DRUMMERWORLD OFFICIAL DISCUSSION FORUM   

Go Back   DRUMMERWORLD OFFICIAL DISCUSSION FORUM > Drum Gear > Heads and Sticks

Heads and Sticks Discuss Heads and Sticks

Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #1  
Old 08-12-2011, 11:11 PM
sXeDanimalsXe's Avatar
sXeDanimalsXe sXeDanimalsXe is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Virginia Beach, Va
Posts: 305
Default Good heads, bad drums

Attention:
Good heads and good tuning will not make a $100 drum kit sound good. The best heads, tuned by the best drum tech on a $100 kit still sounds like a $100 kit.

Not to hurt anyone's feelings or start a fight, just needs to be said.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 08-12-2011, 11:45 PM
Biscuit Biscuit is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: In a padded room.
Posts: 427
Default Re: Good heads, bad drums

I didn't know there was such a thing as a $100 drum kit! haha

But yeah...i get what your saying. There are some exceptions though. Some of the cheaper kits can sound queit good with some heads and tuneing considering they are makeing them a bit better than they used to.

Just out of curiosity, what particular kit did you try to re-head?
__________________
Jeff

Sabian / DW / Evans / Vic Firth
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 08-13-2011, 12:18 AM
bobdadruma's Avatar
bobdadruma bobdadruma is offline
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: second measure of a fill-in
Posts: 10,195
Default Re: Good heads, bad drums

I can make plastic paint pails sound good with proper tuning!
__________________
I kind of like old drums:)
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 08-13-2011, 12:19 AM
Drumolator Drumolator is offline
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: central Louisiana
Posts: 1,938
Default Re: Good heads, bad drums

However, once the "mid-priced" level is reached, only drummers and/or sound engineers would notice the difference between that type of kit and an expensive one if both were well tuned. My kits, Pearl Export and Gretsch Club Jazz, sound very good. Peace and goodwill.
__________________
Mark Wellman

Gretsch Catalina toms and BD / Pacific SX Series (snare) / Sabian / Evans / Vater
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 08-13-2011, 01:14 AM
Soupy Soupy is offline
Silver Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 987
Default Re: Good heads, bad drums

Quote:
Originally Posted by sXeDanimalsXe View Post
Attention:
Good heads and good tuning will not make a $100 drum kit sound good. The best heads, tuned by the best drum tech on a $100 kit still sounds like a $100 kit.

Not to hurt anyone's feelings or start a fight, just needs to be said.
You're more than welcome to be wrong.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 08-13-2011, 02:58 AM
sXeDanimalsXe's Avatar
sXeDanimalsXe sXeDanimalsXe is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Virginia Beach, Va
Posts: 305
Default Re: Good heads, bad drums

Quote:
Originally Posted by Biscuit View Post
Just out of curiosity, what particular kit did you try to re-head?
hahaha none. Since getting back on here and talking drums, and getting back in to playing (or trying to) I started thinking about my years in drum shops. Every day kids would come in with a cheap CB kit, or old beat up export and tell me how they "put good heads on it, and now people think its a DW" or worse yet, try and get me to put heads on it for them and tune it so it "sounds like this CD."

Sure, mid-line kits with good wood can sound pretty good, but they don't sound like high end kits.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 08-13-2011, 04:46 AM
uniin's Avatar
uniin uniin is offline
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Blue Mountains, Australia
Posts: 1,216
Default Re: Good heads, bad drums

how bad drums are we talking? like out of round shells, out of round hoops, uneven bearing edges? did you get good heads both sides?

these $100 probably have out of round hoops so yeah.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 08-13-2011, 05:45 AM
IDDrummer's Avatar
IDDrummer IDDrummer is offline
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: I-Dee-Ho
Posts: 3,304
Default Re: Good heads, bad drums

I remember owning a set of CB700 concert toms. Not easy to get a good sound from! In fact, I had the two smallest tom tuned quite high (think Neil Peart's Tama kit) and before long they where no longer round at all. The wood in those drums was the lousiest, softest stuff imaginable.

So I know what you are saying - there truly are some drums that will just never sound good.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 08-13-2011, 05:51 AM
jakester jakester is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 245
Default Re: Good heads, bad drums

in my mind $100 kits should be used as a practice kit or for little kids
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 08-13-2011, 02:16 PM
Pocket-full-of-gold's Avatar
Pocket-full-of-gold Pocket-full-of-gold is offline
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Melbourne, Australia.
Posts: 9,866
Default Re: Good heads, bad drums

I get where you're coming from.

I think the right head selection, good tuning and a good drummer can improve the sound of ANY kit.
But that said, a bargain basement CB kit is never gonna sound like a DW Collectors, regardless of how much you tweak it.
__________________
What's the best cape for running away from a gig?
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 08-13-2011, 06:56 PM
eamesuser eamesuser is offline
Silver Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 663
Default Re: Good heads, bad drums

I had a teacher that got a C-B 700 teaching sounding fantastic,but he said he got lucky with that particular kit,he was able to tune students C-B kits to sound pretty decent,but not like that one.If you are dealing with an entry level kit,even an older one,if the shells and hoops are close to in round,and the edges are decent,you can usually slap some pinstripes on the toms and get them to sound decent IMO,usually in one narrow tuning range,but good enough to be able to play them without it being torture.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 08-13-2011, 08:51 PM
Biscuit Biscuit is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: In a padded room.
Posts: 427
Default Re: Good heads, bad drums

Quote:
Originally Posted by sXeDanimalsXe View Post
hahaha none. Since getting back on here and talking drums, and getting back in to playing (or trying to) I started thinking about my years in drum shops. Every day kids would come in with a cheap CB kit, or old beat up export and tell me how they "put good heads on it, and now people think its a DW" or worse yet, try and get me to put heads on it for them and tune it so it "sounds like this CD."

Sure, mid-line kits with good wood can sound pretty good, but they don't sound like high end kits.
Some people are idiots. When i hear people say things like that i just nod my head ok, then after they leave i laugh my ass off. Haha!!
__________________
Jeff

Sabian / DW / Evans / Vic Firth
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 08-14-2011, 03:52 PM
sXeDanimalsXe's Avatar
sXeDanimalsXe sXeDanimalsXe is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Virginia Beach, Va
Posts: 305
Default Re: Good heads, bad drums

Quote:
Originally Posted by uniin View Post
how bad drums are we talking? like out of round shells, out of round hoops, uneven bearing edges? did you get good heads both sides?

these $100 probably have out of round hoops so yeah.
Well some where $100 shell kits, some where $300 and 400 and 500 shell kits. I would get all kinds. Some round, some out of round, some with decent bearing edges, some with almost flat bearing "edges."

My point is this, high end kits exist for a reason. If you could get a killer sound out of a pearl export, or tama superstar, no one would ever by a DW or a custom kit, or a starclassic. If you have a tama superstar, and you put on "good heads" as people would say, and tune it very well, it still sounds like a superstar. It sounds like how a superstar is supposed to sound. Not saying a superstar is a bad kit, for the money it's really good! But it can't beat out a starclassic, or a birch shelled DW. Yes personal preference plays a part, some people, like my self don't like DW. But you put the birch shelled superstar next to a birch DW, even though I prefer the TAMA brand, I know the DW is going to have a higher quality of tone, it's going to have better sustain and resonance, and it's going to to have better quality shells and hardware. No magic drum head is going to make a $100 or even $800 shell kit sound like a $3000 shell kit.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 08-14-2011, 04:34 PM
Skulmoski's Avatar
Skulmoski Skulmoski is offline
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Abu Dhabi
Posts: 1,301
Default Re: Good heads, bad drums

Usually $100 kits have very cheap heads; upgrading the heads and proper tuning will improve the sound up to its natural limits.

GJS
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 08-14-2011, 04:54 PM
Messerschmitt's Avatar
Messerschmitt Messerschmitt is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Satu Mare, Romania
Posts: 170
Default Re: Good heads, bad drums

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skulmoski View Post
Usually $100 kits have very cheap heads; upgrading the heads and proper tuning will improve the sound up to its natural limits.

GJS
DIXIT!

Of course, cheap drums aren`t comparable to "professional-priced" ones, but within some good standards (round shells, round hoops, good bearing edges) the cheap ones can sound good, too. No matter if you have a awesome birch-shelled kit or a *[insert crap wood name here]*-shelled one, heads and tuning CAN make a difference. Especially tuning, wich is crucial!
Don`t want to offend anyone, but this is my point of view.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 08-14-2011, 07:30 PM
sXeDanimalsXe's Avatar
sXeDanimalsXe sXeDanimalsXe is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Virginia Beach, Va
Posts: 305
Default Re: Good heads, bad drums

It will make a difference, it will sound better than if it had crappy heads. But my point is a low end kit, is and sounds like a low end kit. I think we all, so far, agree on that. It's kind of like preaching to the converted.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 08-14-2011, 08:08 PM
larryace's Avatar
larryace larryace is offline
"Uncle Larry"
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: In beautiful Bucks County, PA
Posts: 13,093
Default Re: Good heads, bad drums

I don't agree with the premise. I've played Ludwig Accents, that with the toms anyway, (and it pains me to admit this) I liked the tone better than my DW Collectors. A lot better. My Yamaha Stage Custom kit, it cost 600.00 with a snare...if you closed your eyes you couldn't tell the diff between them and my DW's.

Yes there are kits that just sound bad and they are usually cheap, but to say all cheap kits are inferior sounding is too black and white for me.

Plus people are easily led if they pay 3000.00 for a set of drums they will convince themselves that they have a superior tone than the 800.00 drums. Luckily I don't suffer these delusions. The Accents sounded better than my DW's. In that room at least.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 08-14-2011, 08:24 PM
adurbin adurbin is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Johnson city, Tennessee
Posts: 6
Default Re: Good heads, bad drums

new here but....honestly, when you have a wife, a mortgage, car payments and other bills, you buy what you can afford. Which is what I did. If one takes the time to properly tune each drum, they will at least get the job done in the music room at the house. I've been around music and instruments all my life. You truly get what you pay for, but I believe that if one purchases a cheap drum kit and expects it to sound like a 3000 dollar kit, they have lost the battle already. I knew what I was getting into when I purchased my kit and inspected every bearing edge of each drum right out of the box, checked each to assure that it was in round, and inspected every hoop to make sure it was in round as well. If I would have had any issues, they would have been back in the box, and in the back of a UPS truck on their way back to the seller. As with any instrument when it comes to sound (of the instrument, not the person behind it who can or can't play it), tuning is everything.
__________________
"I got a feelin', and the only perscription, is more cowbell"
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 08-14-2011, 11:08 PM
sXeDanimalsXe's Avatar
sXeDanimalsXe sXeDanimalsXe is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Virginia Beach, Va
Posts: 305
Default Re: Good heads, bad drums

I am not saying there is anything wrong with less expensive kits. But they are not as good as high end kits. It's just how it is. A kia isn't as good as a ferrari and an export isn't as good as a reference.
__________________
My TRICK kit. View it in all of it's glory!
http://drummerworld.com/forums/showthread.php?t=30774
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 08-14-2011, 11:26 PM
Ryan Plays Drums Ryan Plays Drums is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 4
Default Re: Good heads, bad drums

I agree that if you compare a perfectly tuned Dw kit against a Cb kit the dw will sound better. but it was said before with proper tuning to an untrained ear you wouldnt be able to tell the difference between an export and a collectors simple as that. Tuning and quality heads CAN improve the quality enough to sound like an expensive set. i dont want to offend anyone either but it seems rather ignorant to make a statement like that. I used to have an export and many many people would say it sounded better then top of the line drumsets they have heard and i agree. I have since purchased a DW kit but i still do find myself missing those mid-level Pearls... best $500.00 i ever spent!
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 08-14-2011, 11:36 PM
Bo Eder's Avatar
Bo Eder Bo Eder is offline
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Southern California
Posts: 11,055
Default Re: Good heads, bad drums

How 'bout re-wording the premise: A good drummer and can take a cheaper kit and make it sound good regardless of heads to make it through the gig? I've had to do that alot where I couldn't bring my own stuff, and that's a very cool learning experience.

I completely agree that that's why expensive kits exist. As expensive guitars, pianos, automobiles, etc.,....you're buying a consistent product. I've owned TWO DW kits and in terms of construction and quality they were identical. I was satisfied to say that those drums would hold up on a world tour under the worst of circumstances. You can't say that for the $1500-and-under crowd. It's like the cheaper you go, the more variables you have to deal with. That's why pros buy what they buy: their lives are already hard enough getting to the gig and doing it right. They don't want to have to do anything special to the gear just to make it work!

And I don't mean to just say this about DW. ALL the top manufacturers make stuff that is superior and consistent. It's good business.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are Off
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off




All times are GMT +2. The time now is 06:38 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Bernhard Castiglioni's DRUMMERWORLD.com