What is the next generation of bar songs? Mustang Sally of tomorrow?

[Devils Haircut]

When I got my first steady paying gig ten years ago, I was 19. I snuck into a bar and sat in with the blues/jazz/bar-tune band and was hired that night since they were multi-instrumentalists who took turns covering the drum duties. They were all in their 40's or 50's and we played everything from funky versions of jazz standards to the typical mustang sally, soul shine, and gloria. I've always liked music that was "before my time" and have no idea what the new bar songs will be. But I hooked up with a 90's cover project that plays some Weezer, "Closing Time" by Semisonic, "Sex and Candy" by Marcy Playground, and a few other 90's Top-40 tunes and one-hit-wonders. Are we the next generation of bar band music? It actually makes me kind of sad because I like the older stuff and the new music I like never really ends up on the radio.

Will we never again hear the drunken war cry of "Play some Skynrd!!!' or "FREE BIRD!"? Will Sally never again ride?

[larryz]

Haha funny topic. My only talent is spelling, hence it's spelled "Skynyrd" !! Toughest band name to spell hands down :)

I'm of the opinion that Mustang Sally would not be missed by anyone if it was never played again. Not that it's my favorite song by Tom Petty & The Heartbreakers (The Waiting is...), but I'd say his "Last Dance With Mary Jane" would take the cake. But that song is even 15 years old???

[Bo Eder]

Hmm. Tough question. Standards are standards and I'm willing to bet we'll still be hearing Mustang Sally and other older songs. I think it depends - right now, the money-paying patrons tend to dictate what gets played. So, until an entire population who think Mustang Sally and Unchained Melody is the bees knees die off, bands will always be playing them. I'm not sure there would be anything really new to take their places, though. As we complain about the newer music just not having it like the older stuff, I'm finding out more frequently that it's true. Other than Nirvana and the Macarena, I don't really remember anything special coming out of the '90s. I mean, it's a different generation too - it's the random access generation with cell phones and iPods - there are alot of bands still out there cranking out music, but who's buying the CDs? Who's really listening like you used to when you had to buy an entire album of music? I'm not saying it's sad, it's just different. Music has to compete with so many other things kids are into these days too.

[Devils Haircut]

Originally Posted by larryz

Haha funny topic. My only talent is spelling, hence it's spelled "Skynyrd" !! Toughest band name to spell hands down :)

I'm of the opinion that Mustang Sally would not be missed by anyone if it was never played again. Not that it's my favorite song by Tom Petty & The Heartbreakers (The Waiting is...), but I'd say his "Last Dance With Mary Jane" would take the cake. But that song is even 15 years old???

Haha, maybe I spelled it in the form of a drunk man's rambling.

Mustang Sally will NOT be missed by gigging musicians...I'd bet money on that.

And funny thing is, we just added Last Dance with Mary Jane! Guitar player just kills with a harp strapped to his face (even if he looks like a nerd wearing dental headgear).

[Duckenheimer]

Where I live the current generation of bar songs seems to be the big anthems of mainly 90s grunge like Alice in Chains and Pearl Jam, and some Chili Peppers and Radiohead. On a wider scale, can there even be another Mustang Sally?

[Devils Haircut]

Originally Posted by Bo Eder

Hmm. Tough question. Standards are standards and I'm willing to bet we'll still be hearing Mustang Sally and other older songs. I think it depends - right now, the money-paying patrons tend to dictate what gets played. So, until an entire population who think Mustang Sally and Unchained Melody is the bees knees die off, bands will always be playing them. I'm not sure there would be anything really new to take their places, though. As we complain about the newer music just not having it like the older stuff, I'm finding out more frequently that it's true. Other than Nirvana and the Macarena, I don't really remember anything special coming out of the '90s. I mean, it's a different generation too - it's the random access generation with cell phones and iPods - there are alot of bands still out there cranking out music, but who's buying the CDs? Who's really listening like you used to when you had to buy an entire album of music? I'm not saying it's sad, it's just different. Music has to compete with so many other things kids are into these days too.

I agree. But I live in a college town with a military base. So the bar crowd is a little younger. Even though I was a teen in the 90's, I listened to older music. Now I listen to a lot of new indie rock, but that may just be me clinging to youth as I'm 12 months from 30. It seems like over the top 80's cover bands in glam rock outfits make the most money around here. Maybe I over looked the 80's, but I'm not a huge fan of that decade.

Another fact to consider (and you briefly hit on it) is that with instant access to music, there really are no more HUGE bands that can hold main stream attention for a decade or more. More exposure for so many bands means that no one stays on top as long.

[Pollyanna]

Maybe it's more an American thing? I can't answer the question in the OP but I've heard very few covers of Mustang Sally and Brown Eyed Girl by anyone over the years and I have never personally gigged those songs.

I used to see a lot of blues and jazz gigs and I've heard a fair few covers of Stormy Monday. In the jazz clubs it used to drive me crazy when the band would say the next song as Misty and everyone would go "Awwww", as though they'd just brought a cute little kitten on stage. Meanwhile I do an inner facepalm.

[Devils Haircut]

Originally Posted by Pollyanna

Maybe it's more an American thing? I can't answer the question in the OP but I've heard very few covers of Mustang Sally and Brown Eyed Girl by anyone over the years and I have never personally gigged those songs.

I used to see a lot of blues and jazz gigs and I've heard a fair few covers of Stormy Monday. In the jazz clubs it used to drive me crazy when the band would say the next song as Misty and everyone would go "Awwww", as though they'd just brought a cute little kitten on stage. Meanwhile I do an inner facepalm.

I thought you guys only played Men At Work in the bars down there.?.?.?.?... ;)

My problem with so-called bar standards is that most bands play them poorly if not wrong. Mustang is rarely played like Pickett and Cropper and the boys wrote it. Instead its actually the Young Rascals version that often played using some little guitar riff that Gene played in their version. The original is Wilson Pickett with Booker T and the MG's and that can't be corny but it often is when played by corny white bread musicians. The reason its a classic bar room song is to play the way Pickett did and stop the second time around and have your dance floor sing the chorus then stop the band so its just them on the reply and simply play it right!! Do you realize that its Alan Jackson Jr. on drums the best drummer/arrainger/engineer/band leader there ever was??? I didn't think so!! Doc

[Pocket-full-of-gold]

Originally Posted by Pollyanna

but I've heard very few covers of Mustang Sally and Brown Eyed Girl by anyone over the years and I have never personally gigged those songs.

Must be a Sydney thing Pol. I've both played them and heard them played relentlessly over the years. Strangely, neither fell into my list of "most hated/overdone"....that little gem was always reserved for Run To Paradise (for the outside of Oz, for reasons known only to the punters, it always featured highly on the most requested list). If I never hear it again, it'll be too soon.

Originally Posted by Devils Haircut

I thought you guys only played Men At Work in the bars down there.?.?.?.?... ;)

Never played Land Downunder, however.

[Devils Haircut]

Originally Posted by Doctor Dirt

My problem with so-called bar standards is that most bands play them poorly if not wrong. Mustang is rarely played like Pickett and Cropper and the boys wrote it. Instead its actually the Young Rascals version that often played using some little guitar riff that Gene played in their version. The original is Wilson Pickett with Booker T and the MG's and that can't be corny but it often is when played by corny white bread musicians. The reason its a classic bar room song is to play the way Pickett did and stop the second time around and have your dance floor sing the chorus then stop the band so its just them on the reply and simply play it right!! Do you realize that its Alan Jackson Jr. on drums the best drummer/arrainger/engineer/band leader there ever was??? I didn't think so!! Doc

Aside from breaking the rules of music theory (and even that could be considered artistically subjective) there really is no "playing it wrong". It may not be played to your tastes, but what makes your taste "right"?

[Bo Eder]

Originally Posted by Devils Haircut

I agree. But I live in a college town with a military base. So the bar crowd is a little younger. Even though I was a teen in the 90's, I listened to older music. Now I listen to a lot of new indie rock, but that may just be me clinging to youth as I'm 12 months from 30. It seems like over the top 80's cover bands in glam rock outfits make the most money around here. Maybe I over looked the 80's, but I'm not a huge fan of that decade.

Another fact to consider (and you briefly hit on it) is that with instant access to music, there really are no more HUGE bands that can hold main stream attention for a decade or more. More exposure for so many bands means that no one stays on top as long.

Yeah, I like to thank the Steve Jobs generation for actually giving all these musicians their fifteen minutes of fame ;)

Even here in SoCal, '80s bands are hitting pretty good. Because it's our version of our parent's oldies era. In the 70s when disco hit, Sha Na Na had a tv show. Now the 80s get their turn - hell, you can see the likes of Rick Springfield, and even Heart from the 70s playing at state fairs. Tears for Fears just did this dumpy little casino up in central California close to Yosemite....but the real reason those types of era bands do ok is because that generation has the money now. The 90s will get its turn as soon as all those people grow up and assimilate into society and pine for the good ol' days.

[Pollyanna]

Originally Posted by Pocket-full-of-gold

Must be a Sydney thing Pol. I've both played them and heard them played relentlessly over the years. Strangely, neither fell into my list of "most hated/overdone"....that little gem was always reserved for Run To Paradise (for the outside of Oz, for reasons known only to the punters, it always featured highly on the most requested list). If I never hear it again, it'll be too soon.

Never played Land Downunder, however.

The cover that seemed most overdone was My Girl here, PFOG. Or maybe it was the most annoying?

I can't even imagine a band playing covering Downunder. Hard to imagine anything tackier.

[Pocket-full-of-gold]

Originally Posted by Pollyanna

Or maybe it was the most annoying?

That was certainly my angle with RTP.......that, and the fact it's just a cringe worthy, piss poor song (IMHO, of course).

Originally Posted by Pollyanna

Hard to imagine anything tackier.

Ah......that'd be it......of course!! And here I was thinking it was because we didn't have a flute.

[Devils Haircut]

Originally Posted by Pocket-full-of-gold

That was certainly my angle with RTP.......that, and the fact it's just a cringe worthy, piss poor song (IMHO, of course).



Ah......that'd be it......of course!! And here I was thinking it was because we didn't have a flute.

Hahaha, yeah that's why ;)

[Mad About Drums]

Originally Posted by Devils Haircut

I thought you guys only played Men At Work in the bars down there.?.?.?.?... ;)

... and Inxs! ...Polly's been influenced by Jon Fariss :-)

[drummerjims]

I think that music has a 40 year period before the music is only liked by some. However in that 40 year period it only gets better with age.

I have been thinking about this a lot recently and what tipped me off was when I recently heard an Avril Lavigne song on the radio. I said wow this song is a lot better than it was when it came out. This could be due to the fact that music is getting worse over time so bad music that was made 10 years ago no longer sounds bad. But I'm Not really sure.

I also look at this in the way that the 50's music is no longer as popular as it once was (hence the 40 year thing) But you still have a few people that really grasp on to that music ans some that go further back.

However all of this said I think there are some songs that will always be standards like Last Dance with Mary Jane. Just as jazz standards carry on.

Originally Posted by Devils Haircut

I thought you guys only played Men At Work in the bars down there.?.?.?.?... ;)

I have played some Men at work at a few gigs. Specifically "Who Can It be Now?" It's a fun song to play. Also If anyone is looking for a fun song to cover My favorite cover that I have done is "Most Likely You Go Your Way and I'll Go Mine" By Bob Dylan.

[bermuda]

I think there's a certain window in which a hit song cannot yet be called a standard in the way that Mustang Sally et al have filled that bill. Then again, I was already playing Mustang Sally, Midnight Hour and Jumpin Jack Flash in cover bands in the '70s, so perhaps some songs are instant classics? I can't think of anything very recent that might already be considered a classic, but if we go back just 25-30 years, those songs are starting to become common in cover bands. Jenny (867-5309), Hurts So Good, What I Like About You, I Love Rock & Roll, etc.

And with all due respect to the '70s, there's plenty of Creedence, Boston, Badfinger, Styx, etc to go around.

Every decade/generation has songs that are popular and hold up well with bands & audiences, but I think the 25 year rule is also in place at any given time. We won't really know what songs today are classic for a while.

Bermuda

[inneedofgrace]

Out of the songs mentioned so far in this thread, my band plays:

Jumping Jack Flash
Stormy Monday
Jenny
Mustang Sally
Brown Eyed Girl

Interestingly, we play 3 songs by Tom Petty, but not Mary Jane:

Learning to Fly
American Girl
Listen to Her Heart

My old band plays a mix of newer stuff like:

I'll Melt With You
Walk Like an Egyptian
The Humpty Dance

Speaking of CCR, we also play Bad Moon Rising and it seems to go over well. I'd like to play their version of Heard it Through the Grapevine and also Down on the Corner.

I would think Styx would be pretty difficult to replicate, especially the vocals. Does anyone play any of their songs?

And regarding Boston, I heard a guy attempt to sing More Than a Feeling at karaoke the other night. It was the most horrible singing performance I can remember in a long time. My ears were bleeding by the end. Then again, very few people can sing like Brad Delp.

[Pollyanna]

Originally Posted by inneedofgrace

Out of the songs mentioned so far in this thread, my band plays:

Jumping Jack Flash
Stormy Monday
Jenny
Mustang Sally
Brown Eyed Girl

Ah, lots of hoary old standards. My band likes to mess with the hoariest of hoary standards ...

Summertime
Don't Let Me Be Misunderstood
Sunshine of Your Love
I Put a Spell on You
The Thrill is Gone
Cry Me a River
Broadway
Preacher Man
Little Wing
Moondance
I Can't Stand the Rain

If I had any pride I'd be embarrassed :)

[larryz]

I'd love to see a Men At Work cover band. Just saw Mr. Colin Hay here in the states a year or so ago and was a great show. I guess we saw something in the band Australians didn't.

And I doubt people will be pining for music from 1990s anytime soon, probably ever. Good music ended in the mid 1980s in my opinion. Old fart or no old fart that I am .

And yeah I agree with whoever said cover bands rarely play Mustang Sally is with anything close to original spirit and R&B funk as the original.

[Pollyanna]

Originally Posted by larryz

I'd love to see a Men At Work cover band. Just saw Mr. Colin Hay here in the states a year or so ago and was a great show. I guess we saw something in the band Australians didn't.

I saw them and they were very good, but Downunder has been played to death in the way that some pop tunes are treated like informal national anthems, being played at jingoistic events. It would take a certain level of shamelessness to play that tune at a bar.

Originally Posted by larryz

And I doubt people will be pining for music from 1990s anytime soon, probably ever. Good music ended in the mid 1980s in my opinion. Old fart or no old fart that I am .

Robert Fripp says that the mid 80s was when the business side took control from the artistic side in the commercial scene. I think he's right. Good music is still being played but it's partitioned from the Top 40. Corners are cut and creativity sacrificed for financial efficiency. Over time I find it harder and harder to find good music in the top of the pops and I now find new music via recommendations here, in reviews and YouTube recommended vids.

Still, an occasional good one occasionally slips through - for instance, Adele's Rolling in the Deep is a great pop track http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYEDA3JcQqw&ob=av2e

Devil haircuts; I guess Wilson Picketts version (song writer) along with Booker T and the MGs isn't good enough to respect from your point of view. As I said it makes no difference when your a white bread player anyway. My taste is right for me and I'm expressing my point of view it seems to upset you what a shame. Maybe if you toasted your white bread, you may learn that there is a right & wrong way to perform a song.. If you knew anything about performing soul music you would have understood my point. I wasn't speaking about MY approach rather Mr. Picketts way of playing the song he wrote. Useless conversation its not important how you might perform the song, you just make it all the better for musicians like me, thank you. Doc

[Devils Haircut]

Originally Posted by Doctor Dirt

Devil haircuts; I guess Wilson Picketts version (song writer) along with Booker T and the MGs isn't good enough to respect from your point of view. As I said it makes no difference when your a white bread player anyway. My taste is right for me and I'm expressing my point of view it seems to upset you what a shame. Maybe if you toasted your white bread, you may learn that there is a right & wrong way to perform a song.. If you knew anything about performing soul music you would have understood my point. I wasn't speaking about MY approach rather Mr. Picketts way of playing the song he wrote. Useless conversation its not important how you might perform the song, you just make it all the better for musicians like me, thank you. Doc

Awww it's cute how you can come off as slightly racist and yet still whine like an innocent little baby. Get a life bro...

[The Scorpio]

I just hope that "Smells Like Teen Spirit" doesn't become one of "those" cover songs. I really don't see it happening, but wouldn't that be terrible!?!?!?

-Kyle

[groove1]

Now in my mid sixties and still drumming I haven't played Mustang Sally since the 1960's
(except when we put together our rock band for the high school 40th reunion party!). A lot
of songs are enjoyed over the years because they remind us of a time and place when we
were younger. I have no idea what the next generation of bar songs is because in the college
town I live in the bands tend to play a variety of music covering all the bases.

[kettles]

We do Who can it be Now and Brown Eyed Girl.

Pennywise did a cover of Land Down Under - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rOjAck01Hw4

This is definitely a must have song round here - April Sun in Cuba. It's still from the late 70's though.

Little fellow "white bread" is an expression in the music business for players who have no "soul" in their playing, not much to do with color more to do with were your raised. I see you've mentioned your age on another post so I'll leave this be since your just another kid who in ten years time has learned all he needs to know. I'm not your "bro" I'm your daddy in fact I'm your Grand Daddy" by association within the drummers world definetly not by blood. Its impossible for me to produce a white bread boy, who shows no respect for drummers who have much more experience than
they do. Just another kid yaking on the net who thinks theres no "wrong way" to play a song, keep your day gig, you'll starve in the music business. Doc.

[Devils Haircut]

Originally Posted by Doctor Dirt

Little fellow "white bread" is an expression in the music business for players who have no "soul" in their playing, not much to do with color more to do with were your raised. I see you've mentioned your age on another post so I'll leave this be since your just another kid who in ten years time has learned all he needs to know. I'm not your "bro" I'm your daddy in fact I'm your Grand Daddy" by association within the drummers world definetly not by blood. Its impossible for me to produce a white bread boy, who shows no respect for drummers who have much more experience than
they do. Just another kid yaking on the net who thinks theres no "wrong way" to play a song, keep your day gig, you'll starve in the music business. Doc.

Jesus you sure are proud of yourself. My original comment was just playing devil's advocate in regards to you lashing out at decades worth of bar musicians who didn't play it up to your high and mighty standards. Here is the bottom line: You like to act like a cocky keyboard baddass and it finally got under my skin. That's my fault. I should know better than to let internet bullies bother me. And while I acknowledge that I don't know everything (nor did I claim to...that's your thing), I really believe you give yourself more credit than you deserve. You're here arguing with a 30 year old "kid" instead of out touring with a known act or making records. So all your age tells me is that your mom put out before mine did and you're probably going to die first. Congrats Bro.

[jon e rotten]

Originally Posted by Doctor Dirt

Little fellow "white bread" is an expression in the music business for players who have no "soul" in their playing, not much to do with color more to do with were your raised. I see you've mentioned your age on another post so I'll leave this be since your just another kid who in ten years time has learned all he needs to know. I'm not your "bro" I'm your daddy in fact I'm your Grand Daddy" by association within the drummers world definetly not by blood. Its impossible for me to produce a white bread boy, who shows no respect for drummers who have much more experience than
they do. Just another kid yaking on the net who thinks theres no "wrong way" to play a song, keep your day gig, you'll starve in the music business. Doc.

Geez Mr. Winwood, lighten up.

[Devils Haircut]

Originally Posted by jon e rotten

Geez Mr. Winwood, lighten up.

No kidding! Stress can be a contributing factor to erectile dysfunction, and at his age, he is gonna need all the help he can get.

Now your talking about someones Mother??? My mother has long passed, my touring days are behind me, I made a living in the music business for over 40 years. Now I'm on a drummers forum trying to share some of my experiences with young musicians coming up and instead of being able to give a comment about cover tunes I'm writing to some punk asshole who's a part time week end warrior!!!! Mothers are always left out of arguments every man knows that when and if you ever become one you'll know that. Doc


done with you, bye.

[Devils Haircut]

Originally Posted by Doctor Dirt

Now your talking about someones Mother??? My mother has long passed, my touring days are behind me, I made a living in the music business for over 40 years. Now I'm on a drummers forum trying to share some of my experiences with young musicians coming up and instead of being able to give a comment about cover tunes I'm writing to some punk asshole who's a part time week end warrior!!!! Mothers are always left out of arguments every man knows that when and if you ever become one you'll know that. Doc


done with you, bye.

My point was that you were conceived before me, but that doesn't make you special. I apologize to you and your mother for choosing such a fashion to express that point. Twas all in fun...

[kettles]

Originally Posted by Doctor Dirt

Little fellow "white bread" is an expression in the music business for players who have no "soul" in their playing, not much to do with color more to do with were your raised. I see you've mentioned your age on another post so I'll leave this be since your just another kid who in ten years time has learned all he needs to know. I'm not your "bro" I'm your daddy in fact I'm your Grand Daddy" by association within the drummers world definetly not by blood. Its impossible for me to produce a white bread boy, who shows no respect for drummers who have much more experience than
they do. Just another kid yaking on the net who thinks theres no "wrong way" to play a song, keep your day gig, you'll starve in the music business. Doc.

Where I come from 'white bread' is actually a rather derogatory expression for a white person. So I was a bit taken aback reading your post too.

I'm now unsure of what 'toasting your white bread' was supposed to mean, and how it's related to music...?

It was a cynical comment something you wouldn't understand!!! Doc

[Devils Haircut]

Originally Posted by kettles

Where I come from 'white bread' is actually a rather derogatory expression for a white person. So I was a bit taken aback reading your post too.

I'm now unsure of what 'toasting your white bread' was supposed to mean, and how it's related to music...?

I took it as a racial slur too because "white bread" is a known derogatory term. I didnt take offense to it though. What I do take offense to is someone threatening me with physical violence in a PM. That's a far cry from being "done with" me.

[kettles]

Originally Posted by Doctor Dirt

It was a cynical comment something you wouldn't understand!!! Doc

You haven't explained it, so no, I have no hope to understand.

You see this is what I'm saying about younger generation thinking they know it all. I can't catorgize or give a definition of everything I say but I speak in the East Coast of USA Language of Music.
"white bread" someone who performs in the music buss. who lacks soul or feel!
ex; Pat Boone singing Lil Richards tunes in the late 50s nothing to do with race got it!
cynical; was a take off of your bands genre or whatever you call the type of sounds you perform . I thought you'd get it using the word cynical is was meant to be light hearted.
OK are we caught up on what is and what ain't? I accept your apology DHaircut and I let it go. Lets just avoid each other so the forum doesn't have to be subjected to this crap. Doc

[kettles]

Originally Posted by Doctor Dirt

You see this is what I'm saying about younger generation thinking they know it all. I can't catorgize or give a definition of everything I say but I speak in the East Coast of USA Language of Music.
"white bread" someone who performs in the music buss. who lacks soul or feel!
ex; Pat Boone singing Lil Richards tunes in the late 50s nothing to do with race got it!
cynical; was a take off of your bands genre or whatever you call the type of sounds you perform . I thought you'd get it using the word cynical is was meant to be light hearted.
OK are we caught up on what is and what ain't? I accept your apology DHaircut and I let it go. Lets just avoid each other so the forum doesn't have to be subjected to this crap. Doc

I don't know when any of us 'younger generation' claimed to know it all. I'd never do that, especially not to guys significantly older than myself.


It wasn't until after my post that I thought you may be referring to my band name, so yeah, I get it now. Very clever :)

[Otto]

Seems some songs from the 80's have already edged into that "standards" list..

...like White Wedding from Billy Idol

If you are a wedding band, that is a standard...has been since its release almost...

Maybe standards are not determined by age?

Anyone have an example of a standard that is from the last 10 years?