DRUMMERWORLD OFFICIAL DISCUSSION FORUM   

Go Back   DRUMMERWORLD OFFICIAL DISCUSSION FORUM > Drum Technique

Drum Technique Tips - Tricks - Practice - Rudiments - Educational DVDs & Books.....

Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #1  
Old 05-18-2015, 11:10 AM
pannbeen pannbeen is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 54
Default Looking for Doubble Bass Exercises (Matt Garstka)

Hello Everyone!

I'm looking for doubble bass exercises that really works.
I recently bought a lesson from Matt Garstka (drummer of Animals As Leaders), That's the first lesson I really feel have helped me out with my teqhnique. Mostly in my short, fast bursts and pollyrhythm playing though.

Now I need exercises that can help me go fast for a long period of time.
I've read about people in here that can do 16th notes at about 240bpm, that's just insane! How do you practice?

I can play 16th notes at like 150bpm for about 1-2 minutes maximum.
Please help me out here, what's the big secret?

Please share your favorite exercises! (PDF's or whatever)

Here's a clip of me recording session drums for a melodic hardcore band:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pJiN-Fdplgk

EDIT:
I am self taught and I've been playing drums since I was 4 years old (So it has been 15 years now).
I got my first doubble pedal when I was 17 years old, that maybe explains why I'm horrible at it!
__________________
My latest drum cover!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MGJgQQHsBcA

Last edited by pannbeen; 05-18-2015 at 11:23 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 05-18-2015, 12:00 PM
bud7h4 bud7h4 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 289
Default Re: Looking for Doubble Bass Exercises (Matt Garstka)

Quote:
I've read about people in here that can do 16th notes at about 240bpm, that's just insane! How do you practice?

I can play 16th notes at like 150bpm for about 1-2 minutes maximum.
Check out George Kollias' lessons on youtube. He also has books available and his excercises are very practical. I like the way he explains the 3 stages of ankle motion too.
150 vs 200+ are entirely different leg/ankle motions, but you want to keep them as close as possible to being the same. George illustrates these three stages of motion really well.
But beyond that, I really don't think there are any super secret speed lessons. There's just not that much to know. I've done the same basic speed excercises for 3 years now.

It took me about 3 years to go from 150 to 250+. It's just a matter of time before something clicks in your muscles and you "unlock" the next range of speed. I firmly believe that beyond 170 or so, it has little to do with muscle strength development, and everything to do with technique. Frankly the faster I get, the less I rely on muscle strength; as my ankle movement improves it becomes more economical, and the pedals are doing most of the work. The pedals are where the speed comes from, and I just control how little or how much speed I need from them, if that makes sense.

BTW that's solid drumming in the video you linked.

Last edited by bud7h4; 05-18-2015 at 01:29 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 05-18-2015, 01:23 PM
pannbeen pannbeen is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 54
Default Re: Looking for Doubble Bass Exercises (Matt Garstka)

Quote:
Originally Posted by bud7h4 View Post
Check out George Kollias' lessons on youtube. He also has books available and his excercises are very practical. I like the way he explains the 3 stages of ankle motion too.

150 vs 200+ are entirely different leg/ankle motions, but you want to keep them as close as possible to being the same. George illustrates these three stages of motion really well.

It took me about 3 years to go from 150 to 250+. It's just a matter of time before something clicks in your muscles and you "unlock" the next range of speed.

BTW that's solid drumming in the video you linked.
Thank you, I'll check out Kollias on youtube.
Do you have any favorite exercises that you use to play, that have helped you to get where you are today?

Thank you very much, I appreciate it! :)
__________________
My latest drum cover!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MGJgQQHsBcA
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 05-18-2015, 01:48 PM
bud7h4 bud7h4 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 289
Default Re: Looking for Doubble Bass Exercises (Matt Garstka)

Quote:
Originally Posted by pannbeen View Post
Thank you, I'll check out Kollias on youtube.
Do you have any favorite exercises that you use to play, that have helped you to get where you are today?

Thank you very much, I appreciate it! :)

At 150 bpm I would practice alternating 16th notes and 8th note triplets.

Or at 100-110 bpm alternate 16ths and 16th note triplets.

I still practice that same simple stuff at 270 bpm. There's really no advanced speed workout I'm aware of.

EDIT: forgot to mention, don't neglect single pedal speed. Take time to work one foot at a time.

RRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR LLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL

and doubles:
RR RR RR RR LL LL LL LL

All of those help increase speed.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 05-18-2015, 05:11 PM
axisT6 axisT6 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 86
Default Re: Looking for Doubble Bass Exercises (Matt Garstka)

The best way to get better at double bass is by hard work. That said, you will need to put in the practice time. It also helps to get as much out of the pedal as you can. It looks like you sit low on the kit judging by the video. That is a plus. As for your pedal set up, do the following:

1. Max the spring tension.
2. Pull the beaters back to an angle of about 45 Ė 90 degrees from the drum head.

Look at videos of Dave Lombardo and Jon Dette. These are two drummers that sit low on the kit and set up their pedals like mentioned. These are the only two drummers I know of that can play 200+ BPM at a loud volume (they only need mics). This approach conditions you to use push muscles and makes playing fast easier since the only effort you expend is to bring the beater to the bass drum head. The pedal does the work to pull the beater back.

Ever since I approached my kit as described above, I found that the double bass work was much easier and I no longer had the burn on the front of my shins since I didnít have to pull my foot to bring the beater back.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 05-19-2015, 12:35 AM
bud7h4 bud7h4 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 289
Default Re: Looking for Doubble Bass Exercises (Matt Garstka)

AxisT6, I don't know exactly why but the faster I play the more volume I get. When practicing at home I have to consciously try and play lighter above 240 or so, to keep from annoying others in the house.

My theory is that at slower speed it's mostly your muscles sending the beater toward the head after rebound. This = volume.
But at really high speed it should be the springs sending the beater back toward the head. This also = volume.

The speed of the rebounding beater = force.
This force against the spring = speed on the return.

People who don't get volume at high speed are using too much of their own muscles and not letting the springs do the work. You see these guys playing 300 bpm with that super short micro-twitching motion. This is wrong, wrong, wrong. Let the beaters travel back so the springs can shoot them forward with speed and power.

I agree totally on higher spring tension and having sufficient beater angle.
I've found that spring tension and beater angle depend on the pedal.

My settings:
Iron cobra 90% tension, 45 degrees
speed cobra 75% tension, 55-60 degrees
Trick 70% tension, 40-45 degrees
Axis A21 70% tension, 45 degrees

Note on Axis: these rebound FAST even with medium tension, I only jack up the tension to get more resistance when resting my foot on the pedal.

Last edited by bud7h4; 05-19-2015 at 03:02 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 05-19-2015, 02:01 AM
porter's Avatar
porter porter is online now
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Texas
Posts: 3,165
Default Re: Looking for Doubble Bass Exercises (Matt Garstka)

I found Hannes Grossman's DVD about this helpful.

Just remember to start slow and work your way up sloooooowly.
__________________
Check out my Youtube channel!
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 05-19-2015, 01:59 PM
axisT6 axisT6 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 86
Default Re: Looking for Doubble Bass Exercises (Matt Garstka)

Quote:
Originally Posted by bud7h4 View Post
AxisT6, I don't know exactly why but the faster I play the more volume I get. When practicing at home I have to consciously try and play lighter above 240 or so, to keep from annoying others in the house.

My theory is that at slower speed it's mostly your muscles sending the beater toward the head after rebound. This = volume.
But at really high speed it should be the springs sending the beater back toward the head. This also = volume.

The speed of the rebounding beater = force.
This force against the spring = speed on the return.

People who don't get volume at high speed are using too much of their own muscles and not letting the springs do the work. You see these guys playing 300 bpm with that super short micro-twitching motion. This is wrong, wrong, wrong. Let the beaters travel back so the springs can shoot them forward with speed and power.

I agree totally on higher spring tension and having sufficient beater angle.
I've found that spring tension and beater angle depend on the pedal.

My settings:
Iron cobra 90% tension, 45 degrees
speed cobra 75% tension, 55-60 degrees
Trick 70% tension, 40-45 degrees
Axis A21 70% tension, 45 degrees

Note on Axis: these rebound FAST even with medium tension, I only jack up the tension to get more resistance when resting my foot on the pedal.
Your theory is correct. With speed, the momentum of the beater is high. Also, higher speed = higher impact into the drum head = volume at speed. With a combination of high spring tension and a lot of beater angle, the pedal almost plays itself at higher speeds.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 05-19-2015, 04:10 PM
pannbeen pannbeen is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 54
Default Re: Looking for Doubble Bass Exercises (Matt Garstka)

I'm very thankful for everyones advice!

I've started to play the "Stick Control" book with my feet at 60bpm. I'm doing it for an hour a day, then I'm doing Matt Garstka's bass drum lesson for about half an hour-an hour at 110bpm. I'm doing it pretty slow to maybe "unlock" my muscles.

Right now I'm playing a DW9002 pedal with "factory settings".
I like it quite a lot, maybe I'll have the spring tension a bit harder if it doesn't work out when I'm getting faster!

I'm having an audition for the Hardcore band that I did a session for (linked in the first post) next week. They told me that the rest of their new song has a lot of more intense doubble bass playing. Wish me luck..

If you have any more exercises or advice to me and everyone else, just bring it on!

Time to practice! :-)
__________________
My latest drum cover!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MGJgQQHsBcA
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are Off
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off




All times are GMT +2. The time now is 01:19 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Bernhard Castiglioni's DRUMMERWORLD.com