EMO!!!!!!!!!!!

[The Scorpio]

Good morning brethren. I can't stand Emo rock (post punk.) If you're not sure what kind of music I'm talking about, check this out

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vbo4TwjXmoE

Ok so here's the deal. I'm ok with the music. I find the drumming to be pretty cool and high-energy. But the vocal delivery and lyrics totally turn me off.

First off I think "emo" is a marketing tool used by bands and labels to sell CD's and merch to young girls. I don't mind marketing but I am against lying, and that's what I feel emo is. Most men are not extremely emotional and sensitive, and almost every single one of their songs talks about their feelings in a very sappy, non-realistic way. I want honest music with soul. I'd rather hear a song about how much someone love's cheeseburgers (assuming that they really do) than someone singing about how much they miss their ex-girlfriend and want to cry every time they think about her, when they are actually totally fine.

The honest truth is that these guys are selling false catharsis!!! I know a few emo bands personally and I can vouch for the fact that they are just like regular guys. They are not overly sensitive or in touch with their emotions any more than the rest of us are. They also openly admit to manufacturing their music for the sole intent and purpose of making a buck. I guess that's fine and that's their prerogative, but there seems to be little to no artistic integrity, and that really breaks my insensitive heart.

I know the taste is in the mouth, but I'm wondering if anyone else has had a similar reaction, or a different reaction and why.

-Kyle

[Devils Haircut]

The cosmetics industry has struck a deal with the music industry (much like they did in the 80's) to get teen males to wear eye makeup, thus opening their sales to 100% of the teen market. I'm not a fan of the music, but at least this group of kids is at least listening to actual instruments in their music.

[hvymtlmike]

I'm ok with emotion as long as it is real and you can definately tell the difference from when an artist writes something that has had an impact within them vs someone making something up to simple make a song. I completely dislike the delivery of the lyrics also. A lot of emo tries to be whiny and it disgusts me. Their music is fake not unlike their fans from my experience. Not my enviroment period.

[Mad About Drums]

Hi Kyle

That's an interesting thread this, somewhat delicate, as somebody's favourite music/artists is always somebody's most awful music. I had several discussion with friends on that subject, not solely related to EMO's music, just a style or an artist that I dislike a lot.

You're right "the taste is in the mouth" but, somehow, I have difficulty to like superficial music, and the EMO style is not my cup of tea, it's a fashion statement which reminds me the "punk era" of the late 70's, I really hated that music and the statement/fashion that came with it, and the lyrics? well no comments... anarchy and all that stuff, you look at some of these artists now, they din't live the life they were preaching at the time.

I much prefer artists who write lyrics about real stuff that's happen in their life than superficial lyrics. And, the reality, the EMO's not the only one culprit in that matter.

I feel that an instrumental jazz song with an inspiring title (no vocals!) tells me more about emotions and life experience than any of these superficial artists/band that's following a fashion statement in the music industry.

[Ted T]

Originally Posted by The Scorpio

I'd rather hear a song about how much someone love's cheeseburgers (assuming that they really do) than someone singing about how much they miss their ex-girlfriend and want to cry every time they think about her, when they are actually totally fine.

-Kyle

Oh I really do. Don't forget the jalepenos, melted pepper jack, and barbecue sauce. Ohhhhhhh yeaahh...... I can smell a hit single coming. I should write it in the style of "Uneasy Rider" or "The Devil Went Down to Georgia."

CAN YOU FEEL IT??
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AsUW8JcnzZs (Warning: Jim Carrey)

[The Scorpio]

Originally Posted by Ted T

Oh I really do. Don't forget the jalepenos, melted pepper jack, and barbecue sauce. Ohhhhhhh yeaahh...... I can smell a hit single coming. I should write it in the style of "Uneasy Rider" or "The Devil Went Down to Georgia."

CAN YOU FEEL IT??
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AsUW8JcnzZs (Warning: Jim Carrey)

Why yes Ted, yes I can lol. If this song comes to fruition please bring it to my attention!

[The Scorpio]

Originally Posted by Mad About Drums

Hi Kyle

That's an interesting thread this, somewhat delicate, as somebody's favourite music/artists is always somebody's most awful music. I had several discussion with friends on that subject, not solely related to EMO's music, just a style or an artist that I dislike a lot.

You're right "the taste is in the mouth" but, somehow, I have difficulty to like superficial music, and the EMO style is not my cup of tea, it's a fashion statement which reminds me the "punk era" of the late 70's, I really hated that music and the statement/fashion that came with it, and the lyrics? well no comments... anarchy and all that stuff, you look at some of these artists now, they din't live the life they were preaching at the time.

I much prefer artists who write lyrics about real stuff that's happen in their life than superficial lyrics. And, the reality, the EMO's not the only one culprit in that matter.

I feel that an instrumental jazz song with an inspiring title (no vocals!) tells me more about emotions and life experience than any of these superficial artists/band that's following a fashion statement in the music industry.

Double bonus points on the jazz song with an inspiring title. I feel exactly the same way.

I think I'd also make a correlation between emo and 80's rock. (Motley Crue, Def Leppard, Whitesnake, Poison) Because 80's rock seemed to be more about image than the music.

There that should get some more people involved ;)

-Kyle

[BradGunnerSGT]

Originally Posted by The Scorpio

Good morning brethren. I can't stand Emo rock (post punk.) If you're not sure what kind of music I'm talking about, check this out

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vbo4TwjXmoE

Ok so here's the deal. I'm ok with the music. I find the drumming to be pretty cool and high-energy. But the vocal delivery and lyrics totally turn me off.

First off I think "emo" is a marketing tool used by bands and labels to sell CD's and merch to young girls. I don't mind marketing but I am against lying, and that's what I feel emo is. Most men are not extremely emotional and sensitive, and almost every single one of their songs talks about their feelings in a very sappy, non-realistic way. I want honest music with soul. I'd rather hear a song about how much someone love's cheeseburgers (assuming that they really do) than someone singing about how much they miss their ex-girlfriend and want to cry every time they think about her, when they are actually totally fine.

The honest truth is that these guys are selling false catharsis!!! I know a few emo bands personally and I can vouch for the fact that they are just like regular guys. They are not overly sensitive or in touch with their emotions any more than the rest of us are. They also openly admit to manufacturing their music for the sole intent and purpose of making a buck. I guess that's fine and that's their prerogative, but there seems to be little to no artistic integrity, and that really breaks my insensitive heart.

I know the taste is in the mouth, but I'm wondering if anyone else has had a similar reaction, or a different reaction and why.

-Kyle

I always wonder why guys from Podunk, Ohio sing like British punk singers from the 70's...::cough:: Green Day ::cough::

(Disclaimer, I've always kind of like Green Day but that fake British accent he sings with drives me nuts.)

[BradGunnerSGT]

Originally Posted by BradGunnerSGT

I always wonder why guys from Podunk, Ohio sing like British punk singers from the 70's...::cough:: Green Day ::cough::

(Disclaimer, I've always kind of like Green Day but that fake British accent he sings with drives me nuts.)

Not to pick on any one style of music, though...there are a lot of country singers who affect a twangier singing voice than their normal speaking voice.

[Red Menace]

Originally Posted by BradGunnerSGT

Not to pick on any one style of music, though...there are a lot of country singers who affect a twangier singing voice than their normal speaking voice.

Hah! I have an "old-timey" voice that I use for a couple of songs. I made a joke about it when we played at a street fair a few weeks back. "OK folks, let me put on my "old timey" voice for this next song!"

I caught the singer of my other band putting on a faux-brit accent for a cover, I think it was a Kinks tune. As soon as I pointed it out he got embarrassed and said he'd try to avoid doing it again.

[Stalwart_Pandora-Chris]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vDSsh7Ocv8o
This is the real emo. Like, the emo that started it.
The 90's emo was much more enjoyable and had more groove.

Today's "emo" I wouldn't call very emo. It's happy songs with key changes in the Drop D guitars and constant double bass breakdown stuff. And it attracts scene kids and little girls so yeah... It's more about marketing, less about music.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f6XK7G__iSM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5bZCrPybKww


Music changes alot, but older emo is much better. And more musical.

Music has died these days, that's what we all need to deal with :(

[adam!]

I'm with you Scorpio... I can't stand it either. Even the chord progressions sound "angsty". I don't relate to this music at all, and if I'm exposed to it, I feel like I'm developing cross-gender parts....
If I listen to heavy music, it has to be either A) aggressive or B) intelligent.

[moontheloon]

the term Emo means nothing

[The Scorpio]

Originally Posted by Stalwart_Pandora-Chris

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vDSsh7Ocv8o
This is the real emo. Like, the emo that started it.
The 90's emo was much more enjoyable and had more groove.

Today's "emo" I wouldn't call very emo. It's happy songs with key changes in the Drop D guitars and constant double bass breakdown stuff. And it attracts scene kids and little girls so yeah... It's more about marketing, less about music.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f6XK7G__iSM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5bZCrPybKww


Music changes alot, but older emo is much better. And more musical.

Music has died these days, that's what we all need to deal with :(

I completely agree with you Chris. I have no earthy idea how something that had so much potential turned into the humongous pile of crap that it is lol!!!

-Kyle

[kettles]

I don't know if it's officially true emo or not, but the older Jimmy Eat World stuff is great - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_0i_hXUCFnM http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zw9wZyWErz4

Originally Posted by kettles

I don't know if it's officially true emo or not, but the older Jimmy Eat World stuff is great - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_0i_hXUCFnM http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zw9wZyWErz4

nah man, i'd always considered jimmy eat world in that foo fighters kinda radio rock

love the thread Scorpio. FALSE CATHARSIS!!! you nailed it!!

HATE emo music and the subculture. the whole premise is these idiots thinking they're original and individualistic, just like the other kids who can afford/choose to dress, talk, and act like them. they have these criteria online (no joke) that explain how to be emo, and you have to meet these pre-stablished guidelines before you can be given the approval as genuine or deep (cause being yourself only counts if you fit into a click-lol).you hear these emo guys say "ya know, it's like our music is emotional, that's why it's called emo, cuz you know we express ourselves (i guess they never heard of soul, r&b, jazz, gospel, blues....all music is emotional, retards), nobody knows what it's like to go to the wealthiest schools, to be in the upper echelons of socioeconomic status and show not a stitch of gratitude, spend hundreds of dollars a week at hot topic when my parents expect me to drive there in one of the four cars they have, when i want my own....they have no idea the hell they put me through."

[The Scorpio]

Originally Posted by drumfreak1987

nah man, i'd always considered jimmy eat world in that foo fighters kinda radio rock

love the thread Scorpio. FALSE CATHARSIS!!! you nailed it!!

HATE emo music and the subculture. the whole premise is these idiots thinking they're original and individualistic, just like the other kids who can afford to dress, talk, and act like them. they have these criteria online (no joke) that explain how to be emo, and you have to meet these pre-stablished guidelines before you can be given the approval as genuine or deep (cause being yourself only counts if you fit into a click-lol).you hear these emo guys say "ya know, it's like our music is emotional, that's why it's called emo, cuz you know we express ourselves (i guess they never heard of soul, r&b, jazz, gospel, blues....all music is emotional, retards), nobody knows what it's like to go to the wealthiest schools, to be in the upper echelons of socioeconomic status and show not a stitch of gratitude, spend hundreds of dollars a week at hot topic when my parents expect me to drive there in one of the four cars they have, when i want my own....they have no idea the hell they put me through."

No, sir you nailed it lol!! I took a friend (girl) to go see an emo show Monday night, and the whole thing really shocked me. I used to think I didn't like the music because it just wasn't my "style." But with the help of Introductory Sociology, I came to the conclusion in my original post lol.

On the upside though, no music that vapid has ever had more than fifteen years of widespread popularity, so the popularity of "Emo" will most likely decline relatively soon. Or at least I hope so lol.

-Kyle

[moontheloon]

Originally Posted by drumfreak1987

nah man, i'd always considered jimmy eat world in that foo fighters kinda radio rock

love the thread Scorpio. FALSE CATHARSIS!!! you nailed it!!

HATE emo music and the subculture. the whole premise is these idiots thinking they're original and individualistic, just like the other kids who can afford/choose to dress, talk, and act like them. they have these criteria online (no joke) that explain how to be emo, and you have to meet these pre-stablished guidelines before you can be given the approval as genuine or deep (cause being yourself only counts if you fit into a click-lol).you hear these emo guys say "ya know, it's like our music is emotional, that's why it's called emo, cuz you know we express ourselves (i guess they never heard of soul, r&b, jazz, gospel, blues....all music is emotional, retards), nobody knows what it's like to go to the wealthiest schools, to be in the upper echelons of socioeconomic status and show not a stitch of gratitude, spend hundreds of dollars a week at hot topic when my parents expect me to drive there in one of the four cars they have, when i want my own....they have no idea the hell they put me through."

did you just put Jimmy Eat World in the same sentence with Foo Fighters?

and "radio rock"

oh my goodness

and this is an extremely shallow post

I am no "Emo" fan....or whatever you want to call these bands....even though you claiming all these little sub genres makes you as corny as they are......but to lump every band that sounds like this into some rich suburbanite prep school corner is just ridiculous juvenile and frankly stupid

oh the envy I sense is overwhelming

go do something interesting so you dont have to hate on others for making a living

and while yr at it

grow up

[Mad About Drums]

Originally Posted by moontheloon

did you just put Jimmy Eat World in the same sentence with Foo Fighters?

oh my goodness

Yep he sure did... not sure that Taylor Hawkins would like that, nor is Dave Grohl... :-(

[Devils Haircut]

Originally Posted by moontheloon

did you just put Jimmy Eat World in the same sentence with Foo Fighters?

and "radio rock"

oh my goodness

and this is an extremely shallow post

I am no "Emo" fan....or whatever you want to call these bands....even though you claiming all these little sub genres makes you as corny as they are......but to lump every band that sounds like this into some rich suburbanite prep school corner is just ridiculous juvenile and frankly stupid

oh the envy I sense is overwhelming

go do something interesting so you dont have to hate on others for making a living

and while yr at it

grow up

Lighten up. Your meaness is making me feel very emo, hahaha.

[caddywumpus]

Man, the emo of today is NOTHING like the emo that first came out in the mid-90s...

I just listen to Jimmy Eat World for about an hour and all I can say is WOW!!! Doc

[GRUNTERSDAD]

Originally Posted by BradGunnerSGT

I always wonder why guys from Podunk, Ohio sing like British punk singers from the 70's...::cough:: Green Day ::cough::

(Disclaimer, I've always kind of like Green Day but that fake British accent he sings with drives me nuts.)

Can't be any worse than that Australian Country singer Keith Urban singing with that phony country twang. Who is he kidding. Oh yeah the trailer park crowd.

[Pollyanna]

Originally Posted by GRUNTERSDAD

Can't be any worse than that Australian Country singer Keith Urban singing with that phony country twang. Who is he kidding. Oh yeah the trailer park crowd.

Yeah, we get a lot of that here - Australians singing with American accents. Sometimes they do it because they're copping the original and/or the genre is intrinsically American, like soul or, of course, country. Still no excuse, IMO.

Sometimes they do it to get a foothold in US markets, which are *much* more lucrative than Oz's. That at least makes sense - they're chasing greenbacks. That sounds like Keith U.

The phoniness turns me off, though. It smacks of that 51st state cultural cringe that's been hovering around in Oz for the last 40 years ... that was after our extended cultural cringe for the Brits. Trouble is ... you can't sing elegantly with an Oz accent so a neutral accent is as good as it gets for us.

As for emos ... I always thought that was a weird concept.

So some young people are more sensitive and had their sensibilities pummelled by the hard arses ... then they end up with chronic low level depression.

Seems to me that they're beta males and they feel humiliated so they rebel, which in effect gives them the chance to be alphas in their little beta world. Seems fair nuff to me since not all males can be alphas.

I could contextualise this with a discussion about residual chauvinistic patriarchal hangups in society but it would be pretty boring lol

Wondering about the whole idea of "emo". Is "emo" a similar thing to blacks calling each other "nigger" or gays referring to themselves as "queer" - where a subjugated group neautralises the bullies' insults by adopting them as their own?

[moontheloon]

Originally Posted by Devils Haircut

Lighten up. Your meaness is making me feel very emo, hahaha.

just flip your hair out of your face and pout

you will feel better

[Pocket-full-of-gold]

Originally Posted by Pollyanna

Yeah, we get a lot of that here - Australians singing with American accents. Sometimes they do it because they're copping the original and/or the genre is intrinsically American, like soul or, of course, country. Still no excuse, IMO.

Not new though Pol. You only have to listen to all the "British invasion" acts to hear its roots.

And I couldn't agree more.....hearing music sung in our nasally Aussie drawl just sounds so unrefined. I've heard a couple of hip hop acts where I think the Aussie accent works very well.......on the whole though, I'm down with a bit of lyrical "Yankification".

But on the whole the horse has long bolted. Bands from all over the world have adopted the tactic.....The Stones through to ABBA through to Oasis.....the list is endless.

I can live with it.......I grew up knowing no better.

Originally Posted by GRUNTERSDAD

Can't be any worse than that Australian Country singer Keith Urban singing with that phony country twang. Who is he kidding. Oh yeah the trailer park crowd.

He's more Yank than Aussie these days Grunt......you can have him too. ;-)

[moontheloon]

Originally Posted by caddywumpus

Man, the emo of today is NOTHING like the emo that first came out in the mid-90s...

around '96 or '97 was the first time I ever heard that term.....

it was on a magazine cover and it was referring to Radiohead right around the time OK Computer came out ...... saying Radioheads EMO take over....or something like that

at that point it meant emotionally driven music

I have no idea when it turned into some sort of whiney metal ish stuff played by kids all with the same haircut

the next time I heard it was attached to a band called Crumb...who a friend of mine played drums for in the mid 90s

after that I guess it took on a whole new personality

[The Scorpio]

Originally Posted by moontheloon

I have no idea when it turned into some sort of whiney metal ish stuff played by kids all with the same haircut

lol it happened here around 2003 (I was in ninth grade.) I'm still not sure why it happened. I just remember the whining and the haircuts and the skinny jeans became suddenly en vogue and I was like "What the heck is this about?"

[Pocket-full-of-gold]

Originally Posted by moontheloon

I have no idea when it turned into some sort of whiney metal ish stuff played by kids all with the same haircut

That's the progression through "the big machine" mate. From the underground to the mainstream.

Idealistically, punk didn't start out meaning spiked hair, leather jackets and safety pins either.......and when the middle class kids started to embrace it and follow suit, the ideal loses to the image every time.

As Lydon says "Punk was about being yourself. But when the rich kids all started showing up in torn clothes and mohawks like a bunch of mindless clones, I knew the message was lost" [paraphrased]

[moontheloon]

Originally Posted by Pocket-full-of-gold

That's the progression through "the big machine" mate. From the underground to the mainstream.

Idealistically, punk didn't start out meaning spiked hair, leather jackets and safety pins either.......and when the middle class kids started to embrace it and follow suit, the ideal loses to the image every time.

As Lydon says "Punk was about being yourself. But when the rich kids all started showing up in torn clothes and mohawks like a bunch of mindless clones, I knew the message was lost" [paraphrased]

but ripped clothes and safety pins over holes in clothes came from cats like Lydon who were broke and couldnt afford to get new clothes

what is these kids excuse....

did they all these guys go to the barber and say ...make me look like Joan Jett?

[Pocket-full-of-gold]

Originally Posted by moontheloon

but ripped clothes and safety pins over holes in clothes came from cats like Lydon who were broke and couldnt afford to get new clothes

Exactly the point.

Originally Posted by moontheloon

what is these kids excuse....

did they all these guys go to the barber and say ...make me look like Joan Jett?

Yep.....pretty much.

Hi can you cut my hair just like the other 5 kids who've just walked outta here. I need it cut that way because I don't wanna conform.......I'm an individual.......we all are!! :-)

[just another username]

Originally Posted by Stalwart_Pandora-Chris

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vDSsh7Ocv8o
This is the real emo. Like, the emo that started it.
The 90's emo was much more enjoyable and had more groove.

Today's "emo" I wouldn't call very emo. It's happy songs with key changes in the Drop D guitars and constant double bass breakdown stuff. And it attracts scene kids and little girls so yeah... It's more about marketing, less about music.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f6XK7G__iSM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5bZCrPybKww


Music changes alot, but older emo is much better. And more musical.

Music has died these days, that's what we all need to deal with :(

Alright now, i can't much vouch for all these emo bands, but you're crossing a line throwing a day to remember in there. First of all, if you've seen them, no make-up, pretty standard hair cuts, none of this emo nonsense (which btw is being used in correctly, emo=whiny lyrics and vocal style. Post-hardcore= mixing metal breakdowns with pop hooks). Just because some bands in the genre are faking it doesn't mean they all are, otherwise ALL genres would be faked BS. Every type of music has had someone, if not a decent majority of their artists that were just in it for money/sex/fame.

[Pollyanna]

Okay, educate me. Would Robert Smith of The Cure qualify as an emo?

[Mad About Drums]

Originally Posted by Pollyanna

Okay, educate me. Would Robert Smith of The Cure qualify as an emo?

I don't think EMO existed in the mid 80's Polly, we use to call it "New Wave", etiquette, etiquette, etiquette...

[The Scorpio]

Originally Posted by Pollyanna

Okay, educate me. Would Robert Smith of The Cure qualify as an emo?

Hmm...that's a good question. After extensive youtube research (5-6 minutes) I'd say that Robert Smith is not "emo." Or at least emo as we know it today. Having said that, I do think Smith's vocal delivery shares some vague characteristics with contemporary "emo."

[Pollyanna]

Originally Posted by Mad About Drums

I don't think EMO existed in the mid 80's Polly, we use to call it "New Wave", etiquette, etiquette, etiquette...

Sorry MAD, I don't know much about this etiquette stuff :)

Thing is, he had dyed black hair, a whiny voice and he sang slef negating lyrics like "Why Can't I Be You". How about Morrissey? Are these guys precursors to emo? Old emo heroes??

[Mad About Drums]

Originally Posted by Pollyanna

Sorry MAD, I don't know much about this etiquette stuff :)

Thing is, he had dyed black hair, a whiny voice and he sang slef negating lyrics like "Why Can't I Be You". How about Morrissey? Are these guys precursors to emo? Old emo heroes??

Don't be sorry Polly, that etiquette thing change all the time, the same artist playing the same music over the years had his style of music branded with numerous different style, it can be pretty confusing sometimes...

Now The Cure or Morrissey might have been at the start of a new fashion, and perhaps they are the precursor of the EMO trend...

[Ian Williams]

You EMO fans...please enlight me! Is this an emo outfit or sort of?

...and I thought for an instance that Nina Hagen was the Goddess of all emo's!

[moontheloon]

Originally Posted by Pollyanna

Okay, educate me. Would Robert Smith of The Cure qualify as an emo?

I think the Smiths , the Cure, and Joy Division may have credit in the roots of creation

[harryconway]

Just about any, and every generation has their own time period version of "emo" .... people between the ages 17 - 25, no matter what decade you were of ... that age, and the "specific turmoils" of being young, confused, vulnerable ... and you make a connection to a specific music artist that "makes it real" ....

People said the same thing about Elvis Presley, the Beatles, the Stones, Alice Cooper, R.E.M., U2, Rage Against The Machine, NIN, Marilyn Manson, the list is endless ....

Originally Posted by The Scorpio

I think I'd also make a correlation between emo and 80's rock. (Motley Crue, Def Leppard, Whitesnake, Poison) Because 80's rock seemed to be more about image than the music.

Well ... I don't think any one from Motley Crue claim to be master musicians ... they're "Rock Stars" ... entertainers .... pure and simple. Sold millions of albums and been on lord knows how many world tours. You may not like their music, but they are the real deal. When Nikki Sixx OD'd on heroin, died, and was revived by the tenacious efforts of an EMT .... that's about as "keeping it real" as it gets ....and Whitesnake ..... David Coverdale what, hit the scene as lead singer for Deep Purple (at age 23), started Whitesnake in 1978 .... John Sykes, Steve Vai, Vivian Campbell, Adrian Vandenburg ... just some of the guitarists ..... Cozy Powell, Aynsley Dunbar, Tommy Aldridge, Denny Carmassi all sitting behind the drum kit at one time, or another. Maybe no Terry Bozzio polyrhythms abounding, but these cats certainly have musical credential.

As far as skinny jeans and Joan Jett hair .... maybe the Ramones were the first EMO band.