The Grand Master Buddy Rich

[aydee]

Originally Posted by Pocket-full-of-gold

LOL, Aydee.

My friend, I'm sure you are familar with the old saying "akin to feeding caviar to swine"?

The phrase is "pearls before swine" but I do know what you mean ; )

Have you looked at his blue period? Thats before all the cubist abstractions set in he got into all that funky distortion and poly rhythmic 3D multi dimensional effect that he was eventually known for.

He was quite a different artist then. ( Some of my favorite works by him are actually sketches that his did during that time.. very different but you can sort of see where he was going.. )

Yea, Barcelona would be great. I've never been there. Its the most artistic city in the world! ( I know you're thinking Florence or Paris, but naw... overrated, both places. Everything is in museums....doesn't count ) In Barcelona, there's art & music screaming at you form every corner. The architecture, the paintings, sculpture, flamenco guitars, gypsy music everywhere. Plus they've got the Guernica.

Lets make a plan. what say?

Polly, your turn, Lets double team him.

...

PS- I like the point you make about it being enjoyable to listen to stuff thats made up of passion and skill.

...

[Pocket-full-of-gold]

Originally Posted by aydee

Have you looked at his blue period?

Brilliant!! That's just how I feel when I see his work.......great art to slash your wrists to, perhaps. :-)

I've not been there either, it's always appealed though, as it's NOT the place in Spain where I'm expected to run with the bulls. But during this bleak Melbourne winter, I could be easily persuaded to board a plane for an educational trip to sunny Spain on a quest for art discovery........sound good? 'Cos really it's just a ploy to seat myself in a 'bull free' bar in warm weather.

[mattsmith]

Originally Posted by Fox622003

Yeah, it wasn't a very thought out comment. It's true that morals shouldn't get in the way of examining someone's playing. But personally, his playing never impressed me enough for all the hype he's got; and mentioning the fact that everytime you see him, he acts like such a self-important jerk, just seemed to reinforce the question of why is he so revered.

However, to be completely fair, I'm pretty sure your comment about playing behind and ahead of the beat being a myth, a false concept, gets to take the gold home this year ;) .

Fox.

See to me this is a totally acceptable post, although I don't agree with all of it. I think had you started with this tone everything would have been cool.

Originally Posted by Fox622003

That's exactly what I said, perhaps you didn't get the sarcasm.
Someone quated Buddy as saying something like he never played outside of the performances, and never practised. As someone who loves the instrument, how could he not play outside performances? So, he just watched TV and picked up girls? Only developed techniques live? Come on...

Fox.

Rich played for money almost every day of his life for over 60 years. You have to consider the context. Guys from his era played gigs every single day. They didn't play a 4 month tour, take a year off then go out again. With that lifestyle, why would there be a need to play outside of performances?

I'm also with Stan/ he wasn't my favorite either/I'm Tony Williams, Elvin Jones, DeJohnette, Bonham, Blakey, Morello/ although he's certainly the next guy on my own favorite meter. All my favorites are older or dead guys, although I also really like Blade, Carter Beauford and Nasheet Waits now. But whether he's your maxim hero or not, he's required listening and he's deserving of the highest end respect. I can also say without a doubt that learning a lot of his music made me a much better drummer. Some of you who make these sweeping generalizations should try that sometime. It might alter your perspective.

I think where Rich separated himself from others was in his way of mastering the intense technical concepts musically while still remaining exciting both live and on recordings. Believe it or not intensity is a wholly musical concept, and playing like he did while forwarding that kind of energy is a very special thing. Yeah you hear guys play with a lot of chops, but that broad electrical intensity just isn't there.

He was also the pioneer of big band outlining and to me set the bar for that style. Even a hero like Louie Bellson said it. So that's good enough for me.

I sort of laugh when I hear this continual stuff about the technical evolution of drumming because I just don't believe it. All I honestly hear now are technical variations on the Rich concept. And I think it's fair to say that I've heard my share of technical drumming. IMO Rich was the technical bar, and I'm not buying the he couldn't do today's odd rhythm, polyrhythm etc, etc. Anyone who doesn't think Rich couldn't have convincingly adapted to Dream Theater, or the Virgil Donati things is delusional.

That also includes the technical issues that surround many of the great metal guys I have a lot of respect for. To say Rich couldn't have done that had he decided to doesn't feel right to me. You want to hear the first blast beat? Go to the last drum solo of Channel One Suite from the Mercy Mercy album. That was one bass drum without any technical enhancement played at 3:00 in the morning in a Las Vegas casino after he had already played three shows earlier that night. That thing takes off like the frickin space shuttle. Seriously is there really anyone on the planet with that kind of energy in the tank now?

What further confounds me is how these same people who make technical assesments about Rich's playing are the exact same guys who claim on forums that they don't like so much technique. I always found that fascinating.

I think when considering Rich now it's a taste of the month issue. You see this with guys my age in jazz now who have adopted this busy hybrid version of Jack DeJohnette's playing where the music is sort of enveloped instead of pushed along and where bar lines are blurred not always for artistic purposes but to show to the other guys your age the hipness involved with you knowing how to do that, and are also the same people that say you're playing is boxy when you dare locate beat 1. These are the same guys who sit around the Pepsi machine in music school lounges deciding who does or does not get it. And playing like that sounds cool a lot of the time, but to say the other stuff is some inferior version of what's older is incorrect in my view.

I think Rich's legacy suffers from some of that.

[Boomka]

The laws of Universe revealed!

A Buddy debate and out come all the king's horses and all the king's men and even the king's lady.

Fantastic.

[Pollyanna]

Originally Posted by mattsmith

Believe it or not intensity is a wholly musical concept, and playing like he did while forwarding that kind of energy is a very special thing. Yeah you hear guys play with a lot of chops, but that broad electrical intensity just isn't there.

Yes. I can't explain the hows and whys but you know it when you hear it. Buddy's playing was electric and sometimes astonishing for its sheer intensity. I am sure that intensity is a direct reflection of his personality, warts and all. It was very honest and straightforward musical expression.

It also suggests a spontaneous, generous spirit. When he performed, he gave everything he had. This is not the kind of person who would mime a one hour show and slink away :)

Originally Posted by Boomka

A Buddy debate and out come all the king's horses and all the king's men and even the king's lady.

There was Buddy AND Picasso ... Boomka, I had no choice!

PFOG gave in so quickly that I now feel a little cheated ... I had the scent of blood and my prey ducked down a rabbit hole :)

[Deltadrummer]

yes, and that energy did not dwindle with age or heart attack. This is my favorite Buddy chart.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sBwigXsYA3I

I'd like to say its West Side Story or Time Being, which Stan turned me onto a while back, really cool chart. But I love, Love for Sale.

[JPW]

Originally Posted by mattsmith

I'm also with Stan/ he wasn't my favorite either/I'm Tony Williams, Elvin Jones, DeJohnette, Bonham, Blakey, Morello/ although he's certainly the next guy on my own favorite meter. ...

I think where Rich separated himself from others was in his way of mastering the intense technical concepts musically while still remaining exciting both live and on recordings. Believe it or not intensity is a wholly musical concept, and playing like he did while forwarding that kind of energy is a very special thing. Yeah you hear guys play with a lot of chops, but that broad electrical intensity just isn't there. ...

Nice point about intensity Matt. That is my favourite aspect of drumming these days. And that's propably the only part I like from Buddy Rich. But still to me Williams does it even better and it's not about the polyrhythms and the notey stuff. It's the sense of dark force of anxiety landing from the dark depths from his soul that I really enjoy. That's the main thing I look for in a drummer these days. How does he make me feel when I listen to him? How does he direct that energy to the band, how does the band respond to it? Really hard concept to talk about especially on an internet forum... This is the sort of stuff that is really hard to teach to anyone. Anyone can have chops because that's teachable and only takes time and dedication but how do you teach someone to put yourself in such metal state that these guys (Rich & Williams) goes through when they play? The absolute best compliment I have ever gotten for my own playing was this older horn player who said to me that it's really rare to see a drummer that is so emotionally invested. I think Buddy is a bit lacking on the emotional side of things (for me) but the intensity sure is there.

[jamest]

There's no doubt in my view that buddy rich was one of the absolute greatest there will ever be. I've been going back over the rudiments in his book recently, just great!
__________________

"When the going gets tough, the tough get going!"

[markthedrum]

I rarely throw genius out, but I think Buddy was genius. I know people will come out with Tony Williams, Elvin Jones etc... But for innovation on technique and just leaving drummers jawless til his death bed, like for instance, his left hand technique is being admired and loved to this day.

What do we think of his grandson Nick?

[Hercules]

What an awesome and inspiring drummer.

I loved the sonic boom he elicited from his toms - the crisp crack he got from the snare - the ultra bright cymbal ring - he had the touch and technique without peer in his time.

It's easy in this age to say this or that drummer today is as good - and if they are it's because it was pioneered by Mr Rich.

I would like to see a poll from the drummers that we all vote as the top 100 - who do they think was the best ever - I think we already know the answer.

The Grand Master Buddy Rich - what more need be said?

[aydee]

...

Stumbled upon this little beauty- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZ5eG...layer_embedded

- This is one of two surviving sound films of Charlie Parker playing (and certainly the longest; the other is only 52 seconds long). Until recently, this film was a rumor, and only still photos of it existed.

Watch Bird's amused expression as he watches Hawkins solo, and also how he cuts off the older Tenor man's solo. Although the musicians are filmed playing against tracks recorded earlier, it's still a fascinating and rare look at Bird on film, and a young Buddy in a quartet format. Sweet!

1. Ballad (Hawkins, Bird, Jones, Brown, Rich)

2. Celebrity (Bird, Jones, Brown, Rich)

Personnel:
Charlie Parker (as)
Coleman Hawkins (ts)
Hank Jones (p)
Ray Brown (b)
Buddy Rich (d)

...

[mattsmith]

Here's a great Buddy Rich video with tap dancer Eleanor Powell, when he was still with Tommy Dorsey. It's from the movie Ship Ahoy. Rich is seen at the beginning and the end. Some pretty remarkable stick tosses including one at the end that bounces perfectly off the floor.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WY9ty...&feature=share

[KirbyM]

I am always excited to show the percussion section at school videos of Buddy Rich. The kids are captivated by the man just like I have always been. I met Buddy when I was 17. It was without a doubt, the most memorable night of my life.

[GRUNTERSDAD]

Check the singles out at about 30 seconds.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=T7AW4NDnRE0

[scorch whammin]

Originally Posted by GRUNTERSDAD

Check the singles out at about 30 seconds.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=T7AW4NDnRE0

That's a great clip!..and of course fantastic drumming by Buddy!

[JohnW]

Some people forget the range of what Buddy could do. Sure, he could take your head off. But he could also do this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BEdhPfs8--Q

-John

[Beekeeper]

Buddy featured in this Slingerland advert from 1974...

http://pushblog.co.uk/2012/03/28/lennon-rich-jagger/

[alex-likes-drums]

Always been familiar with him but i stumbled across this video today and it blew my mind!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9esWG...eature=related

[Jeremy Bender]

Swinging with the great Harry James on a chart called "Cherokee." What a band! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-Zve...eature=related

[kimmartin64]

Please see my tribute to BR - "The Rotten Kid"

http://kimgmartin.com/index.php/videos/

thanks!

Kim