Band drama part 2

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wy yung

Guest
Wy, would you want to work with someone who walked off stage because he was jealous of another player ... whose ability was making the whole band look good?
It would depend upon the job offered. I am only responsible for myself.

One cannot always be in top form, both musically and emotionally. We are human. I am not defending the man's actions. But I am aware of what musicians are like. The story of 20th century bands is full of people behaving badly. Whether it is Dizzy Gilespie spitting on stage during a Cab Calloway show, or Mingus attacking someone with a knife in rehearsal, musicians tend not to be perfect people. Being on stage is also not something "regular" people face in their daily lives.

As a professional who relies on work to pay the rent, it is not always so easy to pick and choose. I can only relate to the scenario through my own history and experience. It was only one show. I must say I also find fault with the horn player who allowed this nonsense to get the better of him and quit a working job with the band. A guy walks off stage once and he quits??? It seems to me the testicular region requires a little more girth.

For my part I would prefer to see what positives I could salvage with an eye to future gigs and income.
 

larryace

"Uncle Larry"
I get emotionally involved with my bands because I don't do it for a living, I do it because I love it, otherwise, I would just collect stamps. That changes things, being emotionally involved, not necessarily for the better, but it makes it closer to the heart and harder to be indifferent about. I haven't made the call yet, but before next gig I will be talking things out w/ Les just to clear the air.
 

aydee

Platinum Member
Still reckon Les has issues :)
Ur prolly wright, Pauly.. but hey, we know our breed, dont we? Over emotional, touchy, uptight, fragile egos, super-sensitive, out of touch with the real world, heart on the sleeve, need kid gloves yadada type folks...
..but maybe he's just a pure, unadulterated, bonafide, @hole, like Larry's been implying all along.

... before next gig I will be talking things out w/ Les just to clear the air.
Good man, Charlie Brown.

...
 

Andy

Administrator
Staff member
I can accept someone throwing a childish tantrum, if they're driven to it by some trauma in their life or a latent trigger point. We're all guilty of doing "out of character" things from time to time. To me, that's not the issue here. If someone behaves in such a way, but then makes a concious decision not to appologise to those affected, they are, by implication, condoning their own behaviour. This means that Larry's guitarist (gitwrist in my circles) thinks his conduct was just fine. He was "within his rights" to walk off the stage. Such a lack of remorse, or contrite retraction, means it's perfectly OK by him to do the same thing again. What's even worse, the lack of respect shown to his band mates by electing not to explain himself, gives some indication as to their place in his affections.
 
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wy yung

Guest
I get emotionally involved with my bands because I don't do it for a living, I do it because I love it, otherwise, I would just collect stamps. That changes things, being emotionally involved, not necessarily for the better, but it makes it closer to the heart and harder to be indifferent about. I haven't made the call yet, but before next gig I will be talking things out w/ Les just to clear the air.


I understand. You have every right to your emotions and nobody can or should attempt to take that away from you. I can only speak from my own experiences from my career. That is why I am careful to speak of what I would do, not what you should do. Ultimitly you must make the right choice for you.
 

Pollyanna

Platinum Member
It would depend upon the job offered. I am only responsible for myself.

... As a professional who relies on work to pay the rent, it is not always so easy to pick and choose. I can only relate to the experience through my own history and experience. It was only one show. I must say I also find fault with the horn player who allowed this nonsense to get the better of him and quit a working job with the band. A guy walks off stage once and he quits???

For my part I would prefer to see what positives I could salvage with an eye to future gigs and income.
Can't argue with your logic, Wy. Hobbyists have more choices ... at least when the alarm isn't going off in the morning Mon to Fri ...

I'd be cranky, though ... the music's cookin' and suddenly Bozo takes a hissy fit just because he's not king of the castle. That's idiotic, especially since he never said sorry afterwards. If the sax player is a borderline pro that would make him feel like he's wasting his time. As a hobbyist I'd be wondering about the potential for having a good time - the main point - with such a serious young insect around. I'd be much more forgiving of a killer player who made everything sound great, though.


One cannot always be in top form, both musically and emotionally. We are human. I am not defending the man's actions. But I am aware of what musicians are like. The story of 20th century bands is full of people behaving badly. Whether it is Dizzy Gilespie spitting on stage during a Cab Calloway show, or Mingus attacking someone with a knife in rehearsal, musicians tend not to be perfect people. Being on stage is also not something "regular" people face in their daily lives.
True what you say about musos ... "not to be perfect people" was a nice understatement :) I've talked with ALLOTT of women with horror stories about muso exes.

Regular people certainly can get on stage ALLOT too ... running training courses, group briefings, making speeches etc. I used to be a trainer and I never jumped ship mid-course. Never seen a trainer storm out of a course either. Have you stormed out of a drum lesson?
 
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wy yung

Guest
Can't argue with your logic, Wy. Hobbyists have more choices ... at least when the alarm isn't going off in the morning Mon to Fri ...



Regular people certainly can get on stage ALLOT too ... running training courses, group briefings, making speeches etc. I used to be a trainer and I never jumped ship mid-course. Never seen a trainer storm out of a course either. Have you stormed out of a drum lesson?
Speaking as a former martial arts instructor who has taught thousands of classes, I feel I can say that playing music on a stage in a band is quite different from teaching a class or giving a lecture. Both of which I have done repeatedly. Tony Robbins perhaps can relate, but he is also performing. The situations are radically different and I fail to see any valid comparrison.
 

Pollyanna

Platinum Member
Speaking as a former martial arts instructor who has taught thousands of classes, I feel I can say that playing music on a stage in a band is quite different from teaching a class or giving a lecture. Both of which I have done repeatedly. Tony Robbins perhaps can relate, but he is also performing. The situations are radically different and I fail to see any valid comparrison.
I used to run courses. I'd have a room full of people and I'd be out the front. And I'd be judged if they didn't think I had my stuff together. You had to think on your feet because you never knew if you'd have smart elec (heckler), an unresponsive group (audience), technical issues (projectors can be diabolical), etc.

And I had exactly the same gig nerves before running those courses - ALLOT! I've heard inexperienced trainers' voices shaking and the paper they're holding trembling in their hand at the start.
 
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wy yung

Guest
I used to run courses. I'd have a room full of people and I'd be out the front. And I'd be judged if they didn't think I had my stuff together. You had to think on your feet because you never knew if you'd have smart elec (heckler), an unresponsive audience, technical issues (projectors can be diabolical), etc.

And I had exactly the same gig nerves before running those courses - ALLOT! I've heard inexperienced trainers' voices shaking and the paper they're holding trembling in their hand at the start.
When I teach a class, it is not a performance. Do you believe I was at any time performing for you in our classes? Or was I underplaying in support of you?

A gig is not a seminar. Their functions are not the same. One is to convey knowledge, the other is to entertain. Regardless of the nerves involved.
 

Pollyanna

Platinum Member
When I teach a class, it is not a performance. Do you believe I was at any time performing for you in our classes? Or was I underplaying in support of you?

A gig is not a seminar. Their functions are not the same. One is to convey knowledge, the other is to entertain. Regardless of the nerves involved.
Agree there are differences. However, there are many similarities and that includes being able to entertain. If people are bored they don't learn. And you have to encourage people to "get up and dance" (i.e. participate).

One on one and small group lessons are very different. One time I had to give a talk but only four people turned up. So I pulled up a chair and sat with them - the pressure was off, no more nerves.

And, no, you weren't showing off; you were being a teacher looking for an opening in a very thick skull ... I kept on wishing you'd open up and go for it because I prefer accompaniment, but since you weren't I though I'd better do something :)

In hindsight, I should have stuck to the ostinato like glue and worked on tightening it up instead of fiddling around trying to do a bad drum composition. A very thick skull sometimes :)
 

Andy

Administrator
Staff member
And, no, you weren't showing off; you were being a teacher looking for an opening in a very thick skull ... I kept on wishing you'd open up and go for it because I prefer accompaniment, but since you weren't I though I'd better do something :)

In hindsight, I should have stuck to the ostinato like glue and worked on tightening it up instead of fiddling around trying to do a bad drum composition. A very thick skull sometimes :)
Wy, maaan, I feel sorry for you, really. Pol, I think your lesson price has just doubled.
 

eamesuser

Silver Member
I have been thru similar as this.I don't know if there are underlying issues that have been festering,but Larry said that this Les fellow has admonished him on stage for a mistake,that is not professional either,in my world that should be taken note of and addressed later,like next rehearsal.I have played in very professional bands,and some not so,I hate taking to much time between songs,I hate noodling between songs,or players giving away songs before we play them by playing the riff loud enough for the audience to hear it,I may mention that pro bands don't do this,and if no one listens or cares I shut my mouth and play with the band until I decide it is time to leave or the gigs dry up.But quitting in the middle of a song and walking offstage is reprehensible to me.I get a little ticked off because I try my best to play my best and take what I do seriously,and when someone else doesn't I sort of take it personally.But I shouldn't.I think this needs to be addressed with the remaning members,decide whether to continue,whether a change in personell is in order,or Larry could bide his time until he finds another band.A lot of things could happen.Show biz is insane.
 

Pollyanna

Platinum Member
Wy, maaan, I feel sorry for you, really. Pol, I think your lesson price has just doubled.
A conservative estimate, Andy :)

I'll never forget the information session I had to give to a class of Year 10 schoolgirls. They sat glassy eyed and inattentive the whole time, apart from one who kept making dumb jokes until the teacher told her to can it. By the end I felt as though I'd failed - thoroughly dispirited. To my disbelief, the teacher told me I'd done a good job with the session ... apparently the girls just phase out after lunchtime and there's not a thing you can do ... I pity teachers. Adult education is much gentler.

But, in the corporate world, if you walk off midstream, your career walks off into the sunset.
 

Bernhard

Founder Drummerworld
Staff member
I was looking for the announced band drama in the thread title and read the last 10 posts - hmm - now i give up....

B.
 
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