Internal drum dampner where did they go?

[HoM3R]

My drumteacher has a classic Rogers kit with internal dampner and a new Ludwig Classic Maple were he installed them himself.
I just ordered a new Classic Maple kit and didnt see the option or dont have the option for internal dampning.
Are there any drum companys stil installing it with there kits or option to?
Why has it gone to moongel and dampning rings, because alot of classic kits seemed to have it standard?
Only thing I see wrong with it is a other screw in your shell and a small object inside your drum.
Do you have any online stores selling the ludwig internal dampning or any other brands.

[Bo Eder]

Originally Posted by HoM3R

My drumteacher has a classic Rogers kit with internal dampner and a new Ludwig Classic Maple were he installed them himself.
I just ordered a new Classic Maple kit and didnt see the option or dont have the option for internal dampning.
Are there any drum companys stil installing it with there kits or option to?
Why has it gone to moongel and dampning rings, because alot of classic kits seemed to have it standard?
Only thing I see wrong with it is a other screw in your shell and a small object inside your drum.
Do you have any online stores selling the ludwig internal dampning or any other brands.

Oddly enough, it was Rogers that marketed the first device to sound the death knell of the internal dampener. In the 70s, Rogers created a product that clipped the dampener to the drum rim and rest on top of the head. They even explained how a muffling device that went with the head when struck, as opposed to pushing up on the head made the drum sound more natural.

Then as the craze of the search for ever truer-sounding drums accelerated, many people jumped on this same bandwagon and began to remove their internal mufflers in the hopes of eliminating anything that would eventually rattle or come loose and ruin a perfectly recorded take. Then people began to use rings from old heads to muffle the batter heads, and for the most part it worked. I think the moongel products came in when some folks thought they needed more mufling. I don't think there are any companies mounting internal muffling devices anymore. Although I may be wrong since I found a newer Ludwig Black Galaxy Acrolite snare and it had an internal muffler.

[caddywumpus]

As a non-fan of dampeners, moon gel, "dampened" heads, etc., I don't miss them at all. When I get a drum that I actually use on a consistent basis, I take them off the shell...they make rattling noise when not engaged, and I'm not one to engage them. Well, except for the Pratt muffler on my round badge bass drum...THAT thing is SWEET!!!

[Pocket-full-of-gold]

Originally Posted by HoM3R

Why has it gone to moongel and dampning rings, because alot of classic kits seemed to have it standard?

Seems to me that the internal muffler going the way of the dodo pretty much coincided with the advancements in head technology. With the sheer amount of pre-muffled heads available, along with self-dampening products like Moongel et al, they're pretty much redundant. My experience with them always had me thinking they were useless. They were shot on both the old Premier kit I learned to play on and the old man's Luddy's, all the bloody things did was rattle around internally. If you really want them for nostalgic purposes, then why not.......but in a practical sense, I reckon there are better dampening options in the moden era.

[tamadrm]

I still keep mufflers on my snare drums if they were originally equiped with one.I use plastic tubing to take the rattle out the mufflers and it works like a charm.Sometimes that muffler just barely touching the head is all you need to take out just the right amount of ring.

Steve B

[GRUNTERSDAD]

I think they went the way of better drum heads with dampening built it and better materials than the calf skin that was first used.

[alvanko]

2112 drum has the Ludwigs for sale

http://www.2112online.com/cgi/shop/d...gi?r=LUDP40662

[Drumolator]

When I had drums with internal mufflers, I always removed them. I am glad new drums do not have them. Just one guy's opinion. Peace and goodwill.

[Frank]

There are still several Ludwig drums in production with internal dampeners.

This same topic is being discussed on another forum.

It seems to be in vogue to trash them. I personally think they did and still do have a place.

[ineedaclutch]

I like them, but not for their intended use. I installed one on my 16" kick so I could raise or lower the tone of it without having to tune between songs. For a higher tone I would engage the dampner and it would put more tension on the head. I think it is great for that purpose. Sounds pretty good on my Supras too. You can back off some of the honk when you need to.

[Hercules]

The Pearl ones (70s) used to rattle but a bit of gaff fixed that...

The Gretsch ones (80s) worked really well...

Now I find that the Aquarian dampener rings work quite well and I don't miss the internal dampeners.

[audiotech]

I have them on my 1965 vintage set of drums. Although I usually keep them away from the batter head, sometimes they do have an advantage if you want to quickly get a different sound out of your kit without having to retuning it. Years ago, once in a while I did get a little noise from the dampener in the 13" tom, but it was easily remedied. You can barely see the adjustment knob facing the bottom of the picture on the 16" floor tom. The last kit I played that had dampeners installed was an old Slingerland outfit in "white marine pearl", it too was super cool.



Dennis

[keep it simple]

Originally Posted by Bo Eder

Oddly enough, it was Rogers that marketed the first device to sound the death knell of the internal dampener. In the 70s, Rogers created a product that clipped the dampener to the drum rim and rest on top of the head. They even explained how a muffling device that went with the head when struck, as opposed to pushing up on the head made the drum sound more natural.

And Rogers were right, more specifically, an internal damper reduces attack as well as sustain. It curtails the initial deformation of the head that pushes the most air. If you must use dampers, use the external variety.

[Bo Eder]

Originally Posted by keep it simple

And Rogers were right, more specifically, an internal damper reduces attack as well as sustain. It curtails the initial deformation of the head that pushes the most air. If you must use dampers, use the external variety.

But what really got people into tuning toms correctly was the fact that after you bought the Rogers newfangled external dampners, you quickly lost them ;)

[MusiQmaN]

I had them pre installed (must have been the previous owner) on the 12' and 16'' and I like them when used with the Fiberskyn heads when needed in a setting. I even like them rarely on the pins (almost not touching the head) and even get a full tone out of the toms (gotta love the RC)

[keep it simple]

Originally Posted by Bo Eder

But what really got people into tuning toms correctly was the fact that after you bought the Rogers newfangled external dampners, you quickly lost them ;)

Ha, yes, so perhaps they were a good thing after all. With the range of heads available these days, more accurate shells, etc, there's no excuse for bad tuning or reliance on dampening for all but the most examining of sonic situations. As a quick change of sound tool though, I suppose they still have a specialist use.

[criz p. critter]

+1 on what everyone else has said.

The other big reason people removed them was because they never did work well, and they never sounded good. I have them on my 70s Ludwigs, though, just to keep the kit complete. If I back them off all the way, until they are tight, they don't rattle.