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  #1  
Old 02-09-2011, 04:06 AM
LedFoot65 LedFoot65 is offline
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Default coated emporer problem

I just put on a coated emporer on my 12in Tama SCP birch tom and I'm not crazy about it.The coating started to get black stick marks rite away and it would only give me a warm sound when it was tuned low When I started to tune it up the head felt hard and bright.I think a coated head should sound and feel warm even when it's tuned high or low.Has anybody had similar problems with Remo? The coating feels very thin.Should I try the EvansG2 or Aquarian Responce2 ?
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  #2  
Old 02-09-2011, 04:22 AM
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

Aren't emperors meant for loose tuning? I've seen marks show up right away on coated heads as well as clear heads.
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Old 02-09-2011, 04:38 AM
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

You are getting black sticks marks because your sticks are dirty.

Make sure your reso heads are tuned as well..
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Old 02-09-2011, 06:28 AM
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

Quote:
Originally Posted by wsabol View Post
You are getting black sticks marks because your sticks are dirty.
Indeed.....if your boots get mud on them, is it the fault of the shoemaker, or the fault of the guy who stepped in the shite?


Quote:
Originally Posted by razorx View Post
Aren't emperors meant for loose tuning?
Possibly, but that doesn't explain why mine still sound good when cranked up, either.

To answer the OP. Remo seems to be a dirty word here at DW for some strange reason.....I keep reading post after post about how feeble they are. Strangely though, I've been playing them for over 25 years. I'm certainly not an expert on the topic, but by the same account, nor am I stupid enough to keep using a product that doesn't hold up. The only conclusion I can draw is that you Yanks get the junk and they send the quality Downunder!! :-)
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Old 02-09-2011, 06:48 AM
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

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Originally Posted by Pocket-full-of-gold View Post
The only conclusion I can draw is that you Yanks get the junk and they send the quality Downunder!! :-)
Nah, they send the good stuff here, too. I've never had problems with them, and I've been playing them for 35 years, come this spring.
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Old 02-09-2011, 02:08 PM
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

Everyone already answered the stick marks question.

Remo Emperors are two-ply heads, which gives them a definitively different voice than a one-ply head, it also shortens their decay the most inaudible amount.

I have never tried to tune up a two-ply head to a higher tuning, but I know that one-ply heads sound nicer when tuned slightly higher than a two-ply head.

I'm not planning on switching to Evans, by the way. I'm sticking to Remo for at least a long while.
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  #7  
Old 02-09-2011, 02:50 PM
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

I just left G2's and did not like them either. I switched to Pinstripes and they are awesome.. Try a pinstripe or even a coated pinstripe.
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  #8  
Old 02-09-2011, 04:05 PM
AudioWonderland AudioWonderland is offline
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

Quote:
Originally Posted by LedFoot65 View Post
I just put on a coated emporer on my 12in Tama SCP birch tom and I'm not crazy about it.The coating started to get black stick marks rite away and it would only give me a warm sound when it was tuned low When I started to tune it up the head felt hard and bright.I think a coated head should sound and feel warm even when it's tuned high or low.Has anybody had similar problems with Remo? The coating feels very thin.Should I try the EvansG2 or Aquarian Responce2 ?

1) Dirty or painted sticks will do that
2) Why would you expect a head to be warm and soft cranked up?

I think your expectations were a little faulty thats all. You might try the suede heads from remo. Those will be a bit softer and warmer than coated but will definitely change character as they are pitched up like any other head will
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  #9  
Old 02-09-2011, 04:15 PM
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

I just bought new Emperors last week for my toms (coated Emps top, coated Ambs bottom). They replaced coated G2s on top that had been there for a several years now (I had Emperors before the G2s).

I don't think I could say that Remos are better or worse than Evans. There's a slight difference between the two, but nothing terribly drastic. The new Emperors sound great by the way.

It's only been the last couple years that I've taken a more keen interest in tuning - since discovering Bob Gatzen and other tuning videos on YouTube. All my tuning in the 25+ years before that had been mostly hit and miss - sometimes getting lucky, sometimes not.

I'd say that it would be worth taking the time to get the tuning really figured out before deciding which heads you prefer.
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  #10  
Old 02-11-2011, 06:09 AM
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

Quote:
Originally Posted by LedFoot65 View Post
I just put on a coated emporer on my 12in Tama SCP birch tom and I'm not crazy about it.The coating started to get black stick marks rite away and it would only give me a warm sound when it was tuned low When I started to tune it up the head felt hard and bright.I think a coated head should sound and feel warm even when it's tuned high or low.Has anybody had similar problems with Remo? The coating feels very thin.Should I try the EvansG2 or Aquarian Responce2 ?
I've been a Remo guy for about 20 years, but a few years ago they did start changing the coating on their heads (which I think was not for the better). I noticed that new heads I was buying had a much thinner coating than previous. I actually took the initiative to go around to old mom & pop music stores to get ahold of the old stock of the thicker coated heads. Alas those were all exhausted and I found myself making my first Evans purchase last weekend.
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  #11  
Old 02-11-2011, 06:25 AM
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

From My experience it is a fact that Remo coating wears faster than Evans and Aquarian.
As far as sound goes, I can only say this.
I can tune an Emperor just as well as I can tune any comparable head from any of the big three.
I can tune two ply heads lose or tight. I like to tune every head, single ply, or double ply, on the tight side. Thats just the way that I tune.
I don't have a problem tuning Emp's! I like the way that coated Emp's sound,
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  #12  
Old 02-12-2011, 03:04 AM
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

I like coated emps. I go back and forth between them and coated G2s on my snare. They are very similar sounding on my supraphonic. The Evans coating doesn't wear off. The Remo coating wears off after the first gig. If you are bugged about cosmetics, as I sometimes am, the Evans G2's will look "newer" longer. Standard coated emps have the coating over a clear 2 ply head and when the coating wears off, it looks like a black dot on your head. It used to be coating over a white 2 ply head. They looked and sounded better in my opinion. They make the vintage emperor, which is coated over 2 ply white heads, but the mylar film is a little thicker (7.5 mm as opposed to 7 mm), so the sound is ever so slightly more "middy" to my ear. Anyway, emps are great heads, although consistency has been an issue....but that's another topic for another thread.
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  #13  
Old 02-12-2011, 07:32 AM
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

It's been my experience as well with the Remo coatings flaking off more readily than that of the Evan's products, until last weekend. I found Gretsch Jazz kits with coated heads on them that read "Gretsch by Evans". These were laughable. I never saw any heads that had as much ware as what these "Evans" heads had. They were on a floor kits at two different locations. Maybe Evans manufactures a cheaper head for some of these drum companies just to get the Evans name out there, at least this is what I hope and that they're no creating short cuts in their main manufacturing process for normal distribution. I was Very surprised.

I used Remo drums heads for many, many years and just switched over to Evans about five or six years ago to help squelch the coating flaking problems of that of Remo. I do really like the sound of the Remo coated Ambassadors on my Classic kit.

To get back to the OP's question of stick marks. This will happen with coated heads. The heads act like fine grit sandpaper as the drum sticks hit them transferring dust, dirt and sometimes paint. Stick marks and flaking coatings are two different entities.

Dennis
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  #14  
Old 02-14-2011, 05:52 AM
LedFoot65 LedFoot65 is offline
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

Thanks for the advice.
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  #15  
Old 02-27-2011, 07:14 AM
JMalriat JMalriat is offline
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

Quote:
Originally Posted by audiotech View Post
I found Gretsch Jazz kits with coated heads on them that read "Gretsch by Evans". These were laughable. I never saw any heads that had as much ware as what these "Evans" heads had. They were on a floor kits at two different locations. Maybe Evans manufactures a cheaper head for some of these drum companies just to get the Evans name out there, at least this is what I hope and that they're no creating short cuts in their main manufacturing process for normal distribution. I was Very surprised.
Dennis
Yeah man, i bought a catalina club jazz set about a month ago and the heads are complete shite. They chip like crazy, its been a month and i can already see the floor through the snare. I feel like when the coating comes off it makes the drum sound sharp and kind of harsh. anyone have any opinion on fiberskyn heads? I play a lot of jazz and i feel like it would sound good. im just worried about the finish because i play with brushes for a lot of gigs.
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  #16  
Old 02-27-2011, 02:06 PM
Sonorforce3007user Sonorforce3007user is offline
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

Isn't it just wooden tips that make your skins black, not plastic ones?
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  #17  
Old 02-27-2011, 09:00 PM
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

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Originally Posted by JMalriat View Post
anyone have any opinion on fiberskyn heads? I play a lot of jazz and i feel like it would sound good. im just worried about the finish because i play with brushes for a lot of gigs.
The Fiberskyn heads are great! I've been using the 14" Ambassor model on my snare for a while now and I've found it to be great in pretty much any tuning range you can throw it's way, and from my own experience they can be cranked up really pretty darn high (when used for funk for example) and not choke. Tone wise they're very rich, nice balance of all frequency ranges and have a nice mid punch

As for the coating, it's extremeley durable, they're designed for the use of brushes and are a must for jazz in my opinion.

Hope that helps,

Kev
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Old 03-01-2011, 01:35 AM
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

Another option is the Aquarian Modern Vintage instead of the Fiberskyns, which have strange 'bubbling' problems, and may be cheaper.
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Old 03-01-2011, 08:58 AM
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

I have coated Emps on my FTs that are tuned high and sound quite nice. I personally think Emps have a tad more sustain than Coated G2s but there isn't a world of difference, either. The main difference I see is in tuning. Evans give a smoother and easier tuning with out all the re-tensioning and snap crackle and pop that Remos are notorious for. I have been playing Remos since the days when your only other option was calfskins, and I really don't see that they have changed a whole lot. I used to think my old Remos didn't sound broken in until they had that dirty 6-8 inch diameter circle surrounding the center of the head, and a few dents inside of that. What's wrong with a few dirty stick marks, for Godssakes?

Last edited by Strangelove; 03-01-2011 at 09:11 AM.
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  #20  
Old 03-01-2011, 09:03 AM
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

Coated heads are supposed to sound warm - LOL!
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  #21  
Old 03-01-2011, 11:29 AM
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

Quote:
Originally Posted by Strangelove View Post
I used to think my old Remos didn't sound broken in until they had that dirty 6-8 inch diameter circle surrounding the center of the head, and a few dents inside of that. What's wrong with a few dirty stick marks, for Godssakes?
A man after my own heart Doc. Give me my heads "played in a bit" any day of the week. This new concept that heads 'should remain virginal white' and 'sticks should last forever', is new to me.
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  #22  
Old 03-01-2011, 06:47 PM
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

The dirtier Emps get the better they start sounding in my opinion. Every head takes a bit to break in, I find that Emps more than most. They are the head choice for myself switching out with the clear every once in a while, but you can't beat the coated, great sound. As for marks on stuff, well your a drummer, the stuff (cymbals etc.) is pricey but it's supposed to be hit. My HHX cymbals cost me more than my car but they are used well and have marks all over them, do they sound different???
Nope, just as good as they day I brought them home, hey maybe even better.
Don't get too hung up on marked cymbals, they look better that way.
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Old 03-01-2011, 09:58 PM
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

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Originally Posted by Pocket-full-of-gold View Post
A man after my own heart Doc. Give me my heads "played in a bit" any day of the week. This new concept that heads 'should remain virginal white' and 'sticks should last forever', is new to me.
LOL -I think I have really showed my age now. And don't forget cymbals, too - we can't have our cymbals these days looking like well used copper pennies, haha!
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Old 03-03-2011, 06:46 PM
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

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Originally Posted by jodgey4 View Post
Another option is the Aquarian Modern Vintage instead of the Fiberskyns, which have strange 'bubbling' problems, and may be cheaper.
Aha! So it's not just me who's had that problem. I've had mine on since...erm...October (I think) and the center of the head has started to "bubble" over the past few weeks, it's not affected the sound too much, at least yet.

I shall have to check out the Aquarians!

Cheers,

Kev
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Old 03-03-2011, 08:24 PM
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

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Originally Posted by K.Howden View Post
Aha! So it's not just me who's had that problem. I've had mine on since...erm...October (I think) and the center of the head has started to "bubble" over the past few weeks, it's not affected the sound too much, at least yet.

I shall have to check out the Aquarians!

Cheers,

Kev
You should be pleasantly surprised at how well the Aquarian heads hold up.

I switched from the Fiberskyns a few years ago after I got tired of the bubbling issue. It didn't affect the sound...that much. I just ended up tightening the snare more, but it was very noticeable on the toms.

For me, the Aquarians sound so much better and the last several times longer.

Another benefit is that you can call the company and speak to a live, knowledgeable representative if you have any questions. Roy Burns has personally helped me twice.
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  #26  
Old 03-03-2011, 10:42 PM
don strandberg don strandberg is offline
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

Never was a big fan of the emporer. Try an Evens G Plus. Or an Ebony Pin.. Good Luck..
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Old 03-03-2011, 10:49 PM
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

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Originally Posted by cdrums21 View Post
I like coated emps.It used to be coating over a white 2 ply head. They looked and sounded better in my opinion. They make the vintage emperor, which is coated over 2 ply white heads, but the mylar film is a little thicker (7.5 mm as opposed to 7 mm), so the sound is ever so slightly more "middy" to my ear.
They still offer the "old style" 2 ply 7mm/7mm white film with coating.
It's the JP model.
Use JP suffix after the model number when they order them.

There is also a JP Ambassador.
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Old 03-04-2011, 04:22 AM
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

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Originally Posted by KarlCrafton View Post
They still offer the "old style" 2 ply 7mm/7mm white film with coating.
It's the JP model.
Use JP suffix after the model number when they order them.

There is also a JP Ambassador.
Really? I think we talked about this before and I thought you said something about the smoth white emperors being offered in a coated version. Is that what you are talking about? If so, I thought that they were 7.5 mm plies. I could be totally wrong though, never heard of the "JP' suffix model. Any significance of the letters?
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Old 03-04-2011, 04:28 AM
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

I found this on Remo's site, it's the model with the JP suffix:

Smooth White™ EmperorŽ heads are warmer than Clear EmperorŽ with bigger mid range tones. Smooth White™ EmperorŽs are quickly becoming one of REMOŽ’s most popular WeatherKingŽ heads. They’re made with two free-floating plies of 7.5-mil MylarŽ film, which gives consistent open warm tones which accounts for their popularity among many of today’s Studio and Rock drummers.

I assume the coated version would have the same construction, just a coating, and as you can see, it's 2 plies of 7.5-mil mylar, not 7-mil. So really, the smooth white coated head is exactly the same as the Vinage emperor, only the vintage emperor film isn't as bright of a white.
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  #30  
Old 03-04-2011, 04:06 PM
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

I have been a Remo user since the 60s and I have tried Evans products as well. I bought an Evans head for a snare, the one with the tiny holes around the edge, and the coating wore off that head on the first gig I played with it.

The Remo Emperor X that is on my 8" maple FF has lost some of the coating and that happened with the first gig I played with that head.

As a rule, I'm not real happy with Evans heads....except.....the EMAD II batter and reso head on my Master's Custom Extra bass drum. Man what a sound!!!!
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  #31  
Old 03-18-2011, 06:10 PM
piperdoog piperdoog is offline
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

Older post but thought I'd ask, Evans G2 coated or G2 plus coated, who has switched to these heads and love them, I'm an emperor guy but because of the coating issues I'm thinking of converting. Who has and is happy?
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  #32  
Old 03-19-2011, 03:47 PM
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

Hey Cdrums--yeah I was wrong. I thought it was 2- 7mm plies but it's 2- 7.5 plies...
my bad.
I thought my guy at the shop told me 7 the first time we talked about those heads, and I just talked to him about it the other day--missed this post.

I tried them, but they were a bit too mellow for me. I like the regular ones better now, or Coated Ambassadors.

I don't know about the suffix.
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  #33  
Old 03-19-2011, 07:40 PM
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

Dirty cymbals=dirty sticks=dirty heads. Just wash the cymbals don't polish or shine.
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  #34  
Old 03-19-2011, 08:29 PM
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Default Re: coated emporer problem

Quote:
Originally Posted by piperdoog View Post
Older post but thought I'd ask, Evans G2 coated or G2 plus coated, who has switched to these heads and love them, I'm an emperor guy but because of the coating issues I'm thinking of converting. Who has and is happy?
Well, I have Emperors on the batter of my floor toms and G Pluses on the resos. I like the sound. But I go for sound more than appearance and I like the Emporers a tad more than Evans G2 or G Pluses on the batter side, even if Remos chip here and there. Mine haven't chipped but if it's a real concern, try the Remo Vintage Emporor. I think they use the white mylar like the old ones in the 60s and 70s, so it would be not so noticeable.
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