drummingman
Gold Member
How much is a difference is there really between a 14 or a 16 in depth of a bass drum in sound? I’m looking at either a 18x14 or 18x16 bass drum to use with my metal band.
14 or 16 depth
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IBitePrettyHard
Senior Member
I've never heard the comparison of an 18x14" and 18x16" kick before. Almost all 18" kicks are 14" deep. A 18x16 just seems unnecessary. If you need more low end, it's better to just get a 20 or 22".
For 20" and 22" kicks, I've heard plenty of 14" vs 16" depth comparisons. The 14" will be more immediate and take up less space on small stages. But it will also have slightly less low end and less boom.
The biggest issue I have with 20x14 or 22x14 is that they're generally quieter than a 20x16 or 22x16. Some people may not mind it, but I prefer a kick drum with a little more power behind it.
Why on earth are you planning to use an 18" kick for a metal band? It's not going to have enough oomph or low end to compete with your bandmates.
For 20" and 22" kicks, I've heard plenty of 14" vs 16" depth comparisons. The 14" will be more immediate and take up less space on small stages. But it will also have slightly less low end and less boom.
The biggest issue I have with 20x14 or 22x14 is that they're generally quieter than a 20x16 or 22x16. Some people may not mind it, but I prefer a kick drum with a little more power behind it.
Why on earth are you planning to use an 18" kick for a metal band? It's not going to have enough oomph or low end to compete with your bandmates.
drummingman
Gold Member
When it’s micd up I think it will be fine. I’ll use my 20x16 for recording and the 18x14 for gigging. Gotta save my low back!
14x22 (or 14" depth) bass drums seem to have been the norm during rock music heyday. Even the greatest, Stewart Copeland, used a 14x22 with the Police, even though Pearl forced us kids in the eighties to use 18x22 big-ass kicks. You will get a quicker response from shorter depth and can still tune the drum to be punchy. That said, I believe Tim Alexander used 16x16 or 18x18 Pork Pie double bass drums while in Primus.
harryconway
Platinum Member
Well, if you've already got an 18x14, I don't think moving to a 18x16 will gain you a whole lot. 14" depth will give you more snap/attack. 16" depth, less of that ..... and more depth of sound. As long as you're mic'd, the right heads will give you tons of punch.
This video shows a 18x14 being turned into a pretty decent puncher.
roncadillac
Platinum Member
If you are playing in a metal band it's almost a guarantee that your bass drums will be at least mic'ed if not triggered (and maybe mic'ed as well). These things make bass drum size much less important for anything besides look and feel.. and even feel is more determined by your head, tuning, and playing style.
What heads do you intend to use? How do you intend to tune them in relation to each other? Port or no Port? What type of beaters?
Also... What type of metal are we talking about here? Are you playing speed/thrash/grind/death type stuff where it's pretty much all about speed? Are you playing more modern generic metalcore stuff? Are you playing more open stoner/doom Sabbath type metal? For all of these I would suggest totally different size, depth, and set up bass drums.
You should be fine with an 18" and the difference between 16 and 14 depth is minimal, though I personally prefer the look and shlep of smaller drums.
One of our members here gigs a pearl midtown 16" bass drum kit in a metal band.
I seem to be one of our resident "tiny bass drum in non jazz settings" members, I don't play metal but I love it and listen to a lot of it. AMA
Justin Foley of Killswitch Engage currently uses a 20" but there wss a point in the early 2000s that I'm sure I saw/read him using an 18".
Hellhammer from Mayhem uses dual 20s on his current sonor kit (a long with some other very unusual sizes : https://hellhammerdrummer.com/gear-and-setup/)
And lastly, have fun watching Dave Lombardo rip some double kick on a tiny Tama cocktail kit:
What heads do you intend to use? How do you intend to tune them in relation to each other? Port or no Port? What type of beaters?
Also... What type of metal are we talking about here? Are you playing speed/thrash/grind/death type stuff where it's pretty much all about speed? Are you playing more modern generic metalcore stuff? Are you playing more open stoner/doom Sabbath type metal? For all of these I would suggest totally different size, depth, and set up bass drums.
You should be fine with an 18" and the difference between 16 and 14 depth is minimal, though I personally prefer the look and shlep of smaller drums.
One of our members here gigs a pearl midtown 16" bass drum kit in a metal band.
I seem to be one of our resident "tiny bass drum in non jazz settings" members, I don't play metal but I love it and listen to a lot of it. AMA
Justin Foley of Killswitch Engage currently uses a 20" but there wss a point in the early 2000s that I'm sure I saw/read him using an 18".
Hellhammer from Mayhem uses dual 20s on his current sonor kit (a long with some other very unusual sizes : https://hellhammerdrummer.com/gear-and-setup/)
And lastly, have fun watching Dave Lombardo rip some double kick on a tiny Tama cocktail kit:
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DutchDrummersDreams
Platinum Member
So you already have an 18x14?
Add a riser, subkick or dual diaphragm mic for live use, and emad/powerstroke pro and play!!!
All you need.
Also nothing wrong with an 17” or 18” deep kick too.
Add a riser, subkick or dual diaphragm mic for live use, and emad/powerstroke pro and play!!!
All you need.
Also nothing wrong with an 17” or 18” deep kick too.
Rattlin' Bones
Gold Member
I had a 20x16 Tama Superstar (I think that's only 20" they make). It was good, but as soon as I found an 18x14 I jumped on it and sold the 20x16. I can get the 18x14 to sound big and full with proper tunings and heads for our loud-ish blues band no problem. It's a LOT easier to gig with, too. The 20x16 was also almost too wide for my small closet I keep my gigging kit in lol.
yammyfan
Senior Member
I'm not convinced that 18" deep bass drums go deeper than 14" deep bass drums. Deeper kicks are boomier, of that I am certain, but I am not sure if that is better. It's a matter of preference for sure.
I recently cut down a 22x18 to 22x14, and it was a great decision. It plays as deep as ever, but it is definitely punchier now. It is lighter and takes up less room on stage which is a huge plus.
This is the video that convinced me to cut down my bass drum. have a listen and see what you think:
I recently cut down a 22x18 to 22x14, and it was a great decision. It plays as deep as ever, but it is definitely punchier now. It is lighter and takes up less room on stage which is a huge plus.
This is the video that convinced me to cut down my bass drum. have a listen and see what you think:
I used a satin finish 14x20 Tama Silverstar birch bass drum (with Aqurian Superkick I clear head) while playing for Alice Bag (punk music), and it worked perfectly fine. Just tuned the batter head fairly loose to get necessary fat punch and then adjusted resonant head to shape the sound.
And most important of all, once Alice said, "I like that sound," I knew I had it. (When we rehearsed, I had the bass drum tuned higher for the playing I was doing at home, and she immediately asked me to "fix that.") Make sure your drums please your bandmates and the music, and you are good to go. Sometimes what we drummers prefer sound wise needs to take a backseat.
Added fun fact: Peter Erskine once said he used his Yamaha 14x18 jazz bass drum on a Joni Mitchell recording because he could just drop the tuning and it worked perfectly fine. Makes me realize that good matching bass drum sizes for crossing between acoustic small gigs and rock gigs would be 14x22 and 14x18 or 14x20 and 12x16. I used to think having a 20" for rock and 18" for jazz was the way to go (I'm under 5'9" so I prefer 20" for tom placement ease of use), but 18 kicks can easily cover the sonic space of a 20. Heck, Canopus 12x15 kicks can be plenty loud and full bodied:
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Mr. Heavyfoot
Member
14", all day, for any kick up to 26 for sure. 14 depth positively thumps & def cuts through a Metal/Punk din. Love my 18x14 Stagestar kick more than the Artstar II, MLX, Force 3007 or Swingstar kicks I've had, esp for double pedal. The smaller diameter really cuts down on the slapback that if you can't bounce through or ignore as an overly aware player & it's a tight enough sound that you might not feel compelled to trigger
IBitePrettyHard
Senior Member
Those two 15" bass drums are boosted by the kick mics for sure. Without amplification, I think they'd be too quiet for most genres outside of jazz.
Canopus drums sound so good! They don't get the love they deserve imo.
A J
Silver Member
This is a question that has nagged me for many years. After owning a number of bass drums in different sizes, I'm now convinced that the deep vs. shallow debate is now an "uneasy truce".
In a nutshell, I do hear a difference in sound between deep and shallow bass drums, but no one sound is better than the other. They're just different. Examples from a couple kick drums I own. Both are set up with unported resos.
Pearl MCX 18" x 20": Super loud and resonant. Needs a little bit of muffling to control the overtones.
Pearl Music City Custom 16" x 20": Punchy and deep. Not as loud as the MCX. Needs no muffling.
Which one do I like better? It's kinda like asking which of your kids is your favorite. It depends on the day.
A bit off topic, but when I was in a 2-drummer band, the other drummer played 14" x 22" bass drums. They were ported and heavily muffled. Next to my unported and lightly muffled drums, they always sounded weak. The sound guy had to pump a lot more volume into his kicks to get them up to par. Mine always sounded great, right off the bat. Had the other drummer tuned like me, his shallow depth drums would have sounded fine.
petrez
Senior Member
Each to their own, I hope this will not come off as too ignorant or disrespectful, but... 18" bassdrum for metal? I could maybe see it as a studio solution if you want that specific sound on a record. But live? I guess I'm too much of an old school metalhead, and I guess I will not help in the matter that other musicians think of metal as too much "show" and appearance. It just goes hand in hand though, to me. I guess I myself would be almost embarrassed if I had to use a house kit with a 18" bassdrum, let alone wanting to own one. You do you, you will stand out though, that's for sure, if that is something positive for you 
. I'm sure it would be easier to carry, but a 20" should not really be too much of a problem, unless there is some health issues involved though (and I'm sorry if that is the case). I have no idea if it would work sonically, but for me at least, there is just something about the stage appearance as well, which musicians in other genres don't really think that much about. Brutal music, in my opinion, deserves an appearance on stage to match it. But, take no notice of me here, I also think 20" kicks are a bit too small, so... I guess I'm the old grumpy guy now who think everything was better in the 80's (even though I was born in '84) 
.
. I'm sure it would be easier to carry, but a 20" should not really be too much of a problem, unless there is some health issues involved though (and I'm sorry if that is the case). I have no idea if it would work sonically, but for me at least, there is just something about the stage appearance as well, which musicians in other genres don't really think that much about. Brutal music, in my opinion, deserves an appearance on stage to match it. But, take no notice of me here, I also think 20" kicks are a bit too small, so... I guess I'm the old grumpy guy now who think everything was better in the 80's (even though I was born in '84) .
A J
Silver Member
Each to their own, I hope this will not come off as too ignorant or disrespectful, but... 18" bassdrum for metal? I could maybe see it as a studio solution if you want that specific sound on a record. But live? I guess I'm too much of an old school metalhead, and I guess I will not help in the matter that other musicians think of metal as too much "show" and appearance. It just goes hand in hand though, to me. I guess I myself would be almost embarrassed if I had to use a house kit with a 18" bassdrum, let alone wanting to own one. You do you, you will stand out though, that's for sure, if that is something positive for you
I won't speak for the OP, but will try to answer you question from my perspective. I'm 59 years old and retired for about 3 years. I grew up listening to Metal and still love much of it. Would I use an 18" kick for Metal? Heck Yeah!
Over the years, the sizes of my drums have gotten smaller. Nowadays, I can play anything on a 20-10-14 kit. Yeah, it might look out of place seeing a tall dude playing a Judas Priest song behind a 20" kick, but it doesn't bother me a bit. I'm at the point in my life where what other people think about me matters less with each passing year. If someone makes fun of me behind a "toy" kit, I'd likely just laugh along with them.
I've never actually played an 18" kick, but can fully vouch for the sound of a 20". With the right heads, tuning and mix, I've found a small kick can easily compete with larger ones, and sometimes even surpass them!
PorkPieGuy
Platinum Member
I've owned quite a few kicks including the depths of 14, 16, 18, and 20". I now own 5 drum kits, and ALL of them are 14" deep. The only 16" deep kick I would consider owning right now would be a Gretsch Renown or USA-made.
Duck Tape
Platinum Member
I am not sure if an 18 will have any definition when played with a double kick pedal, unless you stuff it with muffling, but maybe you’re going to trigger it anyway? You will want a riser so you can at least try to position the beaters evenly on the little batter head. 2 18” kicks would be cool.
Believe it or not I have an 18x14, 18x15 and 18x16 in my possession at the moment but they are all different shells and it’s not really a fair comparison, the 18x14 is a tama silverstar and the 18x15 is a stage custom, both birch drums. I think the tama sounds bigger but that could be because they have different heads and the tama seems a lot heavier so maybe the shell is thicker (I just looked that up and indeed the tama shell is 8mm and the Yamaha is 6mm).
My 18x16 is an acrylic shell. Without lining them up next to each other and fitting the same heads I would guess the depth isn’t going to make a massive difference.
Avoid really muffled heads as you need all the attack you can get, an emad without the foam ring or an ambassador or black dot might be good. Another thing I notice with my 18’s is that fitting a port really kills the tone of the drums, put the smallest possible port if you have to port.
That’s probably too much information but hopefully something there struck a chord with you.
Believe it or not I have an 18x14, 18x15 and 18x16 in my possession at the moment but they are all different shells and it’s not really a fair comparison, the 18x14 is a tama silverstar and the 18x15 is a stage custom, both birch drums. I think the tama sounds bigger but that could be because they have different heads and the tama seems a lot heavier so maybe the shell is thicker (I just looked that up and indeed the tama shell is 8mm and the Yamaha is 6mm).
My 18x16 is an acrylic shell. Without lining them up next to each other and fitting the same heads I would guess the depth isn’t going to make a massive difference.
Avoid really muffled heads as you need all the attack you can get, an emad without the foam ring or an ambassador or black dot might be good. Another thing I notice with my 18’s is that fitting a port really kills the tone of the drums, put the smallest possible port if you have to port.
That’s probably too much information but hopefully something there struck a chord with you.