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  #1  
Old 07-24-2012, 11:01 AM
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Default Heads up! Aquarian - Evans

Just wanted to let you know, over the next three weeks, we're carrying out extensive A-B testing on Evans & Aquarian heads. We're taking the time to accurately match the sonic performance of heads with the character of our new series of drums. There is no bias in these tests, even though I'm a life long Evans player. Put simply, the heads that are best suited to the Origin series drums will be the heads that are offered as standard. The heads will be tested on three ranges of drums, each distinctly different, so requiring specific head selection.

I'll be back here to let you know the results, & why we made the choices we did. I hope you find this process as interesting as I do.
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Old 07-24-2012, 11:16 AM
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Default Re: Heads up! Aquarian - Evans

Look forward to the results and the reasons why you choosed such or such heads for the drums.
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Old 07-24-2012, 12:48 PM
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Default Re: Heads up! Aquarian - Evans

Very cool and am interested in the findings as well.
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Old 07-24-2012, 02:25 PM
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Default Re: Heads up! Aquarian - Evans

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Originally Posted by keep it simple View Post
Put simply, the heads that are best suited to the Origin series drums will be the heads that are offered as standard.
Is it that easily quantifiable though mate? I may love the tonal quality of the drum, but prefer that little bit of extra focus of a two ply head as opposed to you or Dean who are doing the testing and hear the best results with a single ply.

I mean that as a genuine question too....not trying to be a belligerent smartarse (we all know I'm capable of it, but it's the sort of thing I'll leave for Sticks' next appearance). I just wonder if it's a lot of extra work that will perhaps be negated by the personal choice or individual ear of the person who ultimately ends up with the kit anyway.
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Old 07-24-2012, 03:23 PM
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Default Re: Heads up! Aquarian - Evans

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Originally Posted by Pocket-full-of-gold View Post
Is it that easily quantifiable though mate? I may love the tonal quality of the drum, but prefer that little bit of extra focus of a two ply head as opposed to you or Dean who are doing the testing and hear the best results with a single ply.

I mean that as a genuine question too....not trying to be a belligerent smartarse (we all know I'm capable of it, but it's the sort of thing I'll leave for Sticks' next appearance). I just wonder if it's a lot of extra work that will perhaps be negated by the personal choice or individual ear of the person who ultimately ends up with the kit anyway.
Not belligerent at all my inverted friend :) It's a good point, but I'll explain our thinking, & I'd very much appreciate your opinion.

The whole concept of this new series is to offer two distinct ranges, plus a full custom option for those who wish to augment according to their own vibe. In each of the two ranges, unlike a full custom offering, we've specified every element of the build to achieve what we believe represents a distinctive & high performing instrument. That means, in each range, one wood choice, one shell construction choice, one hoop choice. Exactly the same as buying a specific range from a major manufacturer, but at a much higher level. You either like the range, or you don't. If you don't, but still like the concept, you can go custom. In with that principal of offering a wholly designed instrument, we include the heads. Of course, if you want different heads, we'll fit them from new, no problem (now that's something the major makers won't do). We're effectively saying, "this is how we think the kit sounds best". Most major makers pretty much expect the customer to change their budget head offerings as soon as possible. Not all, but most, irrespective of their marketing. We, on the other hand, expect to deliver that instrument ready to go, & sounding it's best.

One of the downsides to full custom is the customer's ability to specify features that truly deliver the sound they're after. We can advise of course, but ultimately, it's the customer's decision. With our Origin Performance & Classic ranges, we've done all that testing & adjusting for them. They have a defined voice, & our selection of heads is a fundamental part of that.
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Old 07-24-2012, 03:38 PM
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Default Re: Heads up! Aquarian - Evans

I'm curious about the selection process. Do you test a kit with a variety of head types? Is it kind of like the company's rating system? What I mean by that is, that a particular Origin drumkit is "rated" for single-ply heads? I hope I make sense.

And in turn, does this mean that putting two-plies on them would produce unsatisfactory results, or maybe be something that you wouldn't recommend? Or is there a suggest range of thickness that will be recommended?

I find this all fascinating, by the way. Especially being able to talk to a maker about it.
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Old 07-24-2012, 03:58 PM
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Default Re: Heads up! Aquarian - Evans

I have veered over to the Aquarian camp of late, having not had much joy with Evans, so I will be very interested to hear your view, my main issue was never being able to tune Evans heads, which I acknowledge may be 'user error'. Looking forward to the results.

[Slightly off topic, how are your preparations for the London show coming along?]
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Old 07-25-2012, 09:42 AM
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Default Re: Heads up! Aquarian - Evans

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Originally Posted by PDPx7Drummer View Post
Remo doesn't get a shot in this test? :(
Not this time round. Remo make some great heads, no doubt about that, but in previous testing, we found considerable inconsistencies compared to Evans. As we've already tested Remo heads quite extensively, there's no need to repeat that exercise right now. In the future, maybe.

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Originally Posted by mikeyhanson View Post
I'm curious about the selection process. Do you test a kit with a variety of head types? Is it kind of like the company's rating system? What I mean by that is, that a particular Origin drumkit is "rated" for single-ply heads? I hope I make sense.
Making lots of sense Mikey :) Yes, we're testing many head types. Part of the testing is to ensure the design works well with as many head styles as possible, & the other part is to identify the heads we feel best reflect the performance we're looking to achieve with the instrument. The heads we identify are the ones our drums will be offered with as standard, but the customer can still request different heads if they wish.

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And in turn, does this mean that putting two-plies on them would produce unsatisfactory results, or maybe be something that you wouldn't recommend? Or is there a suggest range of thickness that will be recommended?
In short, no. Quite the reverse, re: the process described above. We want the drums to be as flexible as possible, but their specific design of each range makes them better suited to certain ranges of heads. For example, our Classic range within the Origin series features segmented wood hoops across the range. They're designed to work with the ultra resonant shells to produce huge shell tone but shorter head sustain. That's a dream combination for those seeking classic & early jazz character in their instrument. In such a context, heavily pre muffled heads would dry the sound too much. The hoops & bearing edges have already been optimised to achieve that, so we wouldn't regard such heads as an appropriate choice.

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[Slightly off topic, how are your preparations for the London show coming along?]
Manic, absolute madness. So much to do, so little time. I'm probably putting in over 70 hours/week right now, & I know Dean's doing the same. We go to press review in just over two weeks time, & we haven't even built the review kits yet!
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Old 07-25-2012, 10:01 AM
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Default Re: Heads up! Aquarian - Evans

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Originally Posted by keep it simple View Post
One of the downsides to full custom is the customer's ability to specify features that truly deliver the sound they're after. We can advise of course, but ultimately, it's the customer's decision. With our Origin Performance & Classic ranges, we've done all that testing & adjusting for them. They have a defined voice, & our selection of heads is a fundamental part of that.
This is a win/win for both builder and owner. Very cool that you are going the extra mile and glean the knowledge. You can explain the differences and possibly give sound samples to prospects. I too am curious to see the results.
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Old 07-26-2012, 02:28 AM
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Default Re: Heads up! Aquarian - Evans

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They have a defined voice, & our selection of heads is a fundamental part of that.
Sorry mate, I meant to get back to this yesterday and life kept rudely interrupting.

Makes perfect sense and I guess that was the detail that I was missing. Too easy to fall back on years of drum buying history (including swapping out heads) and overlook the fact that this concept is far more than just a custom kit build. It really is a game changer in every sense. Certainly stands to reason that given hardware and hoops are specifically married to each shell, then an element as fundamental as head selection would be a "recommended paramater" too.

It really is a complete sonic experience that goes above and beyond anything that's currently being done. Interesting stuff indeed.
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Old 07-26-2012, 06:09 AM
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Default Re: Heads up! Aquarian - Evans

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Most major makers pretty much expect the customer to change their budget head offerings as soon as possible. Not all, but most, irrespective of their marketing. We, on the other hand, expect to deliver that instrument ready to go, & sounding it's best.
.
Where's the fun in that? You mean I don't get to go spend 100 bucks on heads to get the right sound?
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Old 07-26-2012, 06:32 AM
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Default Re: Heads up! Aquarian - Evans

Most of my kits came with first quality heads from the factory. The only heads that I had to change from the get go were the Ludwig heads on my Classic Maple kit and that's because some of the "Medium" heads sounded like trash and did not match the sonic characteristics of one another. Some of my kits came with Remo and others came with Evans. I believe it really should be up to the owner of the drums to make an up close and personal decision on what sounds best to his or her ears encompassing the type of playing they do. I'll usually play through a set of heads on new drums unless I have an incident like I had with the Ludwig heads.

Dennis
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Old 07-26-2012, 11:25 AM
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Default Re: Heads up! Aquarian - Evans

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I believe it really should be up to the owner of the drums to make an up close and personal decision on what sounds best to his or her ears encompassing the type of playing they do. I'll usually play through a set of heads on new drums unless I have an incident like I had with the Ludwig heads.

Dennis
Completely agree Dennis, & we're not taking away from that at all. There will be no difference between ourselves and other companies, in so much as our drums will come with a standard set of heads included. The difference is, our drums will arrive with a set of heads that have been selected specifically to work in harmony with the drum's design principals, & our customers will also have a choice of heads to select from. You don't usually get a head choice from new with the major companies. Moreover, those head choices will also have been tested with the specific drum build, & we can advise our customers what affect their choice will have. The overall aim is to save our customers both time & money, but the choice still remains with them.

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This is a win/win for both builder and owner. Very cool that you are going the extra mile and glean the knowledge. You can explain the differences and possibly give sound samples to prospects. I too am curious to see the results.
Thanks! It will take a while to put together sound samples, but that is our aim.

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Originally Posted by Pocket-full-of-gold View Post
Certainly stands to reason that given hardware and hoops are specifically married to each shell, then an element as fundamental as head selection would be a "recommended paramater" too.

It really is a complete sonic experience that goes above and beyond anything that's currently being done. Interesting stuff indeed.
We view head selection as a fundamental part of the customers needs appraisal process, just as we do on custom drums. The difference this time around, is that much of the work will be done up front, & that makes matters faster & clearer for our customers.

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Where's the fun in that? You mean I don't get to go spend 100 bucks on heads to get the right sound?
Yes, lol, how dare we try to save our customers money & remove the joy of putting good quality heads on their drums :) Of course, the customer can still change out their heads if they don't like them, pretty much the same as from any other company. It's just that we've put the effort in to get it just right from the start, & if the customer wants different heads supplied with their drums, then no problem. Sure saves them the hassle & expense of buying a new set of heads. The cost of re heading a kit isn't usually factored into the buying decision by the customer, but on kits that come with less than great heads, it actually adds quite a lump onto the price.
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Old 07-26-2012, 12:37 PM
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Default Re: Heads up! Aquarian - Evans

Thanks for that. This all sounds very interesting and makes sense to me. Looking forward to hear what you come up with.
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Old 07-26-2012, 06:49 PM
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Default Re: Heads up! Aquarian - Evans

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Thanks for that. This all sounds very interesting and makes sense to me. Looking forward to hear what you come up with.
I'll be sure to post our finding here when we're done :)

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Originally Posted by PDPx7Drummer View Post

Will there be video of this test or at least well recorded sound so we can hear the differences?

Look forward to your findings anyway.....
There won't be a video of the testing. Just too busy to fit that in. I will describe our findings, & post our results. Additionally, there will eventually be video & quality audio of the new series c/w our chosen head setup.
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Old 07-26-2012, 11:33 PM
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Default Re: Heads up! Aquarian - Evans

It would be interesting if you guys tried actual old skool calf skin ;) Maybe a head with actual fur on it for the bass reso.
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Old 07-27-2012, 12:42 AM
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It would be interesting if you guys tried actual old skool calf skin ;) Maybe a head with actual fur on it for the bass reso.
You know Bo, you're closer than you may think with that remark ;)
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Old 07-28-2012, 02:09 PM
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Default Re: Heads up! Aquarian - Evans

UPDATE:

All the Aquarian heads arrived yesterday (all 46 of them actually :) )

My initial impression from tap testing and general inspection is that they're looking very good. For the detail loving amongst you, these are the heads we'll be testing;

Bass drum heads;

Superkick II
Force II
Regulator
Modern Vintage c/w felt strip
Texture coated


Snare heads;

Texture coated
Texture coated reverse power dot
Modern Vintage medium
Classic clear snareside


Tom heads;

Classic clear
Classic white
Classic black
Super - 2
Modern Vintage medium
Texture coated

Testing starts in circa 2 weeks, & will take 3 full days.
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Last edited by keep it simple; 07-28-2012 at 05:24 PM.
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Old 07-28-2012, 02:43 PM
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Default Re: Heads up! Aquarian - Evans

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Originally Posted by keep it simple View Post
UPDATE:
these are the heads we'll be testing;

Snare heads;

Texture coated reverse power dot
oh noes....if you find the secret formula, can you release it to the masses? This head baffles me.
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Old 07-28-2012, 04:30 PM
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Default Re: Heads up! Aquarian - Evans

What, no sk1, studio x or texture coated studio x,lo, BTW I didnt see any snare side reso heads there either.

Edit: oops, my bad, I see the classic clear snare side now, dunno how I missed that.

Last edited by tard; 07-28-2012 at 07:44 PM.
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Old 07-28-2012, 05:21 PM
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Default Re: Heads up! Aquarian - Evans

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What, no sk1, studio x or texture coated studio x,lo,
SK1's are yet to arrive. As Aquarian's distributor is closed for the next two weeks, they'll miss our deadline, but we will get to those heads. As for the others, with the exception of pre muffled bass drum heads, we have no interest in muffled heads generally. Our bearing edges are designed to take out just the right amount of excess high overtones, & this test is all about getting the drums to sound their best, in our opinion. Sure, if you want to really dry out the drum, feel free to do so, as you're offered a full choice on drum purchase.

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BTW I didnt see any snare side reso heads there either.
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Originally Posted by keep it simple View Post

Snare heads;

Texture coated
Texture coated reverse power dot
Modern Vintage medium
Classic clear snareside
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeyhanson View Post
oh noes....if you find the secret formula, can you release it to the masses? This head baffles me.
What baffles you about a reverse dot my friend?
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Old 07-28-2012, 05:45 PM
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Default Re: Heads up! Aquarian - Evans

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What baffles you about a reverse dot my friend?
I just had a heck of a time trying to get a handle on it. Ended up putting it in my backup stack. Bummer too, as I thought it might be something that I'm looking for. Too ringy off the dot.
/derail
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Old 07-28-2012, 07:52 PM
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As for the others, with the exception of pre muffled bass drum heads, we have no interest in muffled heads generally. Our bearing edges are designed to take out just the right amount of excess high overtones, & this test is all about getting the drums to sound their best, in our opinion. Sure, if you want to really dry out the drum, feel free to do so, as you're offered a full choice on drum purchase.
I see what your saying, I only asked about the studio x because I saw the reverse power dot head there and wondered if that was being tested then why not the X as I have found it to be in between the clear and the dot, plus the X seems to remove a bit of the highs where the dot seems to remove more of the lows. Just my 2 cents...lol
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Old 07-29-2012, 09:10 AM
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I see what your saying, I only asked about the studio x because I saw the reverse power dot head there and wondered if that was being tested then why not the X as I have found it to be in between the clear and the dot, plus the X seems to remove a bit of the highs where the dot seems to remove more of the lows. Just my 2 cents...lol
Good info :) Main reason for testing out the reverse dot, is we get many customers asking for them.

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I just had a heck of a time trying to get a handle on it. Ended up putting it in my backup stack. Bummer too, as I thought it might be something that I'm looking for. Too ringy off the dot.
/derail
Ok, get what you're saying. Just for my own curiosity, what snare drum are you applying them to? In my experience, the performance of reverse dot really depends on the bearing edge profile & hoop combo. I'd expect the result you're getting on a drum with sharp batter bearing edge profile & triple flange hoops, especially steel, brass, or thicker maple shells.
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Old 07-29-2012, 11:15 AM
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Default Re: Heads up! Aquarian - Evans

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Just for my own curiosity, what snare drum are you applying them to? In my experience, the performance of reverse dot really depends on the bearing edge profile & hoop combo. I'd expect the result you're getting on a drum with sharp batter bearing edge profile & triple flange hoops, especially steel, brass, or thicker maple shells.
Yes, a Ludwig Epic Centurian snare drum with a triple-flange hoop. It didn't even cross my mind to try the cast hoop with that head. I'll have to try that today. Don't know what I was thinking.
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Old 07-29-2012, 06:24 PM
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In my experience, the performance of reverse dot really depends on the bearing edge profile & hoop combo. I'd expect the result you're getting on a drum with sharp batter bearing edge profile & triple flange hoops, especially steel, brass, or thicker maple shells.
Funny, Like I said I find the reverse texture coated dot has no ring, the regular texture coated has some and the coated studio x is right in the middle and my 1 3/4" thick maple snares have sharp 45 degree bearing edge and triple flanged hoops.
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Old 07-29-2012, 08:35 PM
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Yes, a Ludwig Epic Centurian snare drum with a triple-flange hoop. It didn't even cross my mind to try the cast hoop with that head. I'll have to try that today. Don't know what I was thinking.
That should dry it out Mikey :)

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Funny, Like I said I find the reverse texture coated dot has no ring, the regular texture coated has some and the coated studio x is right in the middle and my 1 3/4" thick maple snares have sharp 45 degree bearing edge and triple flanged hoops.
Depends on tuning too :)
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Old 09-19-2012, 02:22 PM
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Default Re: Heads up! Aquarian - Evans

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I'll be back here to let you know the results, & why we made the choices we did. I hope you find this process as interesting as I do.
Any chance to know the results ??
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