Another gig story

[larryace]

Last Saturday night I had a gig at a really cool little atmospheric, intimate, medium sized coffeehouse in Phoenixville, PA. Good sounding room too. Our opening act just floored me, just an early 20 something chick w/ an electric piano playing the most creative original songs I've heard, ever. We should have been opening up for her. Wow what a treat. I had to buy her CD.
OK, so she goes off and the sound guy/emcee gets on mic and says the usual "Let's all give a big hand for Stephanie". Then he announces that the headliner (us) will go on in about ten minutes. I forget what the emcee said next that prompted our bandleader to say loudly from the audience..."Oh, don't worry about it, we'll be so loud, that ....something something something...I didn't hear that part cause I was cringing too hard. The emcee says, "Now isn't that a nice thought"....kinda mocking him....Ugh.
OK so we go on. Now this particular bandleader is just the nicest guy, but he has no "filter". The last 3 gigs we've done, he has always, on mic, mentioned something really stupid, about the musicians needing to go to the bathroom, to the audience. He's close to 60, and looks it, so the thought of incontinence was likely on the audiences collective mind...So we take the stage, and instead of praising Stephanie Nilles for a stunning performance, the first thing he says is, (not directed at anyone in particular) "Has everyone gone to the bathroom?" Then he turns around and looks at me, and on mic, loud as can be, he says...." Larry, do you need to go to the bathroom?" I was mortified. I just said, "No Paul, I'm good" and smiled. But inside I was like, "HOW COULD YOU SAY SUCH A STUPID THING YOU IDIOT"
Later, we had an unexpected surprise when our gorgeous guest singer (she did 3 tunes with us and had gotten off stage at this point.) brought one of her bandmates up, (she is in a great wedding band) another lovely girl, and they sang some kickin background vocals and even danced while we played Mustang Sally. I was loving it. LOVING IT. After the song ended, our fearless leader, instead of praising and thanking and gushing over them, gets on mic and says, Hey are you guys free the 26th? We're doing a BBQ....How insulting. It really put them on the spot, they smiled and didn't say anything an kinda slipped away quickly, and there was a litte pregnant pause while my man Paul waited for a response. Now mind you, he has the best of intentions, and thinks he's being cool, but he is just so way off. This is so wrong on so many levels, not thanking them, talking business on mic, kinda insulting them, and just not realizing how stupid he is sounding, and not acknowledging their generous contribution. I haven't said anything to him yet, but I'm going to be reading him the riot act.
I can with this particular guy too, without worry that he will can me, because, like I said, he is just the nicest guy. (I don't care anyway, this band only works maybe 6 dates a year, for crap pay, I play in it only because the guitarist is stellar and I never pass on an opportunity to play with a great musician) But I'm actually pretty hot about this. To the devil with being humble here, he's gonna get both barrels from me. To be continued....

[aydee]

Larry,

1) Please use the space bar occasionally ; ).....my head is spinning..

2) Maybe Paul should be recommended for the ambassadorship to Iraq..

3) Seems like the nice guy doesn't realize the 'damage' he is causing. Ya, makes sense to be direct with him... nicely?

[Pollyanna]

Singers often say stupid things. I have never been in a band where the singer didn't say something that made me cringe. That's what happens when you are on the spot in front of a bunch of people and having to ad lib in order to connect with and entertain them.

Singers are forced to put themselves out there simply because their instrument happens to be their voice. It doesn't necessarily follow that they are suited to public speaking, although practice helps. According to surveys, public speaking (even with a crib sheet) is amongst people's greatest fears, let alone ad libbing. So the frontperson sees a hole - like an uncomfortable gap in a conversation - and they have to fill it. The mouth opens impulsively before the brain engages and in goes the foot. Occupational hazard.

Even our current singer, who has MC'd and hosted karaoke countless times sometimes says the stupidest things. Last week, after actually doing a reasonable performance of a song we got applause and cheers at the end. Glenn rabbits on for a while, gets a few laughs. Cool. Then he says, "... and tell your friends how good we are".

WTF??????!! I felt like committing hari kari with a drumstick right there and then to escape the humiliation! lol. I wanted to say, "No Glenn, let the audience tell their friends The Truth - that sometimes we sound good, sometimes we sound ok, and sometimes we sound like crap. Better still, let the audience tell their friends whatever they want to say, not what we want them to say.

Alas, sometimes singers get an attack of verbal diarrhoea, maybe for the same reason we occasionally play some groove-sapping fill instead of holding it down. And, remember, that horror I just described was perpetrated by an experienced public speaker and comedian.

So be gentle with your singer. Don't be brutal. Understand that it's not easy to front a band; they put themselves out there a lot more that us, comfortably hiding behind a kit.

You are in a fabulous band with a guitarist that would make any band sound good. Your vocalist has a great voice and plays excellent blues harp. My advice is, don't let the red curtain fall. Chat with him and gently point out a couple of things to reduce the worst of his excesses. Maybe he could prepare some jokes beforehand? That reduces the risk of having a monent of madness.

You can expect at least one or two gaffes per night from singers who are trying to engage with the audience, especially if they don't gig every week. If most of the patter isn't too inane, audiences quickly forget the gaffes once the band launches into the next song.

THAT's what they remember most unless the singer is a real, um, "self-pleasurer". I doubt that's the case with your frontman. That's my two (five?) cents' worth.

[keep it simple]

Superb advice from Polly. I do hate it when the singer makes the band look stupid. I once shared a stage with a singer who had clearly rushed out of the toilet & straight onto the stage without completing his tasks fully. He ended up with a map of India on his trousers!

[Pollyanna]

Originally Posted by keep it simple

Superb advice from Polly. I do hate it when the singer makes the band look stupid. I once shared a stage with a singer who had clearly rushed out of the toilet & straight onto the stage without completing his tasks fully. He ended up with a map of India on his trousers!

ROFLOLOLOLOLOLOL!!

>^..^<

[larryace]

Aydee, spacebar point taken. I was on a rant. I'll try to be nice, and not personally attack him, but I have to say what's on my mind.

Polly, this is not the band you've heard. I never posted a recording of this band. He wasn't nervous, he is cool and relaxed, this is his home turf and feels very accepted. It's like he's on E or something and is creaming his jeans because he thinks he is a big dog in this venue.
He has no filter.

I'll let you know what transpires, stay tuned...

[dairyairman]

i could probably let the bathroom remark go, but he really should have acknowledged and thanked the artist who came before you and the guest artists.

btw, can you post a link to that very talented stephanie's myspace or whatever she has?

[jer]

A pause in the music while a guitarist switched out axes due to a broken string, the signer announces:

"Filling gaps, that's my specialty"

Another favorite of mine (different band), playing in front of a couple hundred people at a well known club:

"This song's so good, you're gonna want to ____ my ____." (he got the gears hard for that one).

I do have to say that it's probably a good thing I don't have a mic, I know for sure I'd say things that I'd probably regret.

[aaajn]

Originally Posted by keep it simple

Superb advice from Polly. I do hate it when the singer makes the band look stupid. I once shared a stage with a singer who had clearly rushed out of the toilet & straight onto the stage without completing his tasks fully. He ended up with a map of India on his trousers!

Yep, Me too. That was hysterical

[Muckster]

I was playing with a rock band recently and wanted to do a little known Black Sabbath tune. We worked it up and added it to the set list. The first night we played it, the singer told the audience: "this next song will probably suck...our drummer wants to play it."
He went on for about two minutes getting the audience to anticipate a horrible tune.
I could haver killed him but the crowd loved it.

I made it a point to count off the next tune with my Swish cymbal everytime he tried to say something the rest of the night.

[rogue_drummer]

Having stage presence is one thing, being a total doofus is another. Sometimes it's best to not only rehearse the songs in the set list to perfect them, but also rehearse what will be said during a performance between songs and how the songs will be set up for the audience. Work at improvisation, but don't become a "game show host" and insult the audience or anyone else in the room. And don't talk down to or talk ugly about someone else. Audience members get enough of that in everyday life, they come to hear good music and unwind and have a good time.

A good filler sometimes is to tell the history of a song, who write it, how the band came to like to play it, the band's interpretation of it, etc. My .02 cents.

[Pollyanna]

Originally Posted by larryace

Polly, this is not the band you've heard. I never posted a recording of this band. He wasn't nervous, he is cool and relaxed, this is his home turf and feels very accepted. It's like he's on E or something and is creaming his jeans because he thinks he is a big dog in this venue.
He has no filter.

Oh, sorry Larry, I didn't realise you were playing with more than one stellar guitarist!

By all means beat the stuffing out of Paul with my blessings ;-)

[larryace]

I decided to email him instead of phoning him, that way I can be more concise.

Dairyairman, the bathroom comment is the center of my beef, and since I'm going there, I'm gonna basically tell him what and what not to do. Stephanie Nilles has a myspace page, www.myspace.com/stephanienilles

Do acknowledge the opening act, and ask for some more acknowledgement from the crowd for the opener, she really deserved it and it was wrong he didn't recognize her.

Do thank the surprise guests repeatedly, and tell the crowd how wonderful and sexy they are, and anything else positive.

Don't EVER talk about the bodily functions

Don't talk business over the mic

Be grateful for everyone else

Introduce the band at some point during the night

And don't ever embarrass me again, or I'll screw your songs up. (not really)

One little bit of redemption I got, when I went to sing my song, Hootchie Kootchie Man, he asked me what the riff was on mic. Actually that was dumb on his part, made him look unprepared, but it allowed me to be "more than just a drummer" when I gave him the riff,
C D E C A, he said, C D E A? I said "no C D E C A"

[bobdadruma]

I've killed for less! That is why I own this little toy!
Hint, Put lots of Rid-Ex on the body when you bury it! I like to plant perennials over the grave! As you can see I have two pine boxes on the shelf ready to go!
Add Smile here!

[Fishnmusicn]

Originally Posted by bobdadruma

I've killed for less! That is why I own this little toy!
Hint, Put lots of Rid-Ex on the body when you bury it! I like to plant perennials over the grave! As you can see I have two pine boxes on the shelf ready to go!
Add Smile here!

HaHaHaHaHa...Good one............

[larryace]

Bob you're a riot!

OK peeps I set the email, her it is



Paul, I was mortified when you asked me if I needed to go to the bathroom on stage. Don't ever do that to me again. Obviously someone needs to tell you about how you came off on Friday. You were an embarrassment to put it lightly.

First of all, when Stephanie was finished and went off, and Barron went on mic, I forget what he said, but you replied, Oh don't worry, we'll be so loud that something something something. I don't know what you said because I was cringing too hard. Why would you say such a thing? Paints a very unpalatable picture. But you weren't done, not by a long shot.

When we took the stage, you should have acknowledged how stunning Stephanie's performance was and asked the audience for a hand for her. She really deserved it, but even if she didn't, you ALWAYS say that anyway. You really dissed her by not saying a word. Social graces anyone?

Instead, you said something on mic like, did everyone go to the bathroom? I was cringing so hard I could have imploded

And then you singled me out and asked me if I needed to go to the bathroom. The cringing upgraded to mortifying, WTF were you thinking? Do you have any concept how humiliating that was for me? I'm still very hot over that. I'll say it again. Don't ever do that to me again, got it?

NEVER mention going to the bathroom on mic, you've done this on the last 3 gigs, did you realize that? What is the obsession? Lose it. It's pathetic.

Then you asked me for the riff to Hootchie Kootchie Man. On mic. It made you look like a dope. If you didn't remember you could have whispered to Dave to give it to you. As the bandleader, you have certain responsibilities to say certain things at a show. Like recognizing everyone for starters. The opening act. Sydney. Her friend. Barron. The audience. Introduce the band at some point. You did none of this.

Then when Sydneys friend got up and did background vocals and danced w/ Sydney, did you thank them and ask the audience for a big hand? No, you said, "hey what are you doing the 26th, we have a BBQ". How insulting to them. Never talk business on mic, cmon do I really need to tell you this? You should have been more aware of how that made them feel. You really put them on the spot. After they so graciously elevated that song. You should have been gushing how wonderful and gracious they were for contributing. Maybe give Sydneys band a plug?


It's not all about you Paul, it's about everyone else, especially the audience, Stephanie, Sydney, her friend, Barron, the staff, maybe something about tipping them?....You really came off like a self centered jackass.

I have to call them like I see them, cause I can't lie when it comes to music and our performances.

Nicole said we were way loud, just like you predicted. (she was referring to you and Dave)

I hope this opens your eyes to some things.

L.

Can't wait for the response, hee hee

[bobdadruma]

The singer in the Blues band that I play in likes to say this at EVERY GIG that we play! "This next song is in the key of C for Bob Da Druma!" (keep in mind that I don't sing)
He is in the pine box on the left! The box on the right is for any club owner that tries to pay us with a check!

[Pollyanna]

*makes note to self* ... don't EVER annoy Larry and, especially, don't get on the wrong side of Bob!

If I found a msg like that in my Inbox I'd need a prescription for tranquilisers and antidepressants. If it's not a bridge-burner the guy is either a saint or has a hide like a rhino. Interested to see how it pans out.

[PacifRick]

Exciting! (sound of popcorn popping in background)

[bobdadruma]

I don't know Lar, The email thing is kind of impersonal. To late now! What's done is done! Well written though! He knows how you feel now that's for sure. I hope that he doesn't kill himself! It may have been better to have had a sit down with him. I probably would have said something to him that night on a break or something. Then he could have apologized to the other people and all would have been better.
I play the role of the fall guy in the blues band. I act like I don't have a clue. Our singer picks on me on stage and it is part of our act. We rehearse it. He calls me grandpa and says things like we're gonna take a break now so that Bob Da Druma can change his depends! Or Bob Da Druma was late getting here tonight, He got lost while using GPS. The audience eats it up. I'll purposely drop a stick out in front of the kit near the beginning of a song and keep on playing like I don't even realize it. Our singer picks up the stick, Shows it to the crowd, stops the band and says, "Bob Da Druma, I think that you lost something!" I say, "Oh! Is that mine!"
Our singer also has the social graces to always thank and compliment people and do the right things. There is a difference between being funny and being rude.

[con struct]

Thanks for the Myspace link. I just listened to Stephanie Nilles' music. It's original, quirky, very hip and I sent her a friend request. I intend to look her up the next time I'm in New York. She's the kind of person I like to support. Her song "Jump Monk / A Constellation of Endeavors" is way hip, and she can play!
Your bandleader sounds like a totally clueless old frustrated classless dickhead. But look, it goes with the territory. He was probably intimidated, that's all. She's going places, he's not.
If I were you I'd get in touch with Ms. Nilles and tell her how much you dug her. She sounds like someone to stay in touch with.
Rule #1 in this business: get close to the people who are going somewhere and ditch the ones who aren't. I'd love to play the drums for Stephanie Nilles.

[mrchattr]

Where were you playing in Phoenixville? I love that town! Such a great scene. Sorry about your singer...that sucks. I'm checking out your opening act right now, though...

[keep it simple]

I checked out Stephanie too. Great lyrics and really good piano. Much more impressive though is Bob's tractor. Bob, I WANT YOUR TRACTOR!

Can't wait to see the reply to Larry's mail.

[Pollyanna]

Originally Posted by keep it simple

I checked out Stephanie too. Great lyrics and really good piano. Much more impressive though is Bob's tractor. Bob, I WANT YOUR TRACTOR!

Can't wait to see the reply to Larry's mail.

Who are you planning to inhume? :)

Shame about Stephanie. Very talented but it's hard to forgive a performer who doesn't use a drummer. I mean, is the woman completely MAD???? :)

[aydee]

Sorry to let y'all down but I'm starting to feel bad for Paul already..laying up all cut up in pieces, in Bob's garage, smelling of pinewood, with the India map on his trouser front.... sob...sniffle..

..this story is getting very Peter Rabbit...

[keep it simple]

Originally Posted by Pollyanna

Who are you planning to inhume? :)

Shame about Stephanie. Very talented but it's hard to forgive a performer who doesn't use a drummer. I mean, is the woman completely MAD???? :)

Would you use a drummer after reading this thread???

I'm not planning on inhuming (good word Polly) anyone right now. I have plenty of grizzly tools in my garage for that already. I just love BOB'S TRACTOR. My mini tractor has just given up on life and I need another one. The old one isn't as good as BOB'S TRACTOR!!! Damn, that's a good looking toy, sorry, useful implement.

[Pollyanna]

Originally Posted by keep it simple

Would you use a drummer after reading this thread???

I'm not planning on inhuming (good word Polly) anyone right now. I have plenty of grizzly tools in my garage for that already. I just love BOB'S TRACTOR. My mini tractor has just given up on life and I need another one. The old one isn't as good as BOB'S TRACTOR!!! Damn, that's a good looking toy, sorry, useful implement.

Sure, I'd use a drummer. I love drummers! Just that I'd be very, verrry careful not to say the wrong thing ;-)

I can't take credit for "inhume". That's what the professional assassins did in Terry Pratchett's Discworld novels. Pleased to see no inhumantions on the horizon tho'.

Eagerly anticipating the next chapter in this tale.

When I was playing keys I emailed a drummer who we'd auditioned that we'd keep looking. I thought I did it politiely but in his next email told me to"... fornicate off". I got back to him to say he was being very rock'n'roll :) He apologised after that. After all, men over 50 don't do that sorta thing, do they? lol Will Paul react that way? Or will be cop it on the chin? Will he lock himself in his room with a bottle of Qaaludes? Drum roll ..................

[larryace]

So here's the reply:

Please calm down Larry.
When you're the front man you're not always right.
I would love to come off like Frank Sinatra but I can't guarantee that I wo
n't make mistakes or act in a way you feel is inappropriate.


I had no idea that the bathroom comment which got a laugh on March 8th of l
ast year offended you so. Had you said something then it would not have hap
pened again.


I apologize for upsetting you but frankly I really don't know how you fe
el so justified in judging me.
I'm really going to have to think about your email for a while.
-P-


I feel I did him a service by doing this. Like telling your friend they have bad breath or something

Stepanie Nilles, classicly and jazzily (?) trained, played since age 6. She drives all over the US and sleeps in her car a lot. Totally dedicated. Live, you are trying to hang onto every word because she has a lot to say, and it all intelligent and funny and very real.
Mr Chattr, it was the Steel City Coffee House. Phoenixville is a cool town, great vibe.

She doesn't need drums, plus she is such a master of time, and she slows down and speeds up to create effects in her songs, so with her masterful playing, she needs nothing else

[Pollyanna]

Thanks for the update, Larry. On first pass Paul seemed to pick up more on your tone and didn't seem to absorb your message about acknowledging Stephanie and the backup singers, which I think were the worst faux pas.

Hopefully he will re-read your email when he thinks about it and pick up on the content rather than the form.

Nah, everyone need drums! (I'm just yankin ya chain, Larry :)

I suspect that he will be more careful with his stage patter next time ... it would be interesting to see if that affects his flow, tho it would probably be hard to do worse than the last gig. The only way for him from here is up!

[keep it simple]

You've certainly put a mark in the sand Larry. Good for you! That said, I don't think he's taken it too well. Hopefully he'll take your points on board and see the positives in your message. If he reacts the other way, you or he may have just lost the gig. If he refuses to change his ways then maybe that's for the best. I hope it works out well for you.

I still really want Bob's tractor!

[dairyairman]

oh boy! your band leader sounds pissed! let the band drama begin! personally, i hate band drama, but sometimes you have to stand your ground and i think you did that pretty effectively.

i would continue focusing on the specific things that bother you and avoid getting drawn into a general, wide open conflict where insults are flying and everyone is mad. if you can do that, then you have a chance of working this out.

about that stephanie nilles person, she is seriously good! i really enjoyed listening to her singing. she's got that olde tyme jazz thing going on and she pulls it off really well. she kind of reminds me of ani difranco, who i like a lot. i don't know why she doesn't use a drummer though. some of her songs are begging for a little percussion. i would love to have a chance to back her up. i think i could lay down some tasty brush work with some dark sounding cymbals that would really sound cool!

[aaajn]

Well at least he said he would think about it. This thread reminds me of my job. I get paid to tell people to stop behaving badly. It always drains your energy. One more note, you can always get a vibe from any group, either they respect each other or they don't. Making fun of each other sets up a vibe in the audience, and from the sounds of it, you don't have a mic to banter back.

Good job and stomping him but I am not confident he will change. Although stranger things have happened.

[rogue_drummer]

Man, good luck! Sounds like he's playing the "old age and experience" card on you. Some people just get off insulting other people or making other people feel bad so that thay can build themsevles up, or think they are buidling themselves up.

You've put your foot down, so to speak, and told him to start behaving like a mature leader, instead of an immature infant. I agree, bathroom humor had its place in junior high and primary school. Why does he think that is funny?

[bobdadruma]

I almost forgot about this gag, A few years ago after the singer in the Blues band and I did our usual pick on poor old Bob Da Druma routine, I snuck up on him and I pulled his pants down to expose boxers with giant hearts on them. It was all pre arranged of course! It was Valentine's Day. Classic Slapstick!
Sometimes he leaves the stage after picking on me, I fake that I fart on his mic with sound effects that he triggers from off stage.

[SOGdrummer]

Hey Larry, sounds like you are in my backyard lately...Steel City is a great place and I have played there and at Chaplins in Spring City...Steel City has the atmosphere for sure.

PM me next time you are going to be in the Phoenixville/Spring City area...

Never had a "band leader" make inappropriate comments, but have had several other members of the band come up with some doozies from time to time...put up with it if it won't cause permanent damage, deal with it right away if it really puts the band or you in a bad light.

Working with others, playing with others...always interesting!

Jack

[larryace]

Yea, I don't think Paul got my point on first read.
But I know he's thinking about it hard, if I know Paul. I actually did him a service, and if I know Paul, he's thinking hard about it, because he doesn't want to offend anybody. That's another reason I did it by email so he could re read it. I hope he takes this stuff to heart, it's just common courtesy. I just gave him about five minutes worth of stuff to say on mic (acknowledging everyone) I spelled it out for him. If he doesn't change, then I did what I could.
SOG I'm playing Chaplins in November sometime, haven't nailed a definite date yet, what a great room. We opened for Deb Callahan last December there. My recordings in the playing consolidation thread are from Chaplins from the show I just mentioned