Ever get insulted for playing covers?

[SixStroke Bugada]

Do you guys ever hear from people who only play originals that playing covers is terrible?
I work in a local full-line music store where I'm the only "working" musician, and I get this attitude from my co-workers constantly. I'm in a gigging local original band, and I also hold down house and weekend cover gigs...
I'm wondering if it's a "guitarist" thing, I can understand that angle a bit more. It seems strange, but I get a feeling that it'd be different playing a cover set on a different instrument.
I'm just tired of the attitude that since I'm wanting to WORK playing music that my playing is less "artistic" or meaningful. I'm just of the belief that I should play as much as possible, and gig as much as possible. The more I play out, the more gigs/sessions I get. Versatility is key for me...
Is this weird? Anyone else ever hear or get this from anyone?

[bobdadruma]

I have met people like that before. Not to many, just a few who like the all original scene.

Play what you want to play.
Don't let the thoughts of others influence you.

Most club gigs require the playing of covers.

[Fuzrock]

I used to be one of those people. Now I'm in a cover band and I love it. Once I got to a certain age and realized I wasn't going to be a rock star, being in a cover band seemed logical. I still get to play AND I can make some money at it for once. There's quite a few tunes that challenge me to play outside of my comfort zone and after playing those songs for a while, I'm completely comfortable with them. I think playing in a cover band has made me a better player. Next time I'm in an original band I think I'll have more to offer.

[Kenny Allyn]

It's a youth culture thing trust me ...

Most of these guys think they are the next Alex Chilton with their composing abilities, when really they usually resemble the recipient of this remark from the movie Leatherheads.

"Being the slickest operator in Duluth is sort of like being the world's tallest midget, if you ask me!


With all due respect to both Duluth and folks of smaller stature

[SixStroke Bugada]

Yeah, often tell myself that they don't "get it"> Not that there is anything wrong with only playing originals;just they don't get the concepts. They also can't compose....really. I wonder if it's that they just aren't accepted into the scene of working musicians around town?

[azrae1l]

around here the cover bands are into 3 categories....

you have those that play covers but are less of a cover band and more more of a "version" or "rendition" band as i like to call them. they play songs people know but they put their own spin on it and give them their own sound, which are cool and not too many people give them a hard time, their usually pretty respected for their ability and creativity.

then you have the true cover bands, the ones that play every song note for note and a again do a pretty good job remaking a classic. these are usually composed of the older crowd that are playing songs from their youth, the classic rockers. generally appreciated for keeping the feel of the song and paying a tribute to great bands.

then you have the 95% of so called "cover bands" that are comprised of mostly high school kids and 20 somethings who play very sloppy music, usually the same 20 songs you hear every day on the radio and very poorly i might add, the guys that play the dirt hole bar for a warm pitcher of beer while the entire crowd sits outside in the smoking area because they play so terrible. also the same bands that populate craigslist and rag on any musician who has the slightest bit of talent. the ones who come sit next to you at the bar and tell you how great it is being a musician and how he has this huge contract in the works thats worth billions and says it so damn loud to make sure every other person in the bar can hear hoping it will impress people cuz their music sure didn't. you know the ones, guys who think any song known to man can be played on 3 bar chords alone and thats if they are good enough to play on more then 1 string, the ones who think if you sound bad just turn it up louder and it will solve it, tuning? who needs tuning when you can wear your sisters pants and eye liner, kinda people....

i made that sound like i hate cover bands huh? i actually don't mind cover bands but we have an over abundance over wanna be hacks that call themselves cover bands, those are the guys i hate.....

[SixStroke Bugada]

Originally Posted by azrae1l

around here the cover bands are into 3 categories....

you have those that play covers but are less of a cover band and more more of a "version" or "rendition" band as i like to call them. they play songs people know but they put their own spin on it and give them their own sound, which are cool and not too many people give them a hard time, their usually pretty respected for their ability and creativity.

then you have the true cover bands, the ones that play every song note for note and a again do a pretty good job remaking a classic. these are usually composed of the older crowd that are playing songs from their youth, the classic rockers. generally appreciated for keeping the feel of the song and paying a tribute to great bands.

then you have the 95% of so called "cover bands" that are comprised of mostly high school kids and 20 somethings who play very sloppy music, usually the same 20 songs you hear every day on the radio and very poorly i might add, the guys that play the dirt hole bar for a warm pitcher of beer while the entire crowd sits outside in the smoking area because they play so terrible. also the same bands that populate craigslist and rag on any musician who has the slightest bit of talent. the ones who come sit next to you at the bar and tell you how great it is being a musician and how he has this huge contract in the works thats worth billions and says it so damn loud to make sure every other person in the bar can hear hoping it will impress people cuz their music sure didn't. you know the ones, guys who think any song known to man can be played on 3 bar chords alone and thats if they are good enough to play on more then 1 string, the ones who think if you sound bad just turn it up louder and it will solve it, tuning? who needs tuning when you can wear your sisters pants and eye liner, kinda people....

i made that sound like i hate cover bands huh? i actually don't mind cover bands but we have an over abundance over wanna be hacks that call themselves cover bands, those are the guys i hate.....

I can TOTALLY see your point. I guess what I was more upset with was the hate for actually being out playing. I'm more in a "rendition band" that still hold pretty true. We play to crowds and people and things like that.....
I do know what you mean about the "95% cover bands" though.
I'm still not bashing anyone for playing out anywhere though. I understand your scene may get a little cluttered though...

About the age thing...we're all mid-20s and late-20s....

[azrae1l]

i actually ment "the other 95%" as in only 5% of our cover bands actually now how to play...

the 95% is around here, we have a completely different music scene then anywhere else in the world, i've really noticed this in the past 5 years or so. our music scene is very unfriendly to musicians, especially the more talented you get. it's almost a ritual here, once you can play decently you either move out of state or quite playing and get a day job.

what you play is really unimportant, rather it be covers, original, metal, jazz, country. doesn't really matter. if you enjoy it and you have fun then cool. almost any kind of musician is cool with me and i enjoy watching them.

but around here when somebody says "cover band" it means the hacks, everybody else is just a band. and the hacks out number the rest of us 1000 to 1.....

the age thing, not saying anybody in thier teens and twenties can't play, we have tons of very talented musicians who are younger then 20. the hacks on the other hand almost always are younger then 25 and usually give up before them. real musicans are very welcomed here and well respected but we have mostly hacks. i live in a very messed up state......

[mattsmith]

Originally Posted by azrae1l

then you have the 95% of so called "cover bands" that are comprised of mostly high school kids and 20 somethings who play very sloppy music, usually the same 20 songs you hear every day on the radio and very poorly i might add, the guys that play the dirt hole bar for a warm pitcher of beer while the entire crowd sits outside in the smoking area because they play so terrible. also the same bands that populate craigslist and rag on any musician who has the slightest bit of talent. the ones who come sit next to you at the bar and tell you how great it is being a musician and how he has this huge contract in the works thats worth billions and says it so damn loud to make sure every other person in the bar can hear hoping it will impress people cuz their music sure didn't. you know the ones, guys who think any song known to man can be played on 3 bar chords alone and thats if they are good enough to play on more then 1 string, the ones who think if you sound bad just turn it up louder and it will solve it, tuning? who needs tuning when you can wear your sisters pants and eye liner, kinda people....

I had to laugh because your rant rings so true. These are also the ones responsible for 95% of the youtube trolling. But it's not just limited to the super young. Add a demographic range of 15 to 30 more years and you will find the ones responsible for 95% of the trolling found on all music forums thinly disguised as innocent constructive criticism. For some reason that particular crowd really does draw a vocal segment of bad element guys who are just angry and vindictive in general.

Still you can't attack the genre. Covers perform the same role in popular culture as repertory orchestras in classical music. They archive a shard of the social consciousness for future generations. Personally I think doing covers is cool and a good learning experience. I can't see how learning more music hurts anything, even for those not wanting to pigeonhole themselves into that one thing.

[DrumEatDrum]

I'm laughing at azrae1 posts. Pretty spot on.

But to the OP. No. Even when I was deep into the original band scene and doing record company showcases and getting the "we'll sign you next Tuesday" speech (and yes, one A&R person said that), I always still knew other people who did the cover band thing, and many of us (including myself) had been in cover bands at some point.

I could see how it might be more of a stigma with guitar players over drummers, because for some people part of being a so-called "good" guitar player is writing your own riffs, which you're not doing in a cover band. No one expects the drummer to write their own riffs, so maybe the stigma doesn't carry over. But this is just a guess, I could be wrong.

[Bo Eder]

How come the insults come from the so-called-composer-guys who make absolutely no money playing music?

[bobdadruma]

Originally Posted by Bo Eder

How come the insults come from the so-called-composer-guys who make absolutely no money playing music?

People can be so transparent sometimes. I wonder if they know just how easy they are to see through?

[Bo Eder]

Originally Posted by bobdadruma

People can be so transparent sometimes. I wonder if they know just how easy they are to see through?

True. And I'm not saying you have to be making money as a musician to say anything I'd listen to, but I thought the whole idea was to earn some kind of living off of your chosen artform. That is the ultimate goal for me. As a drummer, I don't think I've played anything that hasn't been played before, but people generally think playing drums in any kind of band is cool.

[bobdadruma]

I have never gotten paid to play originals.
We do sneak some originals into our sets.
Some people do like them, but they would never sit there and drink all night if we didn't play
familiar tunes.

[mattsmith]

One of the main bands I'm in now is a cover band and it plays cool venues. The guitar player who leads it is 40+ years old, a good businessman and very strong player. It's just another experience. For a lot of us gigs like that pay the rent, while the originals bands pay the utilities, followed by the jazz gigs that pay for dinner.

When I joined this group a few weeks ago I got some grief from my jazz friends. Of course some of those slams came on Saturday nights at 9:00 when I was playing a gig and they were drinking a beer in the back because they didn't. In fact just check out when the toughest US critics and roughest forum guys make their appearances, and you will find it is always on weekends between 8:00-11:00 pm Eastern, Central, Mountain and Pacific time, when the ones they're slamming are playing gigs and they're not. Cover bands are an easy target because of the demographic Azrae described so well.

I just think that if you want to play all the time, you have to find enough bands to make that possible. Now I'm never going to wear costumes or dance around like an idiot, but I just think you can find good music in anything as long as you're in the company of good players, which I think has to be a prerequisite for playing in a cover band...good players only.

The guys who do all this forum talk about how I'll never whore myself just to play by doing covers are usually the kind of guys who wouldn't be working anyway, which means they are going to be doing another line of work sooner than later. My opinion only.

[KBadd]

I JUST NOW got home (1 hour drive) from a gig in Key Largo FL. The bands started at 3:00 PM......2 stages........each band got 30+ minutes to play.....one band stops then the next one starts on the other stage....about 20 bands total......Rock, Metal, Reggae, Pop, and Blues/Rock......the agent that booked us is GREAT!

Most bands here played originals and a few bands (including mine) played only covers, but we also do originals. We were/are tight! The crowd dug it. Nobody insulted us.

According to azrae1l we are a "Rendition Band". Yes, we do covers AND put our own flavor and spin on them. Question: Janis Joplin.....an original or a "cover singer"?? She made lackluster pop/blues songs by others, HUGELY Popular!! Bobby McGee and Ball & Chain. Was she NOT original? How about Joe Cocker? Or ....uhhh Elvis....the Stones....the Beatles? Not originals.....? You decide. Metallica friggin covered Bob Segar!!

[Pollyanna]

Originally Posted by azrae1l

you have those that play covers but are less of a cover band and more more of a "version" or "rendition" band as i like to call them. they play songs people know but they put their own spin on it and give them their own sound, which are cool and not too many people give them a hard time, their usually pretty respected for their ability and creativity.

then you have the true cover bands, the ones that play every song note for note and a again do a pretty good job remaking a classic. these are usually composed of the older crowd that are playing songs from their youth, the classic rockers. generally appreciated for keeping the feel of the song and paying a tribute to great bands.

then you have the 95% of so called "cover bands" that are comprised of mostly high school kids and 20 somethings who play very sloppy music, usually the same 20 songs you hear every day on the radio and very poorly i might add, the guys that play the dirt hole bar for a warm pitcher of beer while the entire crowd sits outside in the smoking area because they play so terrible.

Agree with others - great observations, Azrael.

Like Fuzrock, I used to play in originals bands and didn't care for cover bands. Current group would count as a rendition band and enjoying it heaps ... I get the almost the same amount of creative kicks as from playing originals, except the covers have a much higher standard of songwriting.

Since playing covers, I've never had an issue, but a lot of people don't always say what they think ...

[MikeM]

I don't think it's necessarily an age issue at all (maybe for some), and I really don't care about making money or making a career out of it (I have a career working for the man; I want to keep the drumming mine). Making money off drumming is not how I measure "success."

I'm 43 and I will only play in original bands because I don't want to be an imitator like that. Sure, I have my influences and on my own time, I'll don the headphones and surf the radio stations or my mp3 player for something interesting to play along to, but I'm not even a little bit interested in recreating someone else's parts in a band situation. Coming up with drum parts is where all the fun is.

[azrae1l]

ok i had a whole new rant typed out but i'm going to refrain.

cover bands can be great, it really comes down to the musician. if you play with skill and talent and work hard at it i think most any other musician will recognize this and respect you for it rather your playing covers or originals. there are many fine cover bands out there and i respect them for doing it. i have nothing against cover bands for being cover bands no matter how they choose to play them and the better they play them the more the audience is going to enjoy them.

play like a hack and well....... yeah.....

[J_Treez]

OP: You know who's from New Orleans and does a TON of covers? Kermit Ruffins.

[Coldhardsteel]

Originally Posted by MikeM

I don't think it's necessarily an age issue at all..

Oh, c'mon. It's the U.S., if you're under the age of thirty you're practically inhuman.

That was a stab at humor, by the way.

I suppose age plays a bigger part in things than a lot of people my age are willing to admit. With age comes experience, and only so much knowledge and skill can be acrued within a certain amount of time. So, unless a young man(or woman) is truly dedicated to music, then he won't get anywhere. But of course everyone would like to think that they're the one who has a chance.

ON TOPIC NOW

If those guys who make jabs at you for playing covers are really so bad, then why not invite them to open for your band once? Most likely they'd have to decline, assuming they're as skilled as a majority of people in their positions are(that is, unskilled), and it could be a double-blow because, still assuming the same thing, they haven't ever had an actual live gig in the first place.

[droveto]

Sure, it happens. For the most part though, those players throwing the insults typically aren't disciplined or versatile enough to play and learn 3 hours worth of cover tunes well.

[SixStroke Bugada]

Originally Posted by mattsmith

. For a lot of us gigs like that pay the rent, while the originals bands pay the utilities, followed by the jazz gigs that pay for dinner.


I just think that if you want to play all the time, you have to find enough bands to make that possible.
The guys who do all this forum talk about how I'll never whore myself just to play by doing covers are usually the kind of guys who wouldn't be working anyway, which means they are going to be doing another line of work sooner than later. My opinion only.

I agree, and what you said about pay for the different gigs is SO true. That's usually the EXACT wording I get "At least I'm not whoring myself". I just look at it as playing. About the Kermit Ruffins thing: All the New Orleans guys mix the covers in, it's almost part of the style. I wasn't trying to start the original/cover debate...
I just hate the attitude that since I play covers I'm inferior and less of a musician.

[Bo Eder]

Originally Posted by SixStroke Bugada

I agree, and what you said about pay for the different gigs is SO true. That's usually the EXACT wording I get "At least I'm not whoring myself". I just look at it as playing. About the Kermit Ruffins thing: All the New Orleans guys mix the covers in, it's almost part of the style. I wasn't trying to start the original/cover debate...
I just hate the attitude that since I play covers I'm inferior and less of a musician.

Wait a minute. I've never said At least I'm not whoring myself. I flat-out say that's exactly what I'm doing when I take any gig - even if it's an original band - because even in an original band, it's not all my idea, either. Drummers playing in original bands are also whoring themselves out, let's keep that distinction clear here. You're whoring yourself out in your regular job too, so does the argument that at least you aren't whoring yourself out in music even stand? One way or another, if you're not financially independent, you work for the man.

The thing about being able to make a living playing drums directly relates to this. Would I rather say, be digging ditches for 8 hours a day or be able to play my drums for 5 hours a night and make the same amount of money? Sounds like a no-brainer to me.

[bobdadruma]

The old line rings true. "Play What Fits"
If you get a Cover Gig, play the covers!
If you get an Original Gig, play what fits with the original music.

It was one of the first things that I learned when I became a drummer.
Go with the flow of both the band and the gig.

Feel free to add some of your own input, but for the most part, play what you get paid to play.

You would be a fool not to! A poor unpaid fool!

[flaminghotsauce]

I used to get a kick out of the guys that would come out to the clubs to watch me play, then assault me about selling out. These guys were NOT playing that particular night, they were paying MY salary.

We always used to tease them right back. We would ask which garage was the best one to play in....

I played in cover bands, original bands, and I was with a guy that tried to go national, and I've turned down a grammy award winner's gig. I wouldn't change a thing.

[Qasiel]

I'm currently in a covers band, and I really enjoy it. We got together for a friend's girlfriend's birthday party and stayed together since.
I've never been insulted about being in a covers band though, as we tend to play music that a large mixture of people will enjoy. Plus, learning covers is a great way to get into any instrument, so I find it to be a perfect platform.

[larryace]

You have to applaud the ones who create the original music that becomes part of the culture, without them, where would we be? They create the musical foodbank that the rest of the world feeds off of.
So many great musicians have done covers. Paying homage to the greats who, without their influence, many musicians wouldn't be who they became...what's wrong with that? Matt brought up a slam dunk point about the classical orchestras who perform Mozart are essentially doing covers. The ones who cover others songs on their own records...this benefits the original composer right? Nothing wrong there. Win/Win
I've come up with a just few original parts in my time, but those bands are dead along with the songs...
I like playing covers. So much great music has already been written, which our audience eats right up. I eat it up too.

Music has no right, no wrong. Anything goes. It's a free for all, because it's all HARMLESS!

Snobbery exists though. Whatever. Whatever feels right is what's right for you, it doesn't have to meet anyone else's requirements.

[Pocket-full-of-gold]

Originally Posted by SixStroke Bugada

Do you guys ever hear from people who only play originals that playing covers is terrible?

Yeah I've heard it before......I paid no attention then and with the benefit of age and a little more experience, I'd certainly pay no attention to it if I heard it again now.

Originally Posted by SixStroke Bugada

That's usually the EXACT wording I get "At least I'm not whoring myself".

Funnily enough, I've heard this one too. Age could well have a lot to do with it as I never heard it in later years.....only in my late teens/early twenties.

At the end of the day, I've played in numerous cover and original bands over the years. Whilst two of the original bands got plenty of work, we never actually "made it" so to speak and as a result, I know which gigs paid better and I know which gigs allowed me to get out and play every week.

As someone touched on earlier.....these comments so often come from musos who are clearly that busy that they find themselves at your covers gig, instead of on their own stage. I wonder why?

There is no such thing as a cover band in my book. Every single imaginable combination of notes has already been played a million times over so there is nothing ever truly 'original' ever being played by anybody.

It all comes down to how the spirit who is playing the instrument paints an aurally picturesque scene with the paints and brushes they choose to operate with. Not even the original artists on any given song can play EXACTLY what they played on any album they played on.

My thoughts on song construction and the individual musicians interpretation of any given song or part was radically changed when I started being immersed in jazz music many years ago. Learning jazz music taught me that it all boils down to one's individual voice being expressed in harmony with the other voices in the group. A communication of spirits through ESP that is shared with others through the physical manipulation of the keys, strings, or drum stick as played on upon the instruments of their choice.

There is no wrong or right in music whatsoever. There is only personal tastes for music which can come in 7,000,000,000+ forms.

If someone is going to come tell us that we suck or our playing is garbage or that we didn't express a musical passage to their liking. So be it! You can't win them all! Chances are that you've won a thousand fans for any single detractor, so it don't mean a gosh-dang thang at all at the end of the day.

I've learned from every single drummer that I have ever witnessed and everything I have ever heard them do was good. I have heard music that I didn't enjoy, however. usually, thats not the case though.

:)

[Deathmetalconga]

Originally Posted by Crazy8s

There is no such thing as a cover band in my book. Every single imaginable combination of notes has already been played a million times over so there is nothing ever truly 'original' ever being played by anybody.

That can only be true if you can pinpoint, more or less, when every single imaginable combination of notes has already been played, and if you can say that you have actually heard, or have some evidence, that every combination has been played. I don't think anyone could say something like, "Every single combination of notes was played (in Western music) by 1954, and I know that for certain" If you can't say that, then you can't say all possible note combinations have been played.

Plus, there are many different kinds of music, some yet to be discovered: many combinations outside the Western construction, music that consists of sound frequencies beyond the limited range of human hearing, etc.

I have been one of the people who looks down on cover band musicians. There are an infinite number of beautiful songs that no one will ever hear, because no musicians have yet rendered them. If I can use my skills and energy to bring a few hundred of those songs into existence during my time here, I will consider that a measure of a life well lived. To waste my time on music that is overdone, overplayed and overexposed is a shameful waste of talent. Instead of standing on the shoulders of giants, it's just hanging on the dingleberries of giants.

On the other hand, I respect anyone who finds a legitimate way to earn a living. While I might not hold cover music in high regard, I have a great deal of respect for anyone who puts food on the table with music.

[MikeM]

I don't know why people who do originals exclusively get the ire of those whose preferred drumming vehicle is covers. Obviously, originals-only bands aren't for everyone because there are fewer gigs and far less money typically. I don't have a problem with other people doing cover bands. I wouldn't play in one myself simply because there's no appeal in it for me. If there's appeal in it for you, then great, have at it.

But please don't be so quick in attacking or minimizing the efforts of those who choose the originals route. There are rewards to the originals route that the covers route could never provide - like when someone says they love this song or that song, or what a cool part that was, or when you hear yourself on the local college radio station, or when your band gets picked up by some little indie label that pays for your recordings. All those things have happened to me and it's an awesome feeling. Sure, we never made any money and no cover bands are out there covering anything we wrote, but so what? We have the recordings and the memories. And like I said, at 43 I'm still making those memories with new bands. I've never not been in a band that does all originals and I have a lot of recordings that I'm really proud of. If I were in a cover band, I can't imagine that I'd have any recordings like those that I have.

If you feel the need to make fun of our small crowds and lack of income, then you have issues and priorities that I'm completely unable to address or comprehend.

Originally Posted by mattsmith

The guys who do all this forum talk about how I'll never whore myself just to play by doing covers are usually the kind of guys who wouldn't be working anyway, which means they are going to be doing another line of work sooner than later. My opinion only.

I include myself on the list of those not interested in that type of "work". I'm already doing another line of work (and have been for 20 years) which takes care of my bills so I don't need the kind of work that you're referring to. I can afford to be as choosy as I'm comfortable with.

Originally Posted by Bo Eder

Drummers playing in original bands are also whoring themselves out, let's keep that distinction clear here.

I'm calling bullshit on this. When I'm in a recording studio or on a stage playing *my* parts in a song that *I* helped create, there is no "man". I'm paying for the studio time (or taking home 5 bucks for the night), as is the rest of the band. But I'm the boss, and the band collectively is the boss. Hard to call that whoring oneself out. We're doing what we want musically speaking, not what the bar wants or what people on the dance floor want and we don't take requests.

Originally Posted by Bo Eder

Would I rather say, be digging ditches for 8 hours a day or be able to play my drums for 5 hours a night and make the same amount of money? Sounds like a no-brainer to me.

Sounds like a no-brainer to me to me too, but I come to the opposite conclusion. I'd rather dig ditches to pay the bills (and cover studio time) that allows me to write and record songs (that perhaps no one will ever hear outside my little circle) than play Freebird even once.

Originally Posted by Crazy8s

Every single imaginable combination of notes has already been played a million times over so there is nothing ever truly 'original' ever being played by anybody

This is not even close to true. Are you trying to claim that by extension, all songs have already been written? Maybe in some esoteric Feynman sum over histories kind of way, but not in the real world that we live in and experience. I'd never heard any Mars Volta song until they were released, despite that the notes have all been around for centuries. Nobody had written A Day In The Life before the Beatles did, either.

[Pocket-full-of-gold]

Originally Posted by MikeM

But please don't be so quick in attacking or minimizing the efforts of those who choose the originals route. There are rewards to the originals route that the covers route could never provide - like when someone says they love this song or that song, or what a cool part that was, or when you hear yourself on the local college radio station, or when your band gets picked up by some little indie label that pays for your recordings. All those things have happened to me and it's an awesome feeling. Sure, we never made any money and no cover bands are out there covering anything we wrote, but so what? We have the recordings and the memories. And like I said, at 43 I'm still making those memories with new bands. I've never not been in a band that does all originals and I have a lot of recordings that I'm really proud of. If I were in a cover band, I can't imagine that I'd have any recordings like those that I have.

Nah, me old mate....that was not my intention when I made the ".....these comments so often come from musos who are clearly that busy that they find themselves at your covers gig, instead of on their own stage. I wonder why?", call.

It wasn't intended as a slight to those who are out there creating thier own stuff, by any measure. Moreso, that having straddled both sides of this fence, I think I initially saw more "negativity"(for lack of a better word), directed towards those who wanted to play covers (or should I just say, just wanted to play. Period), coming from those who saw themselves as "purists" and chose to "remain true to their artform".

It wasn't intended as a judgement call.....it was just the scenario as I personally saw here in Melb. Australia. The same guys who told me that I'd "sold out" for wanting to join a cover band and thus ensure that I actually got to play more than once a month, were the same guys who funnily enough, weren't working that night themselves....but were front and centre at my cover gig, telling me that I'd lost "artistic integrity" for playing Cracklin' Rosie.

I'm speaking personally (as I always do in my posts...hope that's just a given)....but I always thought it ironic that I have been accused of "selling out" on the odd occasion....when I just took the simplistic view that hey, "at least I'm playing." That pretty much sums it up.....I love playing drums.....covers/originals......who gives a toss?.....I'm playin' and I'm happy doing it.

[Bo Eder]

Originally Posted by MikeM

I'm calling bullshit on this. When I'm in a recording studio or on a stage playing *my* parts in a song that *I* helped create, there is no "man". I'm paying for the studio time (or taking home 5 bucks for the night), as is the rest of the band. But I'm the boss, and the band collectively is the boss. Hard to call that whoring oneself out. We're doing what we want musically speaking, not what the bar wants or what people on the dance floor want and we don't take requests.

Sounds like a no-brainer to me to me too, but I come to the opposite conclusion. I'd rather dig ditches to pay the bills (and cover studio time) that allows me to write and record songs (that perhaps no one will ever hear outside my little circle) than play Freebird even once.

So I see a nerve has been struck somewhat. I apologize. You can call it whatever you want: my BS, or your not compromising, but are you telling me that if your band cranks out a bunch of CDs of music nobody buys that you collectively wouldn't alter your approach somewhat to something they would like to buy? Or is the point of your originals band to produce music no one wants to hear? You may not be in it for the money, but it's rare to find an entire collectively (like a band of individuals) that is willing to go through the whole process of paying for making music for nothing at all. I call it bulls%$t that anyone would be in a band just for the theoretical exercise, wouldn't you?

I recall an old Pat Benatar interview years after Hit me with your best shot was a hit where she said that song was on a cassette in a bag that arrived to her and her band at the record label and an executive wanted them to record it. She hated it. But like I said, every career is a compromise and they did it, because they were told to. Should your band ever get to that level, you would not listen to people who managed you?

I'm cool with people who refuse to compromise, and who have jobs to pay the bills so they can say no to all kinds of things (I'm sort of in the same boat). But from what you're describing is that there is absolutely no money being made by your band and you're not willing to listen to others who may help your career along and get you in front of a bigger audience. Or were you planning on just paying for everything yourselves? The man takes many forms - and in this case it would be your audience, yes?

[Pollyanna]

Bo, I think get what Mike's saying. His first interest is what his ears tell him. I played in a band in 80/81 that was massively uncommercial. We purely pleased ourselves and had a ball.

After a while, though, we tired of blank, uncomprehending faces in the audience. We wanted them to go "Yaaay! Encore! Encore!" the way they would for other bands. So we changed singers and repertoire - dramatically. We still played mostly originals but the music was more melodic and "normal".

I still find myself torn between wanting to play music for its own sake but at the same time wanting others to find it pleasing. You can't please everyone so a lot of it comes down to finding your natural crowd, the people who like what you like and get what you're trying to do. Easier said than done, though.

[JT1]

I think playing covers is a very logical step when playing in a band. Most venues will want cover bands to bring the punters in and it's true that cover bands get paid way more on the pub circuit, especially if they are established. I am in an originals band however and whenever the subject of playing a cover or covers comes up I am always the first to say no.

I honestly feel that there are dangers in it. I feel that people will come just to hear the covers and won't be bothered at all when you play an original and that can be hard when you pour your heart and soul into writing something which you are proud of.

I feel much better playing original material and it's nice to know that there are people out there who really like our music and find it interesting. A huge part of getting the audience to like your music is to show you like your music, really getting into playing helps and if they sense you having a good time so will they.

I also personally don't like being shackled to what another drummer has written but this is just how one drummer feels, I say do what makes you happy.

[jer]

Buddy buys a Shelby. Puts hours into tuning it up, spends thousand on upgrades. Only drives it on Sunday mornings to take grandma to church.

Is he wasting his time by not entering it in races? Is he missing the point by not parading it up and down the main strip on a Friday night? Where is the glory of owning such a fine automobile? Buddy is clearly missing the point.

[shadowlorde]

Originally Posted by azrae1l

then you have the 95% of so called "cover bands" that are comprised of mostly high school kids and 20 somethings who play very sloppy music, usually the same 20 songs you hear every day on the radio and very poorly i might add, the guys that play the dirt hole bar for a warm pitcher of beer while the entire crowd sits outside in the smoking area because they play so terrible. also the same bands that populate craigslist and rag on any musician who has the slightest bit of talent. the ones who come sit next to you at the bar and tell you how great it is being a musician and how he has this huge contract in the works thats worth billions and says it so damn loud to make sure every other person in the bar can hear hoping it will impress people cuz their music sure didn't. you know the ones, guys who think any song known to man can be played on 3 bar chords alone and thats if they are good enough to play on more then 1 string, the ones who think if you sound bad just turn it up louder and it will solve it, tuning? who needs tuning when you can wear your sisters pants and eye liner, kinda people....

i made that sound like i hate cover bands huh? i actually don't mind cover bands but we have an over abundance over wanna be hacks that call themselves cover bands, those are the guys i hate.....

that is like .. every cover band in scranton pa ...

only thing is .. ... big college town ... everyone in there is so smashed if they can remotely recognize the song and say "i know that song it's on the radio 50x per day" they love it.
and also . all of these sloppy generic cover bands are on media 5 management .. which has to go through your set list and tell you which songs you are and are not allowed to play. they also have someone who checks out your image and if a band member doesn't look right.. he's out .... it's crazy.

.

[shadowlorde]

another thought... i don't have a problem playing covers ... my band plays covers and originals ... but we play priest, maiden, metallica, queensryche ... etc ...

it just seems like most cover bands have the same exact set list. (or at least in my area .. and that's prob because their all on media 5)
american girl
, sweet caroline (just so during the chorus they can yell "f-ing slut" ) ,
all of the punk versions of stuff like umbrella (under my umberella - ella - ella - eh- eh -eh ) green day, pink, bush, ...
you could literally bar hop on a saturday night and hear the same songs played in every bar.. usually with a singer that is sometimes in key .. most often not , never has a clear good tone .. always nasal whiny voice... and the band is generally playing a simplified version of the songs they are trying to pull off (hard to play correctly when your jumping up and down like your on a pogo stick the whole time.. but if you move around a lot no one cares how you sound)

[alparrott]

I really don't see the point of bashing anyone for what he or she decides to play. After all, didn't every single one of us start out on drums playing someone else's songs?

My last gigging band did a couple of covers in the middle of our originals set. One was an old punk song, Jawbreaker's "Kiss The Bottle". Great slamming song that we normally did as an encore or towards the end of the set. We did it more as a "rendition" version, not exactly faithful but with a playful arrangement (and of course our singer doesn't sound like he's gargling gravel). Memorably, one time playing at a bar in San Jose, a girl paid the $10 cover and came in for that one song because she heard the opening riff and loves Jawbreaker. She grabbed a brew and came up front and started singing along at the top of her lungs, and got the whole place going. It turned out to be one of the best shows we ever did.

As a kind of "in-joke" we also covered the Foo Fighters' "Big Me" at a few shows, as note-perfect as we could make it. Just prior to the song we would all reach down, grab a roll of Mentos, and pop one in our mouth, a la the commercial (and the video for the song). The crowd loved it, but bleh! Such nasty candy.

One of the bands I'm auditioning for in the next week or two is a classic/alternative rock covers act, who also has a couple of originals thrown in. I'm not complaining, because it looks like a little bit of pocket money on the side, and I'm between jobs. With the local music scene being what it is, that's what makes money. I'm also getting ready to audition for a moderately successful original singer/songwriter who does a roots rock/Latin thing, to satisfy that side of my creativity.

If someone looks down on me, I'd rather it be because they think my playing sucks, than what music I'm playing (or trying to).