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  #1  
Old 11-03-2009, 12:38 AM
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Default Can someone explain this shuffle to me

Take a look at this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ntYen...rom=PL&index=3

I'm sure some of you will have seen it before. At 53 seconds, he starts a nice "Rosanna" style shuffle. However, at about 1:12, he breaks into a fill while maintaining the shuffle, and then at 1:15 he shuffles on the ride, with the left hand moving up onto the hi-hats.

I can't quite work out the fill and the ride/hats shuffle. Is he keeping up the triplets on the fill, and literally playing what he would usually play on the hi-hat, on the toms instead? And is it the same for the ride?

I'd love to try this out if only I could figure out what he's doing.

Any help appreciated, thanks.
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Old 11-03-2009, 12:58 AM
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Default Re: Can someone explain this shuffle to me

That's the Jeff Porcaro's Rosanna shuffle, I don't know how to explain it technically though but Jeff does it pretty well in his video which is in his DW page, it helped me very much when I was trying to play it.
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Old 11-03-2009, 01:01 AM
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Default Re: Can someone explain this shuffle to me

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Originally Posted by Mighty_Joker View Post

I can't quite work out the fill and the ride/hats shuffle. Is he keeping up the triplets on the fill, and literally playing what he would usually play on the hi-hat, on the toms instead? And is it the same for the ride?

I'd love to try this out if only I could figure out what he's doing.

Any help appreciated, thanks.
A quick look/listen says that he's simply taking the same patterns he played on the Hihats and Snare Drum and putting the right hand on the Ride Cymbal and moving the left hand notes between the Snare Drum and Toms.
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Old 11-03-2009, 01:16 AM
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Default Re: Can someone explain this shuffle to me

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Originally Posted by Bonz0 View Post
That's the Jeff Porcaro's Rosanna shuffle, I don't know how to explain it technically though but Jeff does it pretty well in his video which is in his DW page, it helped me very much when I was trying to play it.
Yeah, I know that part. Sorry, I should have specified, it's from 1:12 onwards where I lose track a little bit. Thanks though.
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Old 11-03-2009, 01:57 AM
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Default Re: Can someone explain this shuffle to me

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Originally Posted by Boomka View Post
A quick look/listen says that he's simply taking the same patterns he played on the Hihats and Snare Drum and putting the right hand on the Ride Cymbal and moving the left hand notes between the Snare Drum and Toms.
I 2nd that. He's just "orchestrating" the same pattern. Granted, it's a killer pattern, with a ton of ghost notes. Plus you have to maintain a great pulse. One of the coolest beats in town.
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Old 11-03-2009, 03:43 AM
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Default Re: Can someone explain this shuffle to me

Check this out and then move it around the drums. It's more of a learning video and breaks it down nicely. There is a nice slow version and then up to speed. IMO this shuffle clip has a much smoother feel than the clip you posted. Sorry if this is out of place, it really has helped to demystify this pattern for me and I thought I would pass it along.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z_n8cb6Op1g

Jiva
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Old 11-03-2009, 09:20 AM
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Default Re: Can someone explain this shuffle to me

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Originally Posted by jivadayadasa View Post
Check this out and then move it around the drums. It's more of a learning video and breaks it down nicely. There is a nice slow version and then up to speed. IMO this shuffle clip has a much smoother feel than the clip you posted. Sorry if this is out of place, it really has helped to demystify this pattern for me and I thought I would pass it along.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z_n8cb6Op1g

Jiva

Excellent video, thanks. So I guess I'll get to orchestrating that pattern then :)
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Old 11-04-2009, 07:26 PM
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Default Re: Can someone explain this shuffle to me

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Originally Posted by Mighty_Joker View Post
Excellent video, thanks. So I guess I'll get to orchestrating that pattern then :)
Can someone explain to me EXACTLY what he's doing with his left hand? When I shuffle the hh/cymbol with the right hand, my left hand 'wants' to do the ghosts as triplets (sloppy as they are at this point). Is this correct? If so, I've got a long ways to go...
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Old 11-05-2009, 12:10 AM
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Default Re: Can someone explain this shuffle to me

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Originally Posted by intheruff View Post
Can someone explain to me EXACTLY what he's doing with his left hand? When I shuffle the hh/cymbol with the right hand, my left hand 'wants' to do the ghosts as triplets (sloppy as they are at this point). Is this correct? If so, I've got a long ways to go...
The left hand keeps up doing what it's doing in the basic half-time shuffle.
-3-....-3-...-3-....-3-...-3-
RLR RLR RLR RLR RLR

As far as I've discerned from the above replies, this pattern is kept up no matter what the right hand is doing. Could any shuffle master confirm this is what he's doing?
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  #10  
Old 11-05-2009, 12:20 AM
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Default Re: Can someone explain this shuffle to me

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Originally Posted by Mighty_Joker View Post
The left hand keeps up doing what it's doing in the basic half-time shuffle.
-3-....-3-...-3-....-3-...-3-
RLR RLR RLR RLR RLR

As far as I've discerned from the above replies, this pattern is kept up no matter what the right hand is doing. Could any shuffle master confirm this is what he's doing?
I am by no means a shuffle master, but this is exactly what my R&L hands are doing when playing a half time shuffle. I then just alternate where the bass drum beats are in order to change the feel i.e Bonham shuffle, Rosanna shuffle etc etc.
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Old 11-05-2009, 12:33 AM
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Default Re: Can someone explain this shuffle to me

Hey MJ, thanks... but I'm not sure what you meant... scuse' me for being so thick. I'm wondering if the left hand is duplicating the right hand 'shuffle' ride... ah one ah TWO ah three ah FOUR ah... OOOORRRRR, is it playing the alternating notes of a triplet (the 'ands' and 'twos' for a rh trips - counted one and uh two and uh...). OR IS IT SOMETHING COMPLETELY DIFFERENT???? A great feel and grove it is! And damn it... I wanna' learn it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Old 11-05-2009, 12:36 AM
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Default Re: Can someone explain this shuffle to me

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Originally Posted by intheruff View Post
Hey MJ, thanks... but I'm not sure what you meant... scuse' me for being so thick. I'm wondering if the left hand is duplicating the right hand 'shuffle' ride... ah one ah TWO ah three ah FOUR ah... OOOORRRRR, is it playing the alternating notes of a triplet (the 'ands' and 'twos' for a rh trips - counted one and uh two and uh...). OR IS IT SOMETHING COMPLETELY DIFFERENT???? A great feel and grove it is! And damn it... I wanna' learn it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

No, the left hand stays ghosting on the snare (with the occasional foray up to the hi-hat). It is the right hand the sticks the third beat of the triplet on the ride.
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Old 11-05-2009, 12:39 AM
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Default Re: Can someone explain this shuffle to me

"I am by no means a shuffle master, but this is exactly what my R&L hands are doing when playing a half time shuffle."

Pocket, are you playing triplets between the ride and the snare to get the shuffle grove? If so, you've answered my question. NOw I just have to figure how to bounce the rh ride to gain the rest of the beat. Please clarify if I've got this wrong... Thanks
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Old 11-05-2009, 12:42 AM
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Default Re: Can someone explain this shuffle to me

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Originally Posted by intheruff View Post
Hey MJ, thanks... but I'm not sure what you meant... scuse' me for being so thick. I'm wondering if the left hand is duplicating the right hand 'shuffle' ride... ah one ah TWO ah three ah FOUR ah... OOOORRRRR, is it playing the alternating notes of a triplet (the 'ands' and 'twos' for a rh trips - counted one and uh two and uh...). OR IS IT SOMETHING COMPLETELY DIFFERENT???? A great feel and grove it is! And damn it... I wanna' learn it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Have a look at these two clips......if you haven't seen them before, they may well help you out. I pretty much learnt them from these two clips.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MwFdExvCxM4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HRu6oQUgNAc
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Old 11-05-2009, 12:45 AM
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Default Re: Can someone explain this shuffle to me

"No, the left hand stays ghosting on the snare (with the occasional foray up to the hi-hat)."

I got that part, however its where the left ghost are played (the count) I don't yet understand. I'm assuming the ride is a mere shuffle... ah one ah two... etc
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Old 11-05-2009, 12:46 AM
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Default Re: Can someone explain this shuffle to me

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Originally Posted by intheruff View Post

Pocket, are you playing triplets between the ride and the snare to get the shuffle grove? If so, you've answered my question. NOw I just have to figure how to bounce the rh ride to gain the rest of the beat. Please clarify if I've got this wrong... Thanks
Yes...or HH and snare.

The two right hands is just a double stroke. When I first started playing this, I'd play it really slowly and initially got the feel of it by playing it LRR LRR. Once I had that down I changed it to start on the R hand with the left ghost making up the middle note of the triplet, as per MJ's explaination. RLR RLR
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Last edited by Pocket-full-of-gold; 11-05-2009 at 01:14 AM.
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Old 11-05-2009, 12:49 AM
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Default Re: Can someone explain this shuffle to me

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Originally Posted by intheruff View Post
"No, the left hand stays ghosting on the snare (with the occasional foray up to the hi-hat)."

I got that part, however its where the left ghost are played (the count) I don't yet understand. I'm assuming the ride is a mere shuffle... ah one ah two... etc

The left hand ghost note on the snare is the middle note on the triplet. RlR RlR RlR RlR
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Old 11-05-2009, 01:00 AM
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Default Re: Can someone explain this shuffle to me

GOT IT BOYS!!!!!! The gentleman showing Bonhams shuffle said it SO SLOW that even I got it... lol. Thanks guys... now back to the woodshed... :)
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Old 11-05-2009, 02:51 AM
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Default Re: Can someone explain this shuffle to me

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GOT IT BOYS!!!!!! The gentleman showing Bonhams shuffle said it SO SLOW that even I got it... lol. Thanks guys... now back to the woodshed... :)
Have fun. Half time shuffles are great.
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Old 11-05-2009, 10:46 AM
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Default Re: Can someone explain this shuffle to me

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Originally Posted by Mighty_Joker View Post
Take a look at this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ntYen...rom=PL&index=3

I'm sure some of you will have seen it before. At 53 seconds, he starts a nice "Rosanna" style shuffle. However, at about 1:12, he breaks into a fill while maintaining the shuffle, and then at 1:15 he shuffles on the ride, with the left hand moving up onto the hi-hats.

I can't quite work out the fill and the ride/hats shuffle. Is he keeping up the triplets on the fill, and literally playing what he would usually play on the hi-hat, on the toms instead? And is it the same for the ride?

I'd love to try this out if only I could figure out what he's doing.

Any help appreciated, thanks.
This is the groove from 1:15. He keeps the same sticking in the followin couple of bars.
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Old 11-05-2009, 11:33 AM
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Default Re: Can someone explain this shuffle to me

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Originally Posted by Korompay View Post
This is the groove from 1:15. He keeps the same sticking in the followin couple of bars.
You beat me on this one, I was just about to write that out, haha.

:)

BTW:

The "Dennis Chambers Shuffle" is something different and works like this:

Single strokes played as triplets starting with the left hand on the HH. The right hand plays every second stroke on the RC-bell and thus creating a feel of 4:3. The Backbeat on 2 and 4 fall on the left hand. Quite easy actually - but really nice idea.

The BD can play any type of Shuffle pattern underneath.
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Old 11-05-2009, 12:24 PM
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Default Re: Can someone explain this shuffle to me

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This is the groove from 1:15. He keeps the same sticking in the followin couple of bars.
Great! Thanks. Do you think you could transcribe the next minute or so, with the fill and fast licks? (Up to about 1:45ish) I can't work out what he's playing, but it sounds good. Maybe just the basic pattern or lick/fill that he works with?

Also, what is the groove starting at about 2:22? I think it's some kind of paradiddle groove, but I can't figure it out. I'm so bad at this?!
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Old 11-05-2009, 06:01 PM
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Default Re: Can someone explain this shuffle to me

"The "Dennis Chambers Shuffle" is something different and works like this:

Single strokes played as triplets starting with the left hand on the HH. The right hand plays every second stroke on the RC-bell and thus creating a feel of 4:3. The Backbeat on 2 and 4 fall on the left hand. Quite easy actually - but really nice idea.

The BD can play any type of Shuffle pattern underneath."


NICE! I like simplicity. Thanks for BTWing that SR.

Today I start on getting the coordination together for that 'Rosanna' type groove now that I understand the sticking. Can't wait to get pissed off, drop my sticks, swear drums off for life, ya' know what I mean! ... lol.
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Old 11-06-2009, 07:27 AM
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Default Re: Can someone explain this shuffle to me

I've always loved that video of Evan!

I was going through a bunch of the drum off videos a year or two ago, and that one definitely stood out to me. Even now, I still go back and watch that particular video sometimes, just to try to pick up a few things from it.

And that groove has got to be one of the greatest ever!
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Old 11-06-2009, 08:23 PM
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Default Re: Can someone explain this shuffle to me

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Originally Posted by Pocket-full-of-gold View Post
Yes...or HH and snare.

The two right hands is just a double stroke. When I first started playing this, I'd play it really slowly and initially got the feel of it by playing it LRR LRR. Once I had that down I changed it to start on the R hand with the left ghost making up the middle note of the triplet, as per MJ's explaination. RLR RLR
Hey guys, just a follow up to let you know I have appreciated your comments regarding helping me with the 'shuffle'. After several, and more several, failed attempts at the groove the comment Pocket made regarding the right stick being 'just a double stroke' kept coming to mind. I visualized and walked around the house all day yesterday with the groove running through my mind, knowing with a little patience I'd get it.

Well, the thought occured to me this morning (sorry about this being a bit off topic to the reason of this thread, but it does relate) to put 'Rosanna' on and give the sticking a try with the music. WHAM! There it was in all it's groovyness glory. At first my right (hh) arm nearly fell off after only a few bars and the ghost lacked ghostlyness :). I was all tensed up! But after a couple of run throughs I relaxed and before I knew it it all came together, including the bd. Cool! Now I just need to practice it to nail the details and sublties of the groove at an 85bpm tempo.

Thanks for the topic MJ.

Oh yeah... Crazy, who's Evan?
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Old 11-07-2009, 12:07 AM
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Default Re: Can someone explain this shuffle to me

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Originally Posted by intheruff View Post
"The "Dennis Chambers Shuffle" is something different and works like this:

Single strokes played as triplets starting with the left hand on the HH. The right hand plays every second stroke on the RC-bell and thus creating a feel of 4:3. The Backbeat on 2 and 4 fall on the left hand. Quite easy actually - but really nice idea.

The BD can play any type of Shuffle pattern underneath."


NICE! I like simplicity. Thanks for BTWing that SR.

Today I start on getting the coordination together for that 'Rosanna' type groove now that I understand the sticking. Can't wait to get pissed off, drop my sticks, swear drums off for life, ya' know what I mean! ... lol.
Hi there, I've been reading the posts here and, well, I don't understand how you can call the DC shuffle "quite easy" but have such trouble with the half-time shuffle concept???? Didn't really seem to make sense but wouldn't be the first time I've misunderstood something said here. Getting through these grooves a few times in the practice room is one thing, but it takes a loooooong time to develop a solid shuffle like this.

If THIS video is EASY for you, you are one hell of a badass and my hat's off to you!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c8kSA7h0j3I

peace
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Old 11-07-2009, 02:21 AM
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Default Re: Can someone explain this shuffle to me

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Originally Posted by jivadayadasa View Post
Hi there, I've been reading the posts here and, well, I don't understand how you can call the DC shuffle "quite easy" but have such trouble with the half-time shuffle concept???? Didn't really seem to make sense but wouldn't be the first time I've misunderstood something said here. Getting through these grooves a few times in the practice room is one thing, but it takes a loooooong time to develop a solid shuffle like this.

If THIS video is EASY for you, you are one hell of a badass and my hat's off to you!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c8kSA7h0j3I

peace
He was quoting me in his post, so I was the one who said it was quite easy.

Yes: I do think that playing this groove and getting it together is quite easy. Playing it like Dennis?? Helluvadifferentstory. Nobody plays it like Dennis.
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Old 11-07-2009, 05:05 AM
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Default Re: Can someone explain this shuffle to me

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He was quoting me in his post, so I was the one who said it was quite easy.

Yes: I do think that playing this groove and getting it together is quite easy. Playing it like Dennis?? Helluvadifferentstory. Nobody plays it like Dennis.

Yo Jiva... ok, I see SR has corrected the misunderstanding. But, I thought the way he descibed the DC shuffle made it clear that it was an 'easy' sticking to comprehend, yet maybe not so easy to 'master'. Basically I got the Ros... shuffle in a day... but mastered??? No way.. Not even hardly! Not even a little of nothin'! Are you kidding? Forget about it!!!! Hey... but with time, patience, and practice (including Larryaces philosphy of needing to 'sing' it before playing it) these kinda' things usually come together and all becomes good again :). Tomorrow I'll give SR's interpretation of the DC shuffle a try, and just assume I'll again be throwing sticks, fits, and tantrums as usual.
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Old 11-09-2009, 01:23 AM
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Default Re: Can someone explain this shuffle to me

I can't believe no one has has mentioned the master himself.... the one....the only...you just hired.....the hit maker......Bernard Purdie. This has "The Purdie Shuffle" written all over it.
Lots of stuff on youtube.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9t0VlzJeNvA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HZ6xPGgoePg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xg3lAbifyPE
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  #30  
Old 11-09-2009, 03:47 AM
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Default Re: Can someone explain this shuffle to me

I know Evan from Pearl Drummer Forum and when he did that GC drum-off performance, he already have showed us some of his solo part and to really explain what Evan did was Porcaro (rosanna) shuffle but instead, he doubled the second ghost note of the triplet which makes it even harder. Evan is an unknown beast behind the kit.
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Old 11-09-2009, 06:22 AM
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Default Re: Can someone explain this shuffle to me

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Originally Posted by mind_drummer View Post
I know Evan from Pearl Drummer Forum and when he did that GC drum-off performance, he already have showed us some of his solo part and to really explain what Evan did was Porcaro (rosanna) shuffle but instead, he doubled the second ghost note of the triplet which makes it even harder. Evan is an unknown beast behind the kit.
I haven't hardly had any time this last week to take the Porcaro/Purdie/Chambers shuffle' from the pad to the drums, hopefully mid-week if things go as planned. But what's odd to me is the fact that as I've worked somewhat on the sticking (on the pad) I've been doubling the ghost without intention. It'd seem a minor conversion to convert my bad into what Evan did with intention. hmmm...
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