never justify the price. I ended up getting a Worldmax, which I think is what Pork Pie uses for their brass snares. No regrets at all. I love my BB knockoff.
 

pbm2112

Senior Member
I once did a blind test between my 1970s BO Badge Black Beauty and the Black Bob in a music store. Everyone either went for Pork Pie or couldn't really appreciate much difference. Under a microphone maybe it has magic - but then put a full band over it and maybe the magic is overwhelmed. Anyway, I sold the Black Beauty and turned it into the Pork Pie and cymbals!
 

jdavis

Member
I bought a Pork Pie BOB and a WorldMax Big Hawg. I got a chance to set them up side by side with a new BB with similar heads and snares. Tuned them up the same and there wasn't a world of difference.

My WM had die cast hoops which made it sound a little more closed in / dry. But, I was able to get the BOB to sound about 90-95% the same as the BB. I heard a slight difference with the BB (more of a 'thonk', if that makes sense) but not enough to justify the price difference.

So, I sold off the Big Hawg and kept the BOB. Really great value if you don't want to shell out for a BB, IMO. Good luck!
 

williamsbclontz

Silver Member
What about the A&F brass snares? I hear them get compared to black beauties all the time and carry a huge price tag. Is it worth it or just a fad? And where would you guys rate all three of these drums
 

Rosemarydrumco

Senior Member
You notice how most of the people that say they didn’t hear a difference between a seamed shell and a seamless owned the seamed? Most of the people that say they do make a difference own seamless shells.

The thing that annoys me is how people act like it’s just a known fact there’s not a difference. That’s incredibly subjective and really just an opinion..and not true. Seamless spun shells and rolled and welded/riveted drums are very different structurally and with metal composition. Seamless shells require specific equipment and certain spinning skills...and anyone can make a sheet metal shell in their garage. Seamless shells structurally are typically more perfectly made and stronger and usually more resonant.

A snare sound is the sum of its parts...and determined by so many factors, but at its core...a seamless shell should sound different because it is totally different. I say all that to say although I am not a huge black beauty fan, and especially not a big fan of the generic worldmax copy...there are some seamless shells out there that I think sound incredible and that I choose to play. In my experience these shells have been more sensitive, resonant, and explosive. This has manifested not just in sound but also feel. I have preferred them...but there are also some seamed shells out there that sound fantastic...so I think there’s other factors at play with the seamless shells I am so fond of.
 

KamaK

Platinum Member
You notice how most of the people that say they didn’t hear a difference between a seamed shell and a seamless owned the seamed? Most of the people that say they do make a difference own seamless shells.
I've always found that binary people seem to take a firm stand on one side or the other. Either that it makes a 100% difference, or that it makes no difference at all. Maybe it's a modern-culture thing.

It doesn't take a genius to put two beaded-brass snares in the same room, bang on them, and realize that they sound slightly different from one another. It's entirely up to the player to find meaning or utility in the difference. Restated, everyone hears the delta, but only a select few hear it and exhibit preference or find one more useful than the other.

The BB is what it is... It's the pinnacle of the beaded brass-snare genealogy. One can purchase another snare, or even a better snare, without depriving the BB of it's accolades.
 

Steady Freddy

Pioneer Member
The BB sounds choked. Typical GC tuning. Crank both heads way up. LOL

It takes me a few weeks living with a drum to get it how I like it. That said, others may hate that sound. Some like the Don Henley sound, some like the 311 sound and every sound in between. It would be kinda boring if everyone liked the same thing.

Spun, cast, rolled, welded or what ever, I think it comes down to: Do you like the sound and is that sound worth the asking price of the drum to you?
 

caddywumpus

Platinum Member
That video doesn't portray the sounds of the drums that I know. That can be chalked up to the poor tuning, particularly of the Black Beauty. I own both, having bought a B.O.B. to replace my BB. I couldn't let the BB go. It just has this depth of tone to it that is absent in the B.O.B. I like them each for their own reasons. I don't think the $470 difference is worth it, as a function of money to sound benefits, but I know, at least from my own specimens of these drums, that you cannot get the BB sound from a B.O.B. That's not a bad thing, though--it's a matter of what precise sound you're after.
 

Chunkaway

Silver Member
George Way Studio Maple, 6.5x14. Zero issues with 8-lug. Throw is old-fashioned, but functional. If I were going to grab a brass snare, I would look at a GW Hollywood to match my kit. I'd probably go for an aluminum Aero before that though.

Just so I'm clear.. The point isn't for you to buy a GW, its to let you know that the difference between different vendor's offerings is largely inconsequential. Yes, there is a sonic difference. No, nobody's going to be able to tell the difference unless they own/play a real BB or are A/B'ing them in the same room.

If you absolutely MUST have a BB for the sake of authenticity/nostalgia/desire, then by all means, go for it. Hell, mine is on CL for $500, and I'm throwing in an extra bunch of brand new Ludwig heads. They're great drums.
Just wanted to say, I owned a Dunnett Studio Maple 6.5X14, and I liked it, but didn't love it. It sounded like a vintage snare drum to me- a good vintage snare drum, but that's about it. I would never compare it to a Black Beauty since, to my ears, they do completely different things.
 

Chunkaway

Silver Member
From that A-B vid the Pork Pie sounded better.

The BB sounded like it was tuned a bit high though.

If I was laying down brand new dollar for either of those snares I'd want a brand new head as well.
Interesting. I thought the BB sounded fuller, with more depth.
 

opentune

Platinum Member
Interesting. I thought the BB sounded fuller, with more depth.
I thought the BB sounded better too, and found the BoB tailed off with a nasty overtone. Both good snares, love them for what they are. The worth and cost is all on the beholder.
 
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