My rant on today's pop music

[inneedofgrace]

This morning I took my wife's car to work, and there were two of my teenage daughter's CDs in there with a mix of her favorite pop/hip-hop songs that she listens to. I was bored, so I popped them in the CD player and tried listening to the songs on both CDs. I could not get through more than about 30 seconds of any of the songs.

I am an older guy (almost 50), so I admit my opinion is going to be slanted. Certainly my parents had no clue about the rock music I listened to as a teenager, and I'm sure they hated it.

Here's my take on the songs:

1) There wasn't a lot of traditional singing going on here. It was a combination of talking, shouting back and forth, and chanting (usually ad nauseum).

2) All the vocals were heavily modified using echo, compression and whatever that program is that they use to modulate and alter the tone (Cher used it on Do You Believe in Love). The "computerized" voices grated on me after about 2 minutes.

3) The songs had no real structure to them. There was no intro, verse, chorus, middle eight, chorus, out, etc. Seemed like the repitiion goes on until the engineer decides to fade out the end of the song. I imagine this is because the primary reason for these songs is to dance to in a club or a party. The way we danced in the 70's/80's bears no resemblance to how you would dance to this music.

4) Out of about 20 songs, I only found one that sounded like it had real drums in it. The rest had clicks, snaps, and real loud bass booms that kept the beat. Some synthesizers (sampling, no doubt), no piano, no guitar.

Okay - rant over. I know this was only a small sampling of todays popular music. And I'm sure there is some good music out there that doesn't get much air time. Music companies and radio stations are not always the best judges of talent - only what they can sell.

[joeysnare]

i don't care if i get flamed for this. pop music is garbage , nuff said.

if you disagree then watch rebecca blacks video called "friday"

[Pollyanna]

Originally Posted by joeysnare

i don't care if i get flamed for this. pop music is garbage , nuff said.

if you disagree then watch rebecca blacks video called "friday"

Awww Joey, I love lots of old pop. Elton's Candle in the Wind, Fleetwood Mac's Rhiannon, B52s's Love Shack, Bangles's Walk Like an Egyptian, Ben Folds's Brick, Billy Joel's Zanzibar, Crash Test Dummies's Mmm Mmm Mmm Mmm, Eurythmics's Here Comes The Rain Again, George Michaels's I Want Your Sex, Joe Jackson's Breaking Us In Two ... dunno if all these are a huge turnoff for you but for me they're great songs with great playing, singing and arranging.

I'm now an old cow and today's pop doesn't do it for me. As far as I'm concerned, pop started going downhill with the machines. There's some good machine music out there, but most sounds like formulaic blah to me.

[Pkaneps]

I pretty much agree. It takes little musical knowledge to put together one of those tracks and then autotune a voice over it with lyrics that don't mean anything.

I'm only 22 and I'm out of touch with my own generation in terms of music. I have friends that swear by top 40 radio stations.

It's gotten to the point where I can't even turn the damn thing on...I just listen to my iPod.

[inneedofgrace]

I remember when The Human League came out with their big hit Don't You Want Me back in the early 80's, and it was amazing that all of the instruments were synthesized. Yet the song was fun to sing along with, dance to, and it didn't sound totally fake.

It's sad to think that I prefer to listen to 70's disco music over what passes for pop music this day. At least a lot of the disco had real instruments, even some with full orchestral arrangements. Real brass instruments in pop bands such as Tower of Power, Chicago, Blood Sweat and Tears, and Earth Wind and Fire are a thing of the past.

[boomstick]

Originally Posted by Pollyanna

Awww Joey, I love lots of old pop...

As do I. Starting with the "King of Pop," Michael Jackson, who delivered many performances of sheer brilliance over his career. In my opinion though, things have gone in a disappointing direction as of late. Simply put, today's pop music has no soul. There, I said it.

[Pkaneps]

Originally Posted by inneedofgrace

Real brass instruments in pop bands such as Tower of Power, Chicago, Blood Sweat and Tears, and Earth Wind and Fire are a thing of the past.

This reminds me, someone showed me a band that's pretty new (2007) called Black Joe Lewis & The Honeybears, and some of their stuff is pretty reminiscent of Earth Wind & Fire and James Brown. I was impressed.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oJ-M_8pY6TI

[shadowlorde]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMtZfW2z9dw

... people think that is great music ... auto tune the news is not music ... and its proof that if you put a drum machine behind someone talking and auto tune it .. you will get thousands of hits on youtube and sell it on itunes

i don't know know if its like this in all countries or if its just america that the most mindless crap is the most popular.

[SGdrummer]

Originally Posted by joeysnare

i don't care if i get flamed for this. pop music is garbage , nuff said.

if you disagree then watch rebecca blacks video called "friday"

I think that It's sad that such an incredibly horrible "song" like rebecca black's "friday" can gain so much attention. I currently go to a private all guys high school and even here you cannot walk down the hall without hearing somebody singing that wretched song. Even if it is a joke because it's so bad, it makes me physically sick to see a girl with that little talent become so popular while there are plenty of struggling bands with real skill out there.

I have recently gotten into home producing after taking a music production course and it brought about a newfound respect for all the producers that actually write most of the pop songs. I just cannot accept how a person can call themselves an artist and not write any original music.

Originally Posted by inneedofgrace

I remember when The Human League came out with their big hit Don't You Want Me back in the early 80's, and it was amazing that all of the instruments were synthesized. Yet the song was fun to sing along with, dance to, and it didn't sound totally fake.

It wasn't fake, the Human League rpogrammed and played all their instruments, even after the "band" left to form Heaven 17, Oakey and the girls still did their own programming.

Real brass instruments in pop bands such as Tower of Power, Chicago, Blood Sweat and Tears, and Earth Wind and Fire are a thing of the past.

Try telling Less Than Jake, Reel Big Fish, Madness or the Specials that.

[MaryO]

I, too, have a difficult time with most of today's pop music. There are a few people/bands out there I quite like, such as Maroon 5, but definitely not many.

I think one of the best new artists in music is Imelda May but she's more rockabilly than pop and doesn't get much attention on this side of the pond. Shame, she's really great.

I'm a child of the 80's (graduated in 85) and find myself turning back towards a lot of that music most of the time. I find it funny how many current songs are sampling that same music. New music isn't even really new anymore...it's just a mixed up regurgitation of better music with some autotuning and (c)rap thrown over the top of it in my opinion. Why ruin a perfectly good song, I say? Just listen to the original!

Just my humble opinion :)

Originally Posted by MaryO

I find it funny how many current songs are sampling that same music. New music isn't even really new anymore...

I've been saying this for years...

Boy/girl "bands"' first 6 singles are covers... This is because:

a) The fanbase has an attention span of not very much and needs to hear something they know before they'll buy into it.
b) The artists can't write their own songs so it's quicker for other people to re-arrange other people's songs.

[Fishbones]

Originally Posted by Pkaneps

This reminds me, someone showed me a band that's pretty new (2007) called Black Joe Lewis & The Honeybears, and some of their stuff is pretty reminiscent of Earth Wind & Fire and James Brown. I was impressed.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oJ-M_8pY6TI

Those guys are great! Just posted it on Facebook. Thanks for that!!

[inneedofgrace]

Originally Posted by Hellwyck

I've been saying this for years...

Boy/girl "bands"' first 6 singles are covers... This is because:

a) The fanbase has an attention span of not very much and needs to hear something they know before they'll buy into it.
b) The artists can't write their own songs so it's quicker for other people to re-arrange other people's songs.

Interestingly, a few of the Beatles early hits were cover tunes, but that was probably more the label's decision. There was no doubt from the get-go that they could write their own stuff.

[larryace]

I'm pretty sure Plato didn't like his kids music either. This rant is as old as the hills. Not knocking the rant, I'm with you.
The thing I find the most disturbing is the lack of humanness in pop music. I can't relate to click tracks, autotune, handclap backbeats whatsoever. To me it's sad that the music that our current young generation will get nostalgic about has very little emotion to it.

[DrumEatDrum]

For one, this is why I rarely listen to the radio outside of classic rock stations. There is a ton of good new music out there, but it's not going to be on the radio.

Second, yeah, it's teenagers perogrative to find music their parents will hate. As I said in another thread, if it doesn't annoy someone, it's not rock-n-roll.

Thirdly, Polly, I think you're not really making pop to pop comparisons.

Elton John, Fleetwood Mac, Jo Jackson, those were NOT really pop artists. Yes, their music crossed over to pop, but they still attempted to have artistic and rebellious credibility.

When I think generic pop to compare the Rebecca Black song too, compare it to the Rebecca Black's of the past:

Debbie Gibson, Tiffany, New Kids on the Block, Menudo, The Partridge Family, Andy Gibb, Sonny and Cher. All that stuff was just as "manufactured" as today's pop music, involving fake instruments, or sessions guys hired to record stiff performances, with the idea to appeal to as many non-musicians as possible for the quick buck.

Since the muti-track was invented, there has always been dumb, mindless bubble gum pop music out there for the masses that really only appeals to teenagers.

The same rant posted in the OP could have easily been made 20 years ago, and even earlier.

Not that I disagree with the OP in anyway. I wouldn't listen to it either.

[bermuda]

Originally Posted by inneedofgrace

2) All the vocals were heavily modified using echo, compression and whatever that program is that they use to modulate and alter the tone (Cher used it on Do You Believe in Love).

Antares Auto-Tune. A nice tool, but taken to its extreme. It's no different than the ab/over-used gated drum sounds of the '80s. The Kepex ( keyable program expander, IIRC) started as a great tool to clean up tracks and perform other behind-the-scenes functions. But engineers and producers exploited its capabilities to the max, and that fad eventually ran its course. The gate remains, but it has settled back into its original purpose. Perhaps the same will be said for Auto-Tune now that it's become so common, artists will regard it as a tool again, and not as an effect.

As for what passes for popular music now, I dunno. It's hard for me to judge a song just on whether the drums are real, or how much production or marketing has gone into it, or the age of the singer. Honestly, I don't really listen to lyrics, so if the track sounds good to me, I like it. Say what you will about the boy bands and pop tarts, but those tracks are pretty heavy and masterfully produced, not slapped together for a quick buck by any means. They work hard to get that quick buck! I listened to that Friday song, and keyed in on the drums and chords. Lyrically I guess it's pretty goofy, but there have certainly been far worse songs on a musical level.

I forget which big-band era icon this is attributed to, but the saying about there being "only two kinds of music" still holds true. I get a healthy dose of most genres, and am perhaps lucky that I can still judge a song on its merits, not based on who sings it, or who else likes it. I don't think it's an age thing, I'm creeping up on 55 and still take it all in as I did when I was 12. I just like what I like, and judge a song by how it sounds to me.

You guys would flip if you knew what kind of stuff was on my CD shelves. Let's look at the F section... Fad Gadget, Faith No More, Percy Faith, Fatboy Slim, Filter, Fine Young Cannibals, Ella Fitzgerald, Fleetwood Mac, Foghat, Foo Fighters, Four Tops, Samantha Fox, Peter Frampton, Frankie Goes To Hollywood, Aretha Franklin, Stan Freberg, Free, Richie Furay... to name a few. And if you go to S you will find Britney Spears and The Spice Girls mixed in with Nancy Sinatra, Siouxsee and the Banshees, School of Fish, Springsteen, Sublime, Santana, Bobby Sherman, and The Shaggs.

Bermuda

[Deltadrummer]

Originally Posted by bermuda

to name a few. And if you go to S you will find Britney Spears and The Spice Girls mixed in with Nancy Sinatra, Siouxsee and the Banshees, School of Fish, Springsteen, Sublime, Santana, Bobby Sherman, and The Shaggs.

Bermuda

I'm glad you finally upgraded your Bobby Sherman collection to CD. :)

Am I wrong for liking Forget You?

[MaryO]

Originally Posted by Deltadrummer

Am I wrong for liking Forget You?

Me too. I feel like I shouldn't but it is infectious, isn't it?

[Ecclesrose]

Originally Posted by Deltadrummer

Am I wrong for liking Forget You?

Of course not, that is one of the very few songs that I can actually listen to and enjoy from the world of pop music today.

I agree that pop music today is not as good as it used to be, but I have faith that musicians will begin to shun technology and start actually recording live instruments played by musicians, rather than machines. It's not that much of a issue for me anyway, I prefer to listen to good music, rather than mindless crap aimed at teenagers (even though I'm 16)

[TennesseeDrummer]

Good post bermuda. I find myself agreeing with alot of it. Mostly the main bottom line, take it all in. Appreciate music for what it is. Yeah, alot of it sucks donkey, but its still music. And isn't that why we are all sitting here?

[the_dude]

Originally Posted by larryace

I'm pretty sure Plato didn't like his kids music either. This rant is as old as the hills.

You are correct. Since I'm an old fart I've seen this topic for decades. Every era has music I like and music I don't. Sometimes you just have to dig a little deeper to find it.
Thankfully now that I have XM radio I don't need to listen to "Top 40" or whatever you want to call the stations that spoon feed the masses.
Now, you kids, get off my lawn!

[inneedofgrace]

Originally Posted by the_dude

You are correct. Since I'm an old fart I've seen this topic for decades. Every era has music I like and music I don't. Sometimes you just have to dig a little deeper to find it.
Thankfully now that I have XM radio I don't need to listen to "Top 40" or whatever you want to call the stations that spoon feed the masses.
Now, you kids, get off my lawn!

LOL - there have been occassional songs that my kids listen to that I have enjoyed along with them. I try to soak in every possible genre of music from disco to hard rock to dance to blues to folk to jazz to classical. I draw the line at rap and opera - NO WAY are you getting me to subject my ears to that!

Believe it or not I enjoyed some of Britney Spears original material, but that sadly went the way of most pop music today. Same goes for Christine Aguilera. Also, I consider Madonna's music during her comeback period to be far inferior to her 80's work. Some of the pop from the 80s was dreadful, but some was original and catchy. Even my kids love to sing along with The Buggles Video Killed the Radio Star.

I also enjoy much of Michael Jackson's catalog, although again his latest stuff is not my favorite. I was never into Diva-type music, such as Whitney Houston, Mariah Carey or Celine Dion. But I loved the lady rockers such as Joan Jett and Pat Benatar.

[bermuda]

Originally Posted by inneedofgrace

I draw the line at rap and opera - NO WAY are you getting me to subject my ears to that!

While I'm not a fan of opera, I do enjoy classic/mainstream symphonic music (Carmen, the Beethoven et al symphonies, etc.) As for rap, I guess I listen with a different ear. Again, I'm not really paying attention to lyrics... I drum along with songs rather than sing to them. But there's a lot of great production on a lot of rap tracks. People think that anyone can just slap samples on top of a 4-bar drum loop, but it's much more than that. Often, a lot more time and effort goes into making a sequenced drum part than what a live drummer would invest.

That said, I do prefer more mainstream and old-school rap (Puff Daddy, Run DMC, Arrested Development, Eminem, etc.) to the hardcore gangsta rap.

I think if more people would listen to the music before judging by genre, they'd find more to like. I certainly have my likes and dislikes, but I choose every song individually, not based on its genre.

Bermuda

[DrumEatDrum]

Originally Posted by bermuda

Honestly, I don't really listen to lyrics,

I know we've discussed this before, but that still blows my mind.

Lyrics are often what draws me to or turns me off from a band.

I'm not saying every band I like has good lyrics, or that the lyrics are necessarily even in English, but I still find it be an important aspect of listening pleasure.

Originally Posted by bermuda

You guys would flip if you knew what kind of stuff was on my CD shelves. Let's look at the F section... Fad Gadget, Faith No More, Percy Faith, Fatboy Slim, Filter, Fine Young Cannibals, Ella Fitzgerald, Fleetwood Mac, Foghat, Foo Fighters, Four Tops, Samantha Fox, Peter Frampton, Frankie Goes To Hollywood, Aretha Franklin, Stan Freberg, Free, Richie Furay... to name a few. And if you go to S you will find Britney Spears and The Spice Girls mixed in with Nancy Sinatra, Siouxsee and the Banshees, School of Fish, Springsteen, Sublime, Santana, Bobby Sherman, and The Shaggs.

And I thought my CD collection was all over the place. Heh.

[Pocket-full-of-gold]

Originally Posted by bermuda

but I choose every song individually, not based on its genre.

Wholeheartedly agree.

I can dislike 99% of a certain genre....hell, I can dislike 99% of a certain artist, but if they come out with a gem that I find enjoyable to listen to then what's not to like?

I heard a quote many years ago and who exactly said it is lost to me now. I think it was either Eddie Van Halen or Gene Simmons but whoever it was said "A good song, is a good song." It spoke volumes to me at the time. No matter the artist, genre or content, if you find one that grabs you, enjoy it for what it is. :-)

[DrumEatDrum]

Originally Posted by bermuda

I think if more people would listen to the music before judging by genre, they'd find more to like. I certainly have my likes and dislikes, but I choose every song individually, not based on its genre.

Bermuda

I agree. I used to have rules about what I would and would not listen to.
But then I would find a certain artist or song that would make me want to make an exception.

Then the exceptions kept piling up, to the point I realized it was no longer a rule.

There are styles I tend to not like, but it's never cut and dry.

[bermuda]

Originally Posted by DrumEatDrum

I know we've discussed this before, but that still blows my mind.

Lyrics are often what draws me to or turns me off from a band.

It's the same for me, but with the music. I guess if I wrote lyrics or sang, I would have a broader focus.

Bermuda

[daredrummer]

I actually just wrote a 5 page essay (for school) on how real music is much better than rap and hip hop.

Got the grade back today, and I got an A!
So either I'm good at writing, or my teacher hates rap and hip hop...

[Drums101]

Originally Posted by inneedofgrace

I remember when The Human League came out with their big hit Don't You Want Me back in the early 80's, and it was amazing that all of the instruments were synthesized. Yet the song was fun to sing along with, dance to, and it didn't sound totally fake.

The Human League! They invented music!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bKwQ_zeRwEs

[Fishbones]

Originally Posted by Pocket-full-of-gold

"A good song, is a good song." It spoke volumes to me at the time. No matter the artist, genre or content, if you find one that grabs you, enjoy it for what it is. :-)

I'm pretty sure Chad Smith said "There are only two types of music - good and bad."

[bermuda]

Originally Posted by Fishbones

I'm pretty sure Chad Smith said "There are only two types of music - good and bad."

Chad would have been echoing what either Count Basie or Duke Ellington said decades earlier. But I agree, it's true.

[Ian Williams]

I fully agree, it's too bloody commercial.

Originally Posted by joeysnare

i don't care if i get flamed for this. pop music is garbage , nuff said.

if you disagree then watch rebecca blacks video called "friday"

[DrumEatDrum]

Originally Posted by bermuda

It's the same for me, but with the music. I guess if I wrote lyrics or sang, I would have a broader focus.

Bermuda

Well, I can't sing to save my life, and until a few years ago, I have never written lyrics for a band before.

I mean, Tommy isn't Tommy without the lyrics that tie it all together. Dark Side of the Moon, Quadrophenia, The Wall, most U2 albums, the list goes on an on of albums that wouldn't be what they are without the lyrics.

[Pocket-full-of-gold]

Originally Posted by DrumEatDrum

Well, I can't sing to save my life, and until a few years ago, I have never written lyrics for a band before.

I mean, Tommy isn't Tommy without the lyrics that tie it all together. Dark Side of the Moon, Quadrophenia, The Wall, most U2 albums, the list goes on an on of albums that wouldn't be what they are without the lyrics.

Then you have a wealth of music where lyrics fall somewhere between the sublime and the ridiculous. I'm a huge RHCP fan, but I've gotta be honest, the fact that I have no idea what half the nonsensical babblings spouted by A Keidis are, is of little consequence and certainly doesn't detract from the listening experience.

Obviously it's not an absolute, as there is plenty of music out there where I'm captured by what's being said lyrically. But I also find often times, listening to the melody, harmonies, phrasing or vocal inflections is all I need. Hearing the vocals as another instrument as opposed to a vehicle to get a 'message' across, works for me too.

[inneedofgrace]

Originally Posted by Drums101

The Human League! They invented music!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bKwQ_zeRwEs

Awesome! "Nobody but science teachers and the mentally ill listen to jazz...."

[Bo Eder]

You guys really have me wanting to get with my parents and asking them what they thought of the stuff I was listening to in the 80s.

But oddly enough, I have this feeling it won't be such an argument because lo and behold, the music I listened to was sort of like theirs, in that there were chord changes, notes sung, all that 'music stuff' going on. Something along the way happened after the first punk revolution, because instead of folks who couldn't play (but were trying to) being mad about it and going out and doing so, now there's this whole generation of people who, while trying to create something new, created a whole genre of music that doesn't rely on notes, or chord structure or singing....weird.

I went back and listened to Nina Hagen's first album released in the States and I remember the "shock and the noise" of it all (the one that had "White Punks on Dope" in German). Now it sounds so tame and hard to believe, there was music on it! The musicianship was pretty high when you compare it to, say, the Jonas Brothers, or Aly & AJ....

There's always these people who "produce" these semi-prodigal child performers and part of me thinks they're engaging in this sick musical joke (not unlike Frank Zappa) where they're actually really good musicians, but they know nobody cares about that, so they produce this "stuff" we all hate, but the kids love it. Takes really good musicians to do that and know who the jokes' on, eh?

[Jim Mattingly]

I have to think it happens with all generation gaps with music, I can still vividly remember my dad driving us to a Led Zeppelin concert one time and him asking a million times, who are you going to see, Led Zipper.. Obviously joking around but I can remember it like it was yesterday. But also like my parents did for me, some of the music they listened to when I was young actually influenced me to become a drummer, Gene Krupa, Buddy Rich big band era stuff etc...I also have two older children 22 and 19 and I have music going on around our house all the time, no matter what I am doing. Now they love the current stuff out there but they also like alot of the music I listen to. I actually took them to a Porcupine Tree concert this past summer and believe it or not my son and I hung out with John Wesley, the hired gun second guitarist/vocals for PT and Ian Bond, the front of house sound engineer for PT at a BBQ the night before the show, and we got to watch the show from the sound booth with Ian. They are both totally in love with PT, and I am taking them to the Jeff Beck/Imelda May show this April 19th. They love a ton of the music I listen to but I have a very hard time listening to their stuff, although at times they will come to me and say hey dad you gotta listen to this new CD by whoever it's great. I would never tell them that I did not like it, maybe a comment like yeah thats pretty interesting. Gotta give them there music freedom like most of our parents did for us, I will however tell my son when he is listening to some of his gangster rap stuff and they are getting overly vulger to turn it off. Everything now a days is very techno for the most part, voice over efx and to me just not music.

[Duckenheimer]

I like pop, old and new. Duke Special is a very good artist around now that I was listening to before I saw this thread:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZPKEIZ7wm2o

I probably don't like most of the top 50 charting albums or singles right now but a lot of the best music now is hovering just under the most mainstream stuff nowadays - and here I think hip hop and rock and metal and modern soul and so on are very healthy - and it's all so easily accessible and explorable thanks to the net.

[Pollyanna]

Originally Posted by DrumEatDrum

Polly, I think you're not really making pop to pop comparisons.

Elton John, Fleetwood Mac, Jo Jackson, those were NOT really pop artists. Yes, their music crossed over to pop, but they still attempted to have artistic and rebellious credibility.

When I think generic pop to compare the Rebecca Black song too, compare it to the Rebecca Black's of the past:

Debbie Gibson, Tiffany, New Kids on the Block, Menudo, The Partridge Family, Andy Gibb, Sonny and Cher. All that stuff was just as "manufactured" as today's pop music, involving fake instruments, or sessions guys hired to record stiff performances, with the idea to appeal to as many non-musicians as possible for the quick buck.

Fair point, DED, but Rebecca and her ilk represent the lowest common denominator. I don't think we can judge today's pop by that standard. I'm not fan of today's pop but that song of hers posted here was the pits.

Actually, I quite like those old Bee Gees tracks so go easy on the Gibbs :)

Bermuda ... of your collection, I have stuff by Faith No More, Fatboy Slim, Ella Fitzgerald, Fleetwood Mac, Four Tops, Peter Frampton, Frankie Goes To Hollywood, Aretha Franklin, Free (not pop), Springsteen, Santana ...

Some of the pop in my collection includes Anastacia, Macy Gray, Supertramp (love 'em), The Cure, 10CC, Bryan Ferry, Chris Isaac, Coldplay, Frente, The Go Gos, The Carpenters, Kate Bush, Nellie Furtado, Pointer Sisters, Sade, Simply Red, The Killers and Wham!

Just cos I'm into King Crimson, Uncle Frank, Henry Cow, Mahavishnu, Weather Report, The Who and Led Zep doesn't disqualify me from also being crazy about good pop.

All I ask is that artists write and play music from the heart and go easy on the formulas, samey-ness and machines! Hopefully all this mechanised pap will go away, but I doubt it will happen anytime soon. We'll have to wait for Gen Z's kids to rebel and p1ss off their parents with "horrible" acoustic-sounding music :)