About to Give Up on Agops Because I Can't Find a Decent Ride

larryace

"Uncle Larry" - Administrator
Staff member
Thank you. I actually tried out a 24” Xist in a drum shop and I was surprised by how much I liked it.

Any specific models or sizes out of the other brands you would recommend?
I was surprised at how much I liked the Xist too. I have 3 of them. For 199 USD new? Fuggedaboutit

I have no recommendations. Cymbals are all unique. It's a very personal journey. Kind of like picking a mate.
 

jaymandude

Active Member
The only Agop I could use comfortably in my electric situations is a heavier Jazz Ride ( I think this is it , it’s maybe like a heavier 22 K. Otherwise I’m with you, everything else is too dark or washy for what I do.

FWIW, I have a few old K 20’s that I use, they’re a little heavier, around 2100/2200 grams. But mostly I use 602’s.
 

Chris Whitten

Silver Member
I have one of the Xist Dry Dark rides. It is VERY dry. Sounds less usable in person on it's own, but actually in a musical context sounds more like a regular ride, with plenty of stick sound and very little wash.
 

Chunkaway

Silver Member
I have one of the Xist Dry Dark rides. It is VERY dry. Sounds less usable in person on it's own, but actually in a musical context sounds more like a regular ride, with plenty of stick sound and very little wash.
Really? I totally would have thought it was too dry to cut through. I’ll check it out. Thanks
 

Chunkaway

Silver Member
Ok, thanks, that would be my first Agop, should I need to try it or could I buy it online, I have no retailer selling Agop close to me.
I’d try it online first. They vary by quite a bit. Memphis Drum Shop would be a place to start. Or Drum Center of Portsmouth Is another option.
 

jaymandude

Active Member
I’d try it online first. They vary by quite a bit. Memphis Drum Shop would be a place to start. Or Drum Center of Portsmouth Is another option.
Just waking up with coffee. Here’s a question…

What is it you need to hear ? Stick ? Pitch ? Body of the cymbal ? I’m just realizing that can affect your choice.

I often get A Customs as backline and they’re good but obviously not hammered or “warm”. And I wonder.. a hammered cymbal will likely need to be heavier unless it’s a “dry” model, simply to get the pitch up.


Or I’m probably overthinking it :)
 
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Chris Whitten

Silver Member
I need to hear time, usually from the stick attack sound. Then I want to hear a nice body (aka wash). Most of the Agops are built for lower volume playing, so played medium strength the wash overtakes the 'stick' and you lose the definition of the time, just a wall of wash.
I find standard rock rides very boring. They usually have the perfect balance of stick attack to wash, but the tone is vanilla, super bland.
I love the tone of Agop cymbals. So it's just a case of finding a ride that can live with loud guitars and keyboards.
So far I'm having decent luck with the Mantra.
 

classikdrummr

Active Member
I have been playing Agops for the past 12 years or so. I absolutely love their crashes and some of their hi-hats. However, in that time, I have owned at least 7 Agop rides and none of them worked for me in live situations. Most of the time the rides are too washy or too trashy, so you lose stick articulation. Or they are the Idris model and sound like a trash can lid.

I recently picked up a set of Paiste cymbals including a 22" Traditional Medium light ride and 22" Masters Dark ride. I prefer the Traditional Medium light but both of these rides sound pretty good and significantly better than most Agops.

Any ideas about what I could do to continue down the Agop road?

Agop rides I have owned:
20/22 Signature - loved the trash, absolutely wouldn't work in anything but a very quiet/acoustic situation
22" Traditional Original - hella wash with this one
22" Sultan Jazz- more wash
22" Mel Lewis - sounded great in the studio but just lost any articulation in live situations

Agop rides I currently own:
22 30th Anniversary (Still have and may keep for jazzy situations, although it is pretty washy)
22" Mantra (will probably keep for pop/rock) This is probably my best Agop ride
24" Joey Waronker - too silvery, weird hum. Will most likely sell this soon
I Love my Paiste 2002 Ride and Hats... I have been on Meinl Custom Classics for years for my Crashes but am going to switch all of them to 2002 once i have the money
 

bearblastbeats

Senior Member
I feel you there. I've had the agop traditional ride, and currently a medium sig and 30th anni.

I like the 30th bell but it is a little too washy. I like the articulation of the sig but has little to no bell.

My favorite ride I think I used to own was the Meinl Medium vintage ride. It had a nice bell and the stick definition like the sig.

I might try the Turk ride next.
 

toddbishop

Platinum Member
I have been playing Agops for the past 12 years or so. I absolutely love their crashes and some of their hi-hats. However, in that time, I have owned at least 7 Agop rides and none of them worked for me in live situations. Most of the time the rides are too washy or too trashy, so you lose stick articulation. Or they are the Idris model and sound like a trash can lid.

The best Agops are great, but I've played a lot of bad ones too. The main problems I've experienced are that they were difficult to control, or they didn't cut because they were too dark, or they had too wild a harmonic profile.

I mean: I recommend Cymbal & Gong to anyone who generally likes Agops, or traditional Turkish cymbals generally. I've found them to be consistently excellent, in the ~6 years that I've been playing them, and selling them. They're extremely playable cymbals with a traditional sound, without the problems above. I've sold quite a few to some great players, and they've been thrilled by them. Juuuust saying.... :)
 

Chris Whitten

Silver Member
There aren't many 'bad' cymbals by the well known cymbal companies, just cymbals not to one's taste.
I've tried a lot of Agop crashes and hi-hats and they were all either very nice, or pretty good.
The rides are mostly very nice, but not that great for rock or any kind of mainstream playing. Yes they often have a 'too wild' harmonic profile, and they often max out at just medium intensity playing.
The Joey Waronker surprised me in that it wasn't my cup of tea, although I really like him as a drummer. The two Aaron Sterling crash/rides are exact replicas of a 60's A Zildjian ride (on the thinner side) in my opinion. Not trashy at all. Still, I thought they were boring so sold them.
The Mantra is the closest I've come to a ride that has character but still works in rock and pop.
 

toddbishop

Platinum Member
There aren't many 'bad' cymbals by the well known cymbal companies, just cymbals not to one's taste.

I think I'm saying it as shorthand for something that fails as a normal instrument, that a lot of people would find unsatisfactory for its category.

Like if something offends your ear while you're playing it, or is hard to play in its role-- eg, a ride that is completely uncontrolled, a crash cymbal that won't crash. We've all played cymbals like that-- it's not totally subjective.
 

jaymandude

Active Member
The best Agops are great, but I've played a lot of bad ones too. The main problems I've experienced are that they were difficult to control, or they didn't cut because they were too dark, or they had too wild a harmonic profile.

I mean: I recommend Cymbal & Gong to anyone who generally likes Agops, or traditional Turkish cymbals generally. I've found them to be consistently excellent, in the ~6 years that I've been playing them, and selling them. They're extremely playable cymbals with a traditional sound, without the problems above. I've sold quite a few to some great players, and they've been thrilled by them. Juuuust saying.... :)
So what cymbal and gong models do you recommend for the person that uses 2002’s ? Or for the drummer that likes a darker sound but need to cut thru a B3 and a Mesa boogie amp.
 

sumdrumguy

Senior Member
I have one of the Xist Dry Dark rides. It is VERY dry. Sounds less usable in person on it's own, but actually in a musical context sounds more like a regular ride, with plenty of stick sound and very little wash.

I feel that way about my Meinl Vintage Pure ride. Very dry and quiet, yet somehow works in live/band setting.

Re Agop rides, perhaps Carter McLean snagged all the good ones :p
 
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jda

Silver Member
Cymbalholic Journey
never stop till Happy or hoppy as the case maybe
 

toddbishop

Platinum Member
So what cymbal and gong models do you recommend for the person that uses 2002’s ? Or for the drummer that likes a darker sound but need to cut thru a B3 and a Mesa boogie amp.

There's nothing really comparable to a 2002-- those are made of B8 bronze, C&G are B20. And C&G are generally lighter. They do have lines that are similar to 602s (Cymbal Foundry line, clean bright mediums), or Giant Beats (Janavar-- washy pop cymbals). Mersey Beat and American Artist (comparable to A. Zildjian or Sabian AA).

Any of those would work great with B3, depending on the type of sound you want-- I'd probably be looking at a light-medium A-Type Holy Grail. They're moderately dark and complex, with some of the A-like raging high mids, which helps them cut.

I don't have a ton of cymbals for sale right now, but you can check out the ones I've sold to see what they're like.
 
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