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  #201  
Old 07-22-2006, 06:45 PM
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Default Re: mics

Quote:
Originally Posted by tmc
I use a pair of condensors in an x-y position placed about the middle of the kit and about 3-feet above.
Whats an 'X-Y position', just being curious...

And while I'm on the topic of positioning, could anyone draw me a small diagram of where you usually put ur mics and stands?

Also, when micing with dynamic mics, is it better to attach the mic to the drum (I've seen some people do that) or put it hanging over the drum with a stand?
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  #202  
Old 07-22-2006, 09:28 PM
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Default Re: mics

The 'X/Y' technique is used to get a perfect stereo image of an audio source (or that's its intention at least). You can do this with two mic stands, or one if you have a multi-mic adapter for the one stand. Basically, you point both mics towards the corner of a right angle. The idea is that the sound arrives at both mics at the same time. Each mic 'looks over the shoulder' of the other mic to catch the oposite stereo image. The mic on the right will be getting more of the sound on the left, and vice versa. Usually, these mics get used as overheads and a good starting place is just above your head when you are sitting down at the drum throne.

There are lots of great ways to mic the drums. I know there are a few common ones that actually have names but they escape me right now. I won't bother to explain them all in detail because that info is widely available via search. I will tell you my current favorite way to mic though. I use one small diaphram condensor in omni mode just over my head, pointing down towards the center of my kit, or right about where my right knee is. I use a large diaphram dynamic in the kick. Lately I've been using a small diaphram dynamic on the snare, but I think I'm about to switch to a small diaphram condensor in cardiod mode. I like to use a large diaphram condensor in the other room for my 'room mic'.
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  #203  
Old 07-31-2006, 09:20 PM
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Default Re: mics

ok, im really new to recording (all i know is what i've gotten from scanning a few wikipedia articles and lotsa threads here) so i've got some questions. im planning (somtime) to get two overheads to mic my kit. i'll be using garage band on a powerbook to record my playing.
i know i'll need two identical overhead condensers - i'm on quite a budget, so i'm looking at three models mainly:
Nady CM-90
Nady CM-88
and Behringer B-5
I'm shying away from the Behringer because of the price. are cardoid mics ok for overheads or will i want to spend the extra cash for the option of omnidirectional?
what kinda stand(s) and clips and the like will i need for an XY setup? (cheap servicable examples welcome)
what am i gonna need as a middleman from the mics to the powerbook? (same w/ examples again)
what will i need to power the mics?
and is there anything i seem to be missing? like i said, im new at this and need to know the complete spectrum of gear i need to buy
thanks, sorry for so many questions

ps-also, opinions one which of the above mics i should get (especially between the nadys) and low-cost alternatives are welcome
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  #204  
Old 08-01-2006, 12:40 AM
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Default Re: mics

Audix D2's on Toms up to 14" - D4's on larger toms - i5 Under the snare, SM57 on top and an Audio Technica AE2500 ( Dual Element ) on the Bassdrum. Overheads Rode NT1's - This setup is producing great results for me and my RC's and Istanbuls!
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  #205  
Old 08-01-2006, 05:52 AM
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Default Re: mics

also, almost forgot, should i get pencil condensers as overheads using XY or will any old condenser do?
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  #206  
Old 08-11-2006, 02:55 PM
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Default Re: mics

ok.. bumping up the thread again...

what about mics for cowbells? do they need a seperate mic or do the condensors pick them up? cowbell is mounted on the bass drum FYI. thanks
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  #207  
Old 08-27-2006, 07:16 AM
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Default Microphones

alright heres my drum specs if it helps at all?

Pearl Export EXR 7pc (Poplar Wood)
10x8
12x9
14x11
16x16
22x18
14x5 (Secondary Snare)
14x5 (Main Snare Pearl Sensitone Brass)

right now my room is fairly larger the walls are half stone half wood. The flooring is carpet and tile in one part of it. Ceiling are fairly tall. i'm looking for an ideal micing setup and microphones brand and serise etc. for Main Snare (Brass) Secondary Snare (Poplar Wood) all tom toms, Bass Drum and cymbals placed around my kit i dont want the microphones to take up to much space but i dont want to suffer sound quality for size. suggestions would be great thank you.
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  #208  
Old 08-27-2006, 02:34 PM
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Default Re: Microphones

I'd keep things simple... go for a pair of decent condenser mics for overheads (I use Rode NT1A's, which are great, but for something a little cheaper the M-Audio Nova is great sounding), a Shure SM57 for your snare(s) and a kick drum mic (AKG D112, Shure Beta52 or Audix D6 seem to be the big 3 choices). Only after that, look at your budget and see if you need / can afford tom mics. FWIW I use a Shure Beta57A on my snare and SM57's on my toms, and currently a D112 (soon to be replaced by a Beta52) in the kick.
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  #209  
Old 08-27-2006, 04:59 PM
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Default Re: Microphones

You'd be surprised how good of a sound you can get with just some condenser mics in the room. The infamous Bonham sound on "When the Levee Breaks," for example, was created by placing a single big condenser at the top of a stairwell.
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  #210  
Old 08-28-2006, 04:34 AM
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Default Re: Microphones

Ya, I wouldn't get more than three or four mics to start with. There are a lot of possibilities with just that small amount. Once you feel you've got the sound you want with those, you can add more where you think you need it... for example: close mic'ing your toms... or adding more room mics...

Also, if you focus on just a few mics at first, you may be able to spend some money on some decent pres.
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  #211  
Old 09-07-2006, 02:04 AM
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Default Live drum mikes

How practicle would it be to use two overhead condenser mikes (akg c430),an audix f10 on the snare and an audix f12 on the kick. any opinions would be greatly welcome
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  #212  
Old 09-07-2006, 02:06 AM
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Default Re: Live drum mikes

Uhhh I don't know much about mics but I would think you'd need mics for the toms too. That's a pretty good setup you have there, but you need some fer your toms. I played with just over heads and bass and they sounded like shite.
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  #213  
Old 09-07-2006, 02:17 AM
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Default Re: Live drum mikes

rendezvous is right. Live and the studio are different beasts - in the studio you can use basically just overheads and a kick mic and get away with it if you have quality mics and good stuff in the signal chain, because you can minimise spill and use the overheads to pick up tone from the toms. If you have nice enough mics, tuning, room and placement then the only thing missing is usually some low-end from the kick. But in a live environment the whole setup is different - generally the cymbals will carry pretty well without microphones up to fairly large room sizes, but the toms vanish almost immediately and the bass drum loses bass pretty sharpish too. So you tend to see it as re-enforcement rather than trying to capture what's happening.

I've done engineering gigs with just a kick mic and tom mikes, both mixed pretty low. They work enough to fill out the bass and tone from the drums, while the snare and cymbals still have enough cut to make it through the mix. But ideally you want complete coverage.
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  #214  
Old 09-07-2006, 04:05 AM
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Default Re: Live drum mikes

Thanks for your feed back! I have a set of audix mikes I have been using for live gigs, I use one f 10 for the snare, one for both mounted toms and one for both floor toms, the f12 for the kick.Getting pretty good results with that setup, just missing the crisp highs on the cymbals. The motive behind the overheads replacing the tom mikes was that our mixer only has four channels available for drums. Looks like secondary mixer may be in the cards for the drum mikes and throw in the condensers.

What type of overhead mikes would be best to use considering the guitar amps are close to the drums?
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  #215  
Old 09-07-2006, 09:58 PM
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Default Re: Live drum mikes

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank M

What type of overhead mikes would be best to use considering the guitar amps are close to the drums?
None. Ive have donbe tons of sound and sure you can get a nice sound out of overheads but they are a pain in the ass to control. Just stick to micing your toms, snare and kick, your cymbals will come through the tom mics just fine and your snare mic will pickup the hats.
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  #216  
Old 09-07-2006, 10:36 PM
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Default Re: Live drum mikes

i'm revamping my mic set up for live and just bought these babies for the toms...

Sennheiser e604
i've used them in a lot of shared gigs and find them to be truly great and user friendly.

then i have the akgdii2 for my kick a shure beta57 for my snare and one akgc1000s and a shure pencil condenser as overheads.
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  #217  
Old 09-08-2006, 03:47 AM
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Default Re: Live drum mikes

Quote:
Originally Posted by NUTHA JASON
i'm revamping my mic set up for live and just bought these babies for the toms...

Sennheiser e604
i've used them in a lot of shared gigs and find them to be truly great and user friendly.
.

Yup, that's the same mic set I use for toms. I'm pretty happy with the results so far too - low profile, handy little clips.
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  #218  
Old 09-08-2006, 07:07 AM
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Default Re: Live drum mikes

Yep, I've got the Sennheiser e604s as well. Nice mics. Plenty of punch and low end, which seemed to be missing somewhat with the SM57s. I always found the 57s a little flat sounding or something...

Anyway, I'm happy with the Sennheisers for the toms...
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  #219  
Old 09-12-2006, 03:36 PM
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Default Kick Drum Microphones

I'm looking to buy one. Don't know much about whats good and whats not. Been looking at the AKG D 112 Kick Drum Microphone. Disregarding money, what should I look at for quality.
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  #220  
Old 09-12-2006, 09:39 PM
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Default Has anyone installed the MAY mics in their drums without the no-drill adapter?

Okay,


The title is self explanatory! How did you do it? What problems, if any, did you encounter?
Where, in the depth of the shell, did you place the microphone and how did it turn out?


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  #221  
Old 09-13-2006, 03:22 AM
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Default Re: Has anyone installed the MAY mics in their drums without the no-drill adapter?

I have had MayEA in my kick drums since they first came out with them! My first one WAS with the drilless mount, but then I just said to heck with it and installed it straight away.

I also modified the installation a bit by using as short an extension as possible and mounting the Mic as far from the batter head as possible and pointing it directly at the point of impact.

I wanted to allow it to get the OOMPHFF of the drum rather than getting it too close and it being overwhelmed by the attack. I figured it wouldn't be too hard to get high end out of it with it inside the drum but I wanted the option of as much LOW end as possible.

The first one I had had the AKG D12E
http://www.mtsu.edu/~a_e_s/microphone/d12e.htm,
and now I've changed to the AKG D112
http://www.mtsu.edu/~a_e_s/microphone/d112.htm,
they BOTH received RAVE reviews from EVERY sound man I ever worked with.

They're worth every penny I spent on them.

The drums I have had them installed in are as follows ALL drums with full heads NO HOLES!!:

24x16 1980's Gretsch - w/ Emperor batter - Ludwig heavy coated resonant (D12E)

26x14 1950's Slingerland Radio King - w/ Emperor batter - Fiberskyn 3 resonant (D12E)

26x14 1999 Ludwig Classic - w/ Emperor batter - Ludwig heavy coated resonant (D12E)

and currently:
24x14 1970's Ludwig Classic - w/ Emperor batter - Ludwig heavy coated resonant head (D112)
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  #222  
Old 09-13-2006, 04:04 AM
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Default Re: Has anyone installed the MAY mics in their drums without the no-drill adapter?

Don't these block the airhole of the drum?
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  #223  
Old 09-13-2006, 04:16 AM
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Default Re: Kick Drum Microphones

I got an Audio Technica ATM 25 on eBay for $70 used. It's the best bass drum mic for the money. You can spend 20 times that much and get better sound, yeah, but I don't think you'll get nowhere near as good cost-benefit.
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  #224  
Old 09-13-2006, 06:52 AM
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Default Re: Has anyone installed the MAY mics in their drums without the no-drill adapter?

My question is, where can a person actually buy the May mounts these days? They used to carry them at Idaho Percussion, but not any longer. I guess DW gets priority now.
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  #225  
Old 09-13-2006, 07:42 AM
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Default Re: Has anyone installed the MAY mics in their drums without the no-drill adapter?

Quote:
Originally Posted by IDDrummer
My question is, where can a person actually buy the May mounts these days? They used to carry them at Idaho Percussion, but not any longer. I guess DW gets priority now.
Here you go:

http://www.interstatemusic.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10021&productId=101569

Interstate music has them listed in their catalogs as well.


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  #226  
Old 09-13-2006, 07:47 AM
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Default Re: Has anyone installed the MAY mics in their drums without the no-drill adapter?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vipercussionist
I have had MayEA in my kick drums since they first came out with them! My first one WAS with the drilless mount, but then I just said to heck with it and installed it straight away.

I also modified the installation a bit by using as short an extension as possible and mounting the Mic as far from the batter head as possible and pointing it directly at the point of impact.

I wanted to allow it to get the OOMPHFF of the drum rather than getting it too close and it being overwhelmed by the attack. I figured it wouldn't be too hard to get high end out of it with it inside the drum but I wanted the option of as much LOW end as possible.

The first one I had had the AKG D12E
http://www.mtsu.edu/~a_e_s/microphone/d12e.htm,
and now I've changed to the AKG D112
http://www.mtsu.edu/~a_e_s/microphone/d112.htm,
they BOTH received RAVE reviews from EVERY sound man I ever worked with.

They're worth every penny I spent on them.

The drums I have had them installed in are as follows ALL drums with full heads NO HOLES!!:

24x16 1980's Gretsch - w/ Emperor batter - Ludwig heavy coated resonant (D12E)

26x14 1950's Slingerland Radio King - w/ Emperor batter - Fiberskyn 3 resonant (D12E)

26x14 1999 Ludwig Classic - w/ Emperor batter - Ludwig heavy coated resonant (D12E)

and currently:
24x14 1970's Ludwig Classic - w/ Emperor batter - Ludwig heavy coated resonant head (D112)

mtsu? Middle Tennessee State U?


I use the D112s in my kick drums and my 15" floor tom. SM57s in the rack toms.
I went to this after the drunk chick singer in my band kept tripping over the mic stand, thus tearing the front drum head up! She was fun to look at but hard to be around.

Mike

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  #227  
Old 09-13-2006, 07:48 AM
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Default Re: Has anyone installed the MAY mics in their drums without the no-drill adapter?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Deathmetalconga
Don't these block the airhole of the drum?
I assume you are talking about the Air Vent Connector and not the mic itself?


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  #228  
Old 09-13-2006, 07:51 AM
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Default Re: Kick Drum Microphones

If you can find one, the BeyerDynamic XTG 50 (?) not sure of the model number here. It is a dual Diaphram mic. It catches both the front head and the back('cause it is a dual diaphram). With the right sound engineer and BD set-up, these can sound absolutley insane!


Mike

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Last edited by Skitch; 10-03-2006 at 08:44 PM.
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  #229  
Old 09-13-2006, 09:39 AM
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Default Re: Kick Drum Microphones

most people I know who use drum mics for road and studio use the AKG D112 or the egg as it was nicknamed.

If price is not an issue (lucky bugger) then have a look at beyer dynamic, I think there is also a mic company called pearl, or maybe that's just the name of one of their condenser mics that are about £350 each.

Have a look round, do your research, compare specs etc. and where possible get your hands on one to see if it feels durable/solid construction etc.
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  #230  
Old 09-13-2006, 04:07 PM
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Default Re: Has anyone installed the MAY mics in their drums without the no-drill adapter?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skitch
Mike, thanks for the info, but the link won't work. I also tried going directly to the Interstate Music site and doing a search, but I couldn't find the May mounts. :(
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  #231  
Old 09-13-2006, 05:24 PM
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Default Re: Has anyone installed the MAY mics in their drums without the no-drill adapter?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skitch
I assume you are talking about the Air Vent Connector and not the mic itself?


Mike
I think so. When all is said and done and it's installed, do you still have an airhole one way or the other?
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  #232  
Old 09-13-2006, 05:26 PM
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Default Re: Has anyone installed the MAY mics in their drums without the no-drill adapter?

Quote:
Originally Posted by IDDrummer
My question is, where can a person actually buy the May mounts these days? They used to carry them at Idaho Percussion, but not any longer. I guess DW gets priority now.
Idaho Percussion can get just about anything - sometimes, though, you have to wait a long, long time. I try to give my business to small local merchants whenever possible but sometimes I have to go to Guitar Center if I want something within two weeks.
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  #233  
Old 09-14-2006, 04:22 AM
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Default Re: Has anyone installed the MAY mics in their drums without the no-drill adapter?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Deathmetalconga
Idaho Percussion can get just about anything - sometimes, though, you have to wait a long, long time. I try to give my business to small local merchants whenever possible but sometimes I have to go to Guitar Center if I want something within two weeks.
Yeah, they're great guys, but A) I don't want to wait in limbo forever and B) they say they don't carry them anymore. I'm sure they would try and get one for me, but I'd rather purchase from someplace that actually carries them.

I've purchased 4-5 cymbals, a Roc-n-Soc throne and assorted goodies from Idaho Percussion, but keeping track of unusual orders isn't their forte.
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  #234  
Old 09-15-2006, 05:05 AM
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Default Re: Kick Drum Microphones

I can't comment on other kick mics but I personally own an AKG D112 and I have been very happy with it.
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  #235  
Old 09-15-2006, 06:25 AM
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Default Re: Kick Drum Microphones

Thanks Guys. Can you test Kick Drum Mics out a Guitar Center?
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  #236  
Old 09-15-2006, 09:58 PM
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Default Re: Has anyone installed the MAY mics in their drums without the no-drill adapter?

Quote:
Originally Posted by IDDrummer
Mike, thanks for the info, but the link won't work. I also tried going directly to the Interstate Music site and doing a search, but I couldn't find the May mounts. :(

Okay try this then,

Go to

www.interstatemusic.com

Where it says "Order by Catalog number" , type in "MICMAYD112BD" that is the only way I know to get to it on the internet. However, you can also can them at 1-800-in-a -band and order it that way as well. Furthermore, by going over the phone you will be able to order a mic besides the D112, if you so choose.


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  #237  
Old 09-15-2006, 10:00 PM
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Default Re: Has anyone installed the MAY mics in their drums without the no-drill adapter?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Deathmetalconga
I think so. When all is said and done and it's installed, do you still have an airhole one way or the other?
Unless you drill the shell, yes, you will be going out the venthole, which is what I opted to do as the shell drilling is too permanent (waves-ha) for me. I tried these out in the Kick and Toms on a gig last night and it was pretty impressive!


Mike

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http://www.dominoretroplate.com

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  #238  
Old 09-15-2006, 10:52 PM
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Deathmetalconga Deathmetalconga is offline
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Default Re: Has anyone installed the MAY mics in their drums without the no-drill adapter?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skitch
Unless you drill the shell, yes, you will be going out the venthole, which is what I opted to do as the shell drilling is too permanent (waves-ha) for me. I tried these out in the Kick and Toms on a gig last night and it was pretty impressive!


Mike
Thanks. But what I really wanted to know was: Is the airhole still operable? Can air still move in and out of it with the mic installed, cable running out, etc.?
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  #239  
Old 09-15-2006, 10:57 PM
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Skitch Skitch is offline
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Default Re: Has anyone installed the MAY mics in their drums without the no-drill adapter?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Deathmetalconga
Thanks. But what I really wanted to know was: Is the airhole still operable? Can air still move in and out of it with the mic installed, cable running out, etc.?
The AVC isn't an air-tight seal; some air can still move in and out of the drum. The hardware is mostly for asthetic concerns and there is room aroung the cable for air to enter and exit the drum.


Mike

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http://www.dominoretroplate.com

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXMxJw0VnqE
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  #240  
Old 09-16-2006, 10:17 PM
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Paiste 2002 Paiste 2002 is offline
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Default Re: Kick Drum Microphones

I have been using the Audix D6 for a few years and I have never been happier with a kick drum mic. Almost every single show some sound guy mentions the kick sound at some point. And the reaction is usually the same: "Oh no wonder, it's an Audix".

I have tried/owned most of the others like the D112, Sennheiser E602, Audio-Technica AE2500 and the Beta 52, but the Audix has this EQ'd sound right out of the box that is simply incredible. What they basically did is scooped the mids, added some punch somewhere around 50-80hz., and added some snap in the upper mids/low highs. Awesome click and articulation -- and deep, tube-like low end is the result with no EQ at all. And the overall sound is massive.

Even if your drum doesn't sound all that great in the room, it will now. You can tweak the sound response a little bit just by moving the placement in relation to the beater. Some of the other mics I listed sound similar on any kick you throw it in. The D6 has the magic ability to not only clearly distinguish between different shell types and sizes, but also make drums that don't sound all that great within the acoustics of a given room....sound great. I am not saying that this mic will make your 1982 CB 700 kick drum sound like a GMS Grand Master tweaked by Drum Doctors, but it is definately very forgiving.

If you don't have the EQ capability on your board, or you just don't want to fiddle with a bunch of stuff to get a great kick sound, get the D6. If you can justify spending $180-200 on one, look no further -- this is the golden child.

Brad
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