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  #1  
Old 01-27-2011, 11:55 AM
Mr Orange Mr Orange is offline
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Default Floor tom woes

Hi All,
I have trouble getting my 16 floor tom sounding decent. It is a Sonor Force 2000 kit. I put on all new beaters an resos, Ambassador X and Clear Ambs.

It sounds like a tympani. Too much melody. I'm not totally happy with the 12 and 13 tom either but the 16 is the worst. I've tried most tuning settings (I think!). If I have to I guess I will replace the beaters, if you guys think they're the problem. If so I will try on the floor tom to start with.

I would like them punchy, not too much sustain and "melody".

Thanks for any input.

//Jörgen
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  #2  
Old 01-27-2011, 12:04 PM
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harryconway harryconway is offline
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Default Re: Floor tom woes

If you like "beater" (old head) sound, Ambassador X over Ambs. is not the way to go. Try Pinstripes ... or Evans Hydraulics
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  #3  
Old 01-27-2011, 09:09 PM
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Default Re: Floor tom woes

Tune the floor tom with a medium low (leaning more to the low side) batter head a a medium tension reso. Surprisingly it works well!
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  #4  
Old 01-27-2011, 10:10 PM
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Drums&Beer Drums&Beer is offline
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Default Re: Floor tom woes

Go with a pre-muffled batter head rather than the 12mil Ambassador X. When going for that sound I like a Coated Pinstripe or Coated PS3. Clear versions of these heads would also work fine as would an Evans EC2 or Hydraulic (as mentioned above).
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  #5  
Old 01-27-2011, 10:15 PM
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Default Re: Floor tom woes

Wow... too much tone... alright. Borrow some cast hoops and sharpen the edges.

Not to be flip., but if you don't like the kit, why did you buy it?
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  #6  
Old 01-27-2011, 10:58 PM
Mr Orange Mr Orange is offline
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Default Re: Floor tom woes

I've heard kits like this with good sound. (Unfortunately this was a while ago and I don't know what heads used.) I think it is more of a head and tune issue. I just expected a warmer sound from the Ambassador X's. It is a lot of sustain. I appreciate all input but getting another kit is not an option for now.

Thanks all.

Jörgen
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  #7  
Old 01-27-2011, 11:30 PM
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diegobxr diegobxr is offline
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Default Re: Floor tom woes

Hi Jörgen. Well, what others said is correct, heavier two-ply heads will fatten the sound, but however, there's nothing wrong with your heads and I think you can still try something before buying new heads.

You said you have Ambassadors X over Ambassadors, right? Well, those are top quality heads, single ply 12mil and 10 mil. Your Sonor kit is a great kit also.

I would do this:

1) Make sure you know how to tune properly. Log into youtube and look for "Bob Gatzen" tuning videos.

2) Re-tune your toms to their lowest possible pitch. Match the pitch of both heads, this is, make them both sound as similar as you can.

3) Get some O-Rings or make some yourself (I made mine) with an old head. These will dampen a hell of a lot of overtones. Then just place them over your batters and you'll notice the difference. If you're going to play live you'll have to take them off so the sound projects better, but for practicing purposes, they're awesome.

I own a kit with Remo UT heads, Ambassadors over Diplomats (thinner than yours), and they don't sound like timbales at all, you can make them sound very decent.

This should do it for now. After a while, change your batters for some Emperors or Pinstripes. They'll sound better and you won't have to use the O-rings anymore.

Cheers!
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  #8  
Old 01-28-2011, 02:28 AM
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bobdadruma bobdadruma is offline
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Default Re: Floor tom woes

A 16 inch tom was meant to sound a bit like a tympani.
When the first drum kits were configured that it what was in the minds of the creators.

I suggest a 12x14 floor tom for a more punchy sound.

Now, The 13 inch tom is another animal all together.
I find that the 8x12 inch tom is the easiest to tune.
A 9x13 has more sustain that an 8x12.
When you play these drums next to each other it is hard to get them right.
I like my 13 best when it is my only mounted tom and I am playing my 16x16 on the floor.
I like a 14 inch floor best with a 12 inch mounted tom.
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  #9  
Old 01-28-2011, 02:42 AM
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LukeSnyder LukeSnyder is offline
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Default Re: Floor tom woes

Quote:
Originally Posted by diegobxr View Post
Hi Jörgen. Well, what others said is correct, heavier two-ply heads will fatten the sound, but however, there's nothing wrong with your heads and I think you can still try something before buying new heads.

You said you have Ambassadors X over Ambassadors, right? Well, those are top quality heads, single ply 12mil and 10 mil. Your Sonor kit is a great kit also.

I would do this:

1) Make sure you know how to tune properly. Log into youtube and look for "Bob Gatzen" tuning videos.

2) Re-tune your toms to their lowest possible pitch. Match the pitch of both heads, this is, make them both sound as similar as you can.

3) Get some O-Rings or make some yourself (I made mine) with an old head. These will dampen a hell of a lot of overtones. Then just place them over your batters and you'll notice the difference. If you're going to play live you'll have to take them off so the sound projects better, but for practicing purposes, they're awesome.

I own a kit with Remo UT heads, Ambassadors over Diplomats (thinner than yours), and they don't sound like timbales at all, you can make them sound very decent.

This should do it for now. After a while, change your batters for some Emperors or Pinstripes. They'll sound better and you won't have to use the O-rings anymore.

Cheers!
Mr. Orange, I will second diegobxr's recommendations. Try what he's said, and you should be getting the punchy sound you're looking for!
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  #10  
Old 01-28-2011, 08:56 AM
Mr Orange Mr Orange is offline
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Default Re: Floor tom woes

Thanks all for taking your time to help me.

I will try to tune them as advised. I think I have a good pitch hearing and I think I know how to tune properly. I have some moon gel, I guess they do the same job as an O-ring? They're easy to move around and take away...

As for heads I invested a lot of money in my kit so getting other heads is OK if I get them to sound good. I'm looking into the PS3... get one for the FT and see where that gets me...

The sizes are 90's big and I like a "big" sound. But I find when drums get too melodic it clashes with the rhytm and groove aspect of drumming... And I'm aware of the fact that recorded drums in most cases are far from the original sound of an acoustic drum.

This is a great forum with a lot of knowledge!

//Jörgen
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  #11  
Old 01-28-2011, 12:23 PM
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harryconway harryconway is offline
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Default Re: Floor tom woes

Powerstroke 3, one of my favorite heads, for batter, on toms and kick. Basically an Ambassador (single ply) with a built on O-ring (richie ring).
Powerstroke 4, a 2 ply head (Emperor), with a richie ring built onto it.
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  #12  
Old 01-28-2011, 01:50 PM
Mr Orange Mr Orange is offline
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Default Re: Floor tom woes

...so putting a ring on my Ambassador X will get me similar result without spending money on new heads?

//J
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  #13  
Old 01-28-2011, 02:59 PM
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harryconway harryconway is offline
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Default Re: Floor tom woes

Well, it will at least point you in the right direction. You may still want to "muffle" your drum more .... and that gets you into Remo Pinstripe/Evans EC2 SST and Evans Hydraulic territory.
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  #14  
Old 01-28-2011, 03:11 PM
supermac supermac is offline
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Default Re: Floor tom woes

Try a Remo Emperor head for a thuddier, deader sound.
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  #15  
Old 01-29-2011, 01:02 AM
Drumolator Drumolator is offline
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Default Re: Floor tom woes

Are you playing by yourself or with a band (or both)? When you play with a band, the sustain/ringing is "absorbed" by the rest of the sound made by the other instruments. Muffled drums usually do not sound very good in a band situation. It is hard to accept, but the drums sound much different to the drummer than they do to everyone else. Good luck.
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