Everything about Endorsements

Didn't Bermuda do a really good run down of what endorsements are, and aren't? Am I remembering things that didn't happen?
 
I believe I was the first to publish endorsement info online over 20 years, long before the companies and magazines got around to it. In fact, some companies use my FAQ as their own (credited of course) or otherwise link to it as a reference. www.bermudaschwartz.com/endorsement

But it's always a good idea to keep the information flowing, as it's still such a mystery to many players, whether they're candidates or not.

Bermuda
 
Dr_Watso said:
Didn't Bermuda do a really good run down of what endorsements are, and aren't? Am I remembering things that didn't happen?
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That’s why I posted the older thread since Bermuda had contributed.
 
bermuda said:
I believe I was the first to publish endorsement info online over 20 years, long before the companies and magazines got around to it. In fact, some companies use my FAQ as their own (credited of course) or otherwise link to it as a reference. www.bermudaschwartz.com/endorsement

But it's always a good idea to keep the information flowing, as it's still such a mystery to many players, whether they're candidates or not.

Bermuda
Click to expand...

Didn't know there was already a "mega" thread about it. (could have well expected it) but as I work inside a couple of companies in this field, I thought I might as well create some new/extra information with it, or as a new way to find them.
 
To be honest I think unless you have played everything under the sun and know the perfect setup endorsements will hinder you from experimenting and finding your perfect sound.

There are many pros even who avoid endorsements as they don't need them. I see far too many people saying they are endorsed, or pushing to get them all the time when they have a minimal influence or following. Being an endorser has less to do with your ability to play rather than how much of an influence you are to other drummers.

Adding to the last point, there are some companies, who will let anyone endorse them. They still ask for an EPK and make you feel important, and offer you a great discount off their "retail pricing". In the end this is probibly what you would pay out right... It is a sneaky business model to let newcomers brag about being an endorser and the company getting to sell products. I did see this with many smaller companies and smaller cymbal companies a few years ago. Just be warned that you might think your getting a sweet deal, or locking yourself into only playing a product for the wrong reasons.

At this point in my drumming and life I know what I like and what I don't like. My setup rarely changes and there are a few brands and products I will most likely be playing for the rest of my life. That is part 1 of reaching out to a company for an endorsement. Part 2 would be something like international tours, playing on tv shows etc, or having a very large YouTube and social media following. I have had many people ask me about products and buy them based off of some videos I have made in the past. Things like this will help along the way also.

Your basically getting a discount to be a part time salesman for the company. If it's a product you truely believe in and love it's an easy job. If your tjust trying to get discounts they will see right past you and possibly blacklist you. The drumming community is quite small and lots of the AR people talk to each other. Messaging every company saying you want to endorse them will not work.
 
beyondbetrayal said:
To be honest I think unless you have played everything under the sun and know the perfect setup endorsements will hinder you from experimenting and finding your perfect sound.

There are many pros even who avoid endorsements as they don't need them. I see far too many people saying they are endorsed, or pushing to get them all the time when they have a minimal influence or following. Being an endorser has less to do with your ability to play rather than how much of an influence you are to other drummers.

Adding to the last point, there are some companies, who will let anyone endorse them. They still ask for an EPK and make you feel important, and offer you a great discount off their "retail pricing". In the end this is probibly what you would pay out right... It is a sneaky business model to let newcomers brag about being an endorser and the company getting to sell products. I did see this with many smaller companies and smaller cymbal companies a few years ago. Just be warned that you might think your getting a sweet deal, or locking yourself into only playing a product for the wrong reasons.

At this point in my drumming and life I know what I like and what I don't like. My setup rarely changes and there are a few brands and products I will most likely be playing for the rest of my life. That is part 1 of reaching out to a company for an endorsement. Part 2 would be something like international tours, playing on tv shows etc, or having a very large YouTube and social media following. I have had many people ask me about products and buy them based off of some videos I have made in the past. Things like this will help along the way also.

Your basically getting a discount to be a part time salesman for the company. If it's a product you truely believe in and love it's an easy job. If your tjust trying to get discounts they will see right past you and possibly blacklist you. The drumming community is quite small and lots of the AR people talk to each other. Messaging every company saying you want to endorse them will not work.
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yes absolutely agree!! That's exactly what I was going to talk about in the next series...
 
veecharlie said:
Didn't know there was already a "mega" thread about it. (could have well expected it) but as I work inside a couple of companies in this field, I thought I might as well create some new/extra information with it, or as a new way to find them.
Click to expand...

I wrote that at a time when companies weren't forthcoming with their info, and barely had a web presence at all. The whole thing was a mystery to those not already involved.

It's always good to have the companies make their policies clear, and of course different companies have different concepts about what an endorser is. Often, unfortunately, it's just a customer whose name is added to a list of artists. I guess in the very strictest (or perhaps loosest) interpretation, happy customers are considered a good endorsement of the product/brand.

Bermuda
 
Wow Bermuda great FAQ I had no idea how all that works. I always thought you had to a professional level to be an endorser-else why bother. Interesting. I guess almost a year ago I got a Pearl Decade maple kit that since I've put about 4 videos with a mention of the kit on some of my crummy videos on my hack Youtube site. I noted Pearl Drums thanked me and gave me a thumbs up-it all makes sense now why. I thought they were just doing the random thanking some shmuck for using their product but no they were actually thanking me cause I'm a rube giving them free advertisement without any hassles LOL. There are lots of critique videos of drum products (some really good and some really bad) are those usually by endorsed drummers sort of doing their job endorsing the product and they get brownie points or is it all just visibility of the person with their band or videos or websites that highlight the endorsement?
 
GetAgrippa said:
Wow Bermuda great FAQ I had no idea how all that works. I always thought you had to a professional level to be an endorser-else why bother.
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Thank you!

It completely depends on the drummer's level of exposure and influence. You don't (necessarily) have to be a working pro to have enough of either to appeal to a company. Note the YouTube drummers who usually don't have gigs, but they may possess enough exposure and influence, and have some value to a company or two. That doesn't mean they're getting a bunch of free gear thrown their way, that's normally reserved for top artists with the highest level of exposure. But, a company may offer artist pricing - anywhere from 50-70% off "list" prices - and that's certainly attractive to just about anyone.

Interesting. I guess almost a year ago I got a Pearl Decade maple kit that since I've put about 4 videos with a mention of the kit on some of my crummy videos on my hack Youtube site. I noted Pearl Drums thanked me and gave me a thumbs up-it all makes sense now why. I thought they were just doing the random thanking some shmuck for using their product but no they were actually thanking me cause I'm a rube giving them free advertisement without any hassles LOL.
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That's not really the way to look at it. Names and logos on drum gear are basic branding, just like cars, appliances, etc. have their name and logo. Of course it's there for a reason, but don't look at a company taking advantage somehow simply because they put their name on their product. I'm always amused by drummers who want to take logos off their gear because they're not getting anything for it. If they're really serious about the concept, then I will personally help them remove the emblems from their car, appliances, TVs, etc.

There are lots of critique videos of drum products (some really good and some really bad) are those usually by endorsed drummers sort of doing their job endorsing the product and they get brownie points or is it all just visibility of the person with their band or videos or websites that highlight the endorsement?
Click to expand...
An endorser does have a responsibility to represent the product in exchange for consideration on product. Nobody accommodates an artist just because they're a nice guy (and sometimes, they're not.) But I'd hardly call it a job. Brownie points come in the form of being a good ambassador for the brand, and the relationship that comes with that. I've been pretty close to the people in many of the companies I endorse, and I enjoy those relationships, which can last long after the professional side of things may come to an end.

Most of the information in my FAQ came from the companies I'd endorsed since 1984, and a common theme was what they don't want from prospective endorsers. My aim was to guide drummers who somehow thought that if they had a certain look or could play their brains out, were somehow entitled to free gear. Most drummers just didn't know, and as a member of some key online drumming communities, I felt a responsibility to correct the misinformation out there.

Companies and publications eventually caught up with me. :)

I did a similar FAQ about NAMM, which they read and approved. There's still a lot of misconceptions about who can go, and how to get in. I'll save that for another thread, I think there have been a few already.

Bermuda
 
bermuda said:
Thank you!

It completely depends on the drummer's level of exposure and influence. You don't (necessarily) have to be a working pro to have enough of either to appeal to a company. Note the YouTube drummers who usually don't have gigs, but they may possess enough exposure and influence, and have some value to a company or two. That doesn't mean they're getting a bunch of free gear thrown their way, that's normally reserved for top artists with the highest level of exposure. But, a company may offer artist pricing - anywhere from 50-70% off "list" prices - and that's certainly attractive to just about anyone.

That's not really the way to look at it. Names and logos on drum gear are basic branding, just like cars, appliances, etc. have their name and logo. Of course it's there for a reason, but don't look at a company taking advantage somehow simply because they put their name on their product. I'm always amused by drummers who want to take logos off their gear because they're not getting anything for it. If they're really serious about the concept, then I will personally help them remove the emblems from their car, appliances, TVs, etc.

An endorser does have a responsibility to represent the product in exchange for consideration on product. Nobody accommodates an artist just because they're a nice guy (and sometimes, they're not.) But I'd hardly call it a job. Brownie points come in the form of being a good ambassador for the brand, and the relationship that comes with that. I've been pretty close to the people in many of the companies I endorse, and I enjoy those relationships, which can last long after the professional side of things may come to an end.

Most of the information in my FAQ came from the companies I'd endorsed since 1984, and a common theme was what they don't want from prospective endorsers. My aim was to guide drummers who somehow thought that if they had a certain look or could play their brains out, were somehow entitled to free gear. Most drummers just didn't know, and as a member of some key online drumming communities, I felt a responsibility to correct the misinformation out there.

Companies and publications eventually caught up with me. :)

I did a similar FAQ about NAMM, which they read and approved. There's still a lot of misconceptions about who can go, and how to get in. I'll save that for another thread, I think there have been a few already.

Bermuda
Click to expand...

Yea I support all this info, it's completely like this. It's really important that musicians understand the business and marketing factor behind all this, I get requests almost daily and most of the time this doesn't turn out because they have really NO idea how anything of all this works, or they have a wrong idea of it. Mainly because people talks whatever stuff most of the time.
Same goes for so many other topics...
 
bermuda said:
I did a similar FAQ about NAMM, which they read and approved. There's still a lot of misconceptions about who can go, and how to get in. I'll save that for another thread, I think there have been a few already.

Bermuda
Click to expand...

Totally off-topic: if you want to be somebody at NAMM, you need the badge that says "Buyer" on it. Why? Because they're the guys buying stuff from the vendors. I was hanging with a friend of mine and his badge stated he was a buyer, and he got the first name treatment and willingness to answer any questions he may have everywhere we went. I was jealous even though my badge said "Artist". My badge might as well have said, "Nobody". Maybe next year it will. ;)
 
Ok after long enough time here you go! This is part two:
Mostly intended for "new to endorsements" type of drummer. Intended to guide a bit to deliver a kick-a** application.

It doesn't guarantee you'll get it, but if you have the chops, the required gigs and the attitude, there would not be a reason why not.

Here you go:

https://youtu.be/OVUF60C9xn8

hopefully helps at least one person...
 
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