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  #1  
Old 09-25-2012, 05:01 PM
HMNY HMNY is offline
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Default Evans Hazy 300 question

Bit of a newb question, sorry in advance.

I just replaced a stock snare side head on my maple snare with an Evans Hazy 300, and I was very surprised how thin the 300 head is, (and I believe its the 'thickest'?)

How tightly can you crank these heads? At present it's at about 75 on the DD, and I am almost paranoid about tightening it up further, fearing it's going to split.

If I do go tighter, any tips on how to proceed? I would imagine slowly, working opposite lug to opposite lug?

Thanks in advance
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  #2  
Old 09-25-2012, 05:20 PM
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Default Re: Evans Hazy 300 question

There are 500 (5mm) heads, which I think are the thickest (the 300 is 3mm).

Snare-side heads are built to be cranked, I wouldn't worry too much about it (unless you're really going nuts on it). Just go slow, tuning each lug opposite in 1/4 turns.

Just don't crank it TOO tight or you'll choke your snare.
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  #3  
Old 09-25-2012, 05:23 PM
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Default Re: Evans Hazy 300 question

Thanks, didn't know about the 500.

I will take your advice, and go easy, I think I have a little more to go before choking the snare, how can I tell when I have gone to far, will the wires sound dead, not react to tension changes?

Appreciate the reply.
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  #4  
Old 09-25-2012, 05:31 PM
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Default Re: Evans Hazy 300 question

Quote:
Originally Posted by HMNY View Post
Thanks, didn't know about the 500.

I will take your advice, and go easy, I think I have a little more to go before choking the snare, how can I tell when I have gone to far, will the wires sound dead, not react to tension changes?

Appreciate the reply.
Yeah, basically. You want the drum to have a nice tone with the snares off, then gradually start tightening the snares until the excess buzz is gone. Undampened, you should get a nice ring (particularly if it's a metal snare). Then you can dampen to taste.

But yeah, when you choke the drum, the snares choke the resonance - just kinda sounds dead and lifeless. You'll know when you've gone too far.
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  #5  
Old 09-25-2012, 06:54 PM
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Default Re: Evans Hazy 300 question

Quick note on head thickness, 3mil is not 3mm. A mil is 1/1000 of an inch, so the Hazy 300 is 3/1000" thick.

As for tension, the snare side needs to vibrate so the wires will 'rattle' and make a snare sound. there's a wide range of tensions that will accomish this, but past a certain point, the head doesn't respond well, and the snare sound becomes weaker, or taken to the extreme, non-existent.

I consider the Hazy 300 a nice, average snare side and use it on all of my snares regardless of their intended use.

Bermuda

Last edited by bermuda; 09-25-2012 at 09:23 PM. Reason: speling
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  #6  
Old 09-25-2012, 07:00 PM
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Default Re: Evans Hazy 300 question

Thanks Bermuda, and understood on the thickness.

In your experience, for a decent starting point sound, what would you tighten the snare side to? ( I understand all tuning is subjective, but would appreciate some tips from a pro if you could) and then, is it batter tighter, looser, or the same?

Many thanks for adding your thoughts
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  #7  
Old 09-25-2012, 07:17 PM
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Default Re: Evans Hazy 300 question

This is just my opinion but i would go to at least 85 on the DD as a starting spot. From there it's all about what you like and what your ears are telling you. Trust your ears and instincts my friend. Good luck!
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  #8  
Old 09-25-2012, 07:22 PM
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Default Re: Evans Hazy 300 question

I tried a 500 on one of my snares and it killed the sound. The 500 is almost 67 percent thicker so beware
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  #9  
Old 09-25-2012, 09:06 PM
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Default Re: Evans Hazy 300 question

Quote:
Originally Posted by bermuda View Post
Quick note on head thickness, 3mil is not 3mm. A mil is 1/1000 of an inch, so the Hazy 300 is 3/1000" thick.
Dammit. Get on the metric system already!!
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  #10  
Old 09-25-2012, 09:23 PM
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Default Re: Evans Hazy 300 question

alright.

Hazy 200 - 2 mil - 51 microns
Hazy 300 - 3 mil - 76 microns
Hazy 500 - 5 mil - 127 microns

There is your metric equivalent. Helpful yet?

haha
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  #11  
Old 09-25-2012, 09:31 PM
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Default Re: Evans Hazy 300 question

Quote:
Originally Posted by HMNY View Post
Thanks Bermuda, and understood on the thickness.

In your experience, for a decent starting point sound, what would you tighten the snare side to? ( I understand all tuning is subjective, but would appreciate some tips from a pro if you could) and then, is it batter tighter, looser, or the same?
An extremely subjective question, it depends on the drum (size & shell material), the edge, the batter, the # of wire strands, and the desired sound. But for me, there is a basic starting point, which is a little tighter than I anticipate the batter will be tuned. So if I tap the edge of the snare side head with my finger, I get some ring with a short decay. That applies well to most tunings. If I want a fatter/deeper sound, I still leave the snare side tuned on the higher end, not necessarily a "little tighter" relative to the batter.

Again, it really depends on the sound I want. For more rattle or air, I'll tune the snare side lower for more ring, and more wire buzz.

Bermuda
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  #12  
Old 09-25-2012, 09:36 PM
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Default Re: Evans Hazy 300 question

Quote:
Originally Posted by GRUNTERSDAD View Post
I tried a 500 on one of my snares and it killed the sound. The 500 is almost 67 percent thicker so beware
Yeah, really be careful about that, the snare side is meant to vibrate and be sensitive in order to allow the wires to do their work. There are varying degrees of that sensitivity, but a thicker head simply doesn't vibrate as freely, and is therefore more choked than a thinner version of the same head.

Aghain, it really depends on the desired sound, and the player. A Hazy 500 on a 10" deep snare being slammed hard, would probably respond just fine to the column of air being pushed against it.

Bermuda
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  #13  
Old 09-25-2012, 11:18 PM
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Default Re: Evans Hazy 300 question

Bob Gatzen!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qxm3QunDjUs
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  #14  
Old 09-26-2012, 02:13 AM
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Default Re: Evans Hazy 300 question

I usually tighten reso to 80 on the DD and 90 batter, then go by ear from there. I have hazy 300 on all my snares, just about.
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  #15  
Old 09-26-2012, 05:25 PM
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Default Re: Evans Hazy 300 question

Thanks to everyone for their input. I had a very frustrating night trying to get the drum tuned, it's a Pork Pie 14 x 7 maple, which I have wanted for a while, (since hearing a you tube clip) and since getting it, has been a source of some frustration, user error, not the drum, I should stress.

Presently it has an Aquarian texture coated batter (equivalent to a Coated Ambassador) and the Hazy 300 reso, and after working with the suggestions within this thread I can't get a tune which does not seem to have a ton of overtones/ring.

I understand that with a single ply head, that there will be some ring, which is to a degree desirable, and I don't really want to moongel the head to muffle it. So, today's question is what is considered acceptable ring compared to too much ring (almost impossible to answer in a forum without sound!), and should I perhaps think about moving to a two ply head as a means of controlling the ring?

As always, I appreciate the help this forum provides.
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  #16  
Old 09-26-2012, 05:43 PM
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Default Re: Evans Hazy 300 question

A snare side reso head....the film will stretch before breaking. You can get pretty tight on them. I think you should get an old snare side reso, one you don't care about, and experiment with how tight you can get it before it starts to stretch out. I tighten mine pretty close to max. I listen to the note it makes. I've been doing it long enough that I know the note I like. It's pretty high. To my ear, snares don't come really alive until that reso approaches it's upper limits. You have to stretch a few snare side heads to understand where the upper limits are though. The drum dial will go somewhere in the 90's on a 3 mil head... after that, more cranking of the tension rods doesn't increase the number, instead the film stretches. That's too much obviously.

Again, tapping the reso to hear the note is the most reliable way I know. Once I get it to the note I like, I stop. You don't want to stretch the reso, but you do need to get it pretty tight to get the most from your snare. IMO. With a tight reso, every tuning from low to medium to high sounds great, again, JMO.
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  #17  
Old 09-26-2012, 09:15 PM
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Default Re: Evans Hazy 300 question

Larry, great idea about the old head, will certainly give an idea about how far to go, thanks
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  #18  
Old 09-27-2012, 02:27 AM
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Default Re: Evans Hazy 300 question

How much ring is entirely up to you but remember it will sound completely different from 15-20 feet away. You should have a friend play it for you and stand away. If you like Aqurian you might try a Hi-Velocity (awesome head!), Studio-X or Focus-X to get rid of the unwanted ring, In an Evans head you might try the ST dry, Genera HD dry, or regular Genera dry.
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  #19  
Old 09-27-2012, 04:46 PM
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Default Re: Evans Hazy 300 question

Zardoss, thanks for your suggestion, great timing, as I read this post as I was heading to my LDS, and picked up a Studio X, which has made a great improvement. Thanks!
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  #20  
Old 09-28-2012, 02:00 AM
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Default Re: Evans Hazy 300 question

Quote:
Originally Posted by HMNY View Post
Zardoss, thanks for your suggestion, great timing, as I read this post as I was heading to my LDS, and picked up a Studio X, which has made a great improvement. Thanks!
Your welcome, ...........................
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  #21  
Old 10-08-2012, 04:54 PM
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Default Re: Evans Hazy 300 question

So, having installed a Hazy 300 on my snare, and then started to tune it, I have come to a point where I can turn the lugs a quarter turn and it appears that the tension is not increasing.

As I stand at present, the DD shows a tension of approx 80, and has been doing so, even as I add turns to the lugs, which suggests to me that I am no longer increasing tension, but actually stretching the head material, which is clearly not good, so, am I just installing it wrong, or could I have a bad head?

I thought it was possible to crank a snare side head pretty tight, is this not the case, or is there a certain way to tighten? At present, I am using the star/opposite method?

Any input would be appreciated.

Thanks
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  #22  
Old 10-08-2012, 05:19 PM
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Default Re: Evans Hazy 300 question

Quote:
Originally Posted by HMNY View Post
So, having installed a Hazy 300 on my snare, and then started to tune it, I have come to a point where I can turn the lugs a quarter turn and it appears that the tension is not increasing.
This indicates that the head isn't evenly tensioned. If turning a quarter turn and nothing happens, try turning a quarter on the opposite lug and see if the pitch rises, it probably will.
However, in my experience, the snare side head is the least responsive to turns with a drum key so you may have to crank it up quite a bit. Don't be afraid to go high, a good range for 14" snare side heads is between G and B. Use a piano, or perhaps an online tuning fork for reference. Are you using 2 drum keys? I feel that it helps a lot.
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  #23  
Old 10-08-2012, 06:54 PM
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Default Re: Evans Hazy 300 question

Sjogras,

Sorry if I was not clear, I had been tensioning all the lugs on bottom head, not just one, working all the way around the head in a criss cross pattern.

None of the tension increases that I would have expected from cranking up the lugs seem to be actually resulting in the head tension increasing, the drum dial readings seem to stay the same.

I got to the stage where I was thinking if the head is not getting any tighter, maybe I am just stretching the mylar?

I can keep going, I just fear that the head is going to pop, or pull out of the collar, this is he first time I have ever replaced a snare side head, so I just don't know what to expect.

Thanks
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  #24  
Old 10-09-2012, 03:12 AM
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Default Re: Evans Hazy 300 question

Listen for the note of the head, tune it between G and B. You can tune several notes higher, the head won't break. To give you an idea of how you could tune your snare. If a drum head snaps while tuning, go back to the store and demand a refund.

Last edited by Sjogras; 10-10-2012 at 10:53 PM.
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  #25  
Old 10-11-2012, 06:46 PM
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Default Re: Evans Hazy 300 question

Ive used the Orchestral 300 in place of the Hazy 300 and have had excellent results. The difference is that the Orchestral is basically a lightly coated Hazy which allows for more snare wire 'bite' into the head and a livelier sound.

YMMV


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  #26  
Old 10-11-2012, 06:54 PM
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Default Re: Evans Hazy 300 question

Thanks Florian, another one to look out for.

The more I research this the more confused I get, some opine the snare head needs to be cranked up as tight as possible, others say keep it loose! argh!

I think I am going to study the triangle!
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  #27  
Old 10-15-2012, 12:05 AM
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Default Re: Evans Hazy 300 question

I was just about to post a thread about the Hazy 300, then saw this.

I've never used them before, always preferring Remo Ambassadors. Anyway, recently I put one one a Sonor Hilite drum I have owned for quite a few years. It's a very lively and responsive Maple drum, especially given it is 7" deep. But, right now the drum is not the same drum and I can't help wondering if the Hazy 300 is too thick. I am going to experiment further with tuning but if I can't resolve it I am going to have to change the head already.

Any thoughts?
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  #28  
Old 10-15-2012, 04:03 AM
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Default Re: Evans Hazy 300 question

A hazy 300 is the same weight as a hazy Ambassador, so it isn't the thickness that's causing the problem.

Don't have much else to offer you haven't already mentioned; I'd fiddle around with the tuning some more and if that still doesn't work I'd try a new head.
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  #29  
Old 10-16-2012, 12:35 AM
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Default Re: Evans Hazy 300 question

Quote:
Originally Posted by Winston_Wolf View Post
A hazy 300 is the same weight as a hazy Ambassador, so it isn't the thickness that's causing the problem.

Don't have much else to offer you haven't already mentioned; I'd fiddle around with the tuning some more and if that still doesn't work I'd try a new head.
I checked the Remo website after my post because I was interested to see how they compared and you are correct in what you say. I have taken the resonant head up further and the drum is getting better. One other factor: this drum has a very deep-cut snare bed. It's quite radical really - different to any other snare I own.
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  #30  
Old 10-30-2012, 04:45 AM
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Default Re: Evans Hazy 300 question

I have had great luck with the Evans Orchestral 200 on my Acrolite. It is 2 mills ,so I don't need to crank it as much to pitch it about a minor third above the batter head. The snares really vibrate easily , and I get quick response.
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