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  #1  
Old 10-14-2008, 02:48 AM
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Default What does "linear time" mean

As opposed to what, circular time? I don't get it. Can someone explain this so I can understand wtf it means?
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  #2  
Old 10-14-2008, 03:11 AM
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Default Re: What does "linear time" mean

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Originally Posted by larryace View Post
As opposed to what, circular time? I don't get it. Can someone explain this so I can understand wtf it means?
Linear time is a concept where by time is seen sequentially, as a series of events that are leading toward something: beginning, and an end. In Newtonain theory it is something absolute in reality, regardless of human perception.

Circular time sees time as circular, not necessarily leading towards something, but repeating itself in a cycle of events.

In music, the difference is that in Back or Mozart you have an opening (beginning) and the music develops through modulations and or sections. Whereas, in indigenous music, rhythmic patterns will repeat in cycles.
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Old 10-14-2008, 05:34 AM
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Default Re: What does "linear time" mean

Hey great answer. Is there any other concept of time other than linear or circular?
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Old 10-14-2008, 05:43 AM
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Default Re: What does "linear time" mean

Time out of Mind?

There's Relativity, I can't really expound on it, but Einstein believed that you could travel through time, and at the speed of light, time actually stands still because time is relative to speed. (Have you seen Planet of the Apes?) In that sense, I believe that time is perceived. Light is after all a perception as well as an energy.
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Old 10-14-2008, 05:55 AM
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Default Re: What does "linear time" mean

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Light is after all a perception as well as an energy.
Yes, but energy can also become matter for a split millisecond. Matter doesn't exist all of the time. Or, most of the time, for that "matter". Isn't it weird to think that everything we see is a negative reflection of what it really is (what it absorbs), and everything that we touch, we don't actually touch at all? What does that mean we actually perceive? More importantly; how does that affect your drumming?

Time doesn't exist beyond the 5th dimension, anyways. It's all a bunch of propaganda to encompass the first 3 dimensions. A bunch of hooey, I say.
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Old 10-14-2008, 06:16 AM
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Default Re: What does "linear time" mean

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Yes, but energy can also become matter for a split millisecond. Matter doesn't exist all of the time. Or, most of the time, for that "matter". Isn't it weird to think that everything we see is a negative reflection of what it really is (what it absorbs), and everything that we touch, we don't actually touch at all? What does that mean we actually perceive? More importantly; how does that affect your drumming?

Time doesn't exist beyond the 5th dimension, anyways. It's all a bunch of propaganda to encompass the first 3 dimensions. A bunch of hooey, I say.
We don't actually perceive anything; it perceives us. :)
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Old 10-14-2008, 06:30 AM
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Default Re: What does "linear time" mean

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We don't actually perceive anything; it perceives us. :)
That's just YOUR perception. :P
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  #8  
Old 10-14-2008, 06:37 AM
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Default Re: What does "linear time" mean

A bad year for time.
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  #9  
Old 10-14-2008, 06:40 AM
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Default Re: What does "linear time" mean

Right now is the end of all that has been.

Right now is the beginning of all that shall be.

Right now is the beginning and the end.

This is a circular, typically eastern view of time.

The western view of time is linear.

There is a beginning to all things.

There is an end to all things.

Right now is somewhere in between.
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  #10  
Old 10-14-2008, 06:44 AM
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Default Re: What does "linear time" mean

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Originally Posted by larryace View Post
As opposed to what, circular time? I don't get it. Can someone explain this so I can understand wtf it means?
Is this a drum question?
Let me see if I can help you here.

The word linear comes from the Latin word linearis, which means created by lines. In advanced mathematics, a linear map or function f(x) is a function which satisfies the following two properties:
Additivity (also called the superposition property): f(x + y) = f(x) + f(y). This says that f is a group homomorphism with respect to addition.
Homogeneity of degree 1: f(?x) = ?f(x) for all ?. It turns out that homogeneity follows from the additivity property in all cases where ? is rational. In that case, provided that the function is continuous, it becomes useless to establish the condition of homogeneity as an additional axiom.
In this definition, x is not necessarily a real number, but can in general be a member of any vector space. A less restrictive definition of linear function, not coinciding with the definition of linear map, is used in elementary mathematics.
The concept of linearity can be extended to linear operators. Important examples of linear operators include the derivative considered as a differential operator, and many constructed from it, such as del and the Laplacian. When a differential equation can be expressed in linear form, it is particularly easy to solve by breaking the equation up into smaller pieces, solving each of those pieces, and adding the solutions up.
Linear algebra is the branch of mathematics concerned with the study of vectors, vector spaces (or linear spaces), linear transformations (or linear maps), and systems of linear equations.

Time is a component of a measuring system used to sequence events, to compare the durations of events and the intervals between them, and to quantify the motions of objects. Time has been a major subject of religion, philosophy, and science, but defining time in a non-controversial manner applicable to all fields of study has consistently eluded the greatest scholars.
In physics and other sciences, time is considered one of the few fundamental quantities.[2] Time is used to define other quantities – such as velocity – and defining time in terms of such quantities would result in circularity of definition.[3] An operational definition of time, wherein one says that observing a certain number of repetitions of one or another standard cyclical event (such as the passage of a free-swinging pendulum) constitutes one standard unit such as the second, is highly useful in the conduct of both advanced experiments and everyday affairs of life. The operational definition leaves aside the question whether there is something called time, apart from the counting activity just mentioned, that flows and that can be measured. Investigations of a single continuum called space-time brings the nature of time into association with related questions into the nature of space, questions that have their roots in the works of early students of natural philosophy.
Among prominent philosophers, there are two distinct viewpoints on time. One view is that time is part of the fundamental structure of the universe, a dimension in which events occur in sequence. Time travel, in this view, becomes a possibility as other "times" persist like frames of a film strip, spread out across the time line. Sir Isaac Newton subscribed to this realist view, and hence it is sometimes referred to as Newtonian time.[4][5] The opposing view is that time does not refer to any kind of "container" that events and objects "move through", nor to any entity that "flows", but that it is instead part of a fundamental intellectual structure (together with space and number) within which humans sequence and compare events. This second view, in the tradition of Gottfried Leibniz[6] and Immanuel Kant,[7][8] holds that time is neither an event nor a thing, and thus is not itself measurable nor can it be traveled.
Temporal measurement has occupied scientists and technologists, and was a prime motivation in navigation and astronomy. Periodic events and periodic motion have long served as standards for units of time. Examples include the apparent motion of the sun across the sky, the phases of the moon, the swing of a pendulum, and the beat of a heart. Currently, the international unit of time, the second, is defined in terms of radiation emitted by caesium atoms.
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  #11  
Old 10-14-2008, 07:27 AM
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Default Re: What does "linear time" mean

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Originally Posted by jay norem View Post
Is this a drum question?
It's the most important question a drummer can ask because our realm, rhythm, is the realm in music that pertains to time, as does also form, which is the measurement of recurring units of time in music. So 'what is time?' and 'how do we perceive it in music?' are good questions to ask.
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Old 10-14-2008, 01:57 PM
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Default Re: What does "linear time" mean

My Brain Hurts now.....................
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  #13  
Old 10-14-2008, 03:10 PM
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Default Re: What does "linear time" mean

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Originally Posted by larryace View Post
As opposed to what, circular time? I don't get it. Can someone explain this so I can understand wtf it means?

Good to know some of our most esteemed members are as helpful and informative as ever ;)

'Linear' time is grooving/timekeeping where no more than one voice is being played at one time - so no bass or snare notes played in unison with the ride/hihat. A lot of guys bend the rules a little and throw in the odd unison stroke - the 50 ways to leave your lover groove by Gadd is a good example.
The Gary Chaffee book covers the concept to the point of mind-numbing boredom, so check that out.
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Old 10-14-2008, 04:05 PM
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Default Re: What does "linear time" mean

Holy crap Jay I appreciate the half hour it took to write that reply, thank you, but I meant as it pertains to drumming ha ha. I saw somebody say here, describing David Garibaldi as playing a linear funk groove, and didn't get it. Damn dude you have some mad knowledge there ha ha
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Old 10-14-2008, 04:20 PM
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Default Re: What does "linear time" mean

The best explanation of relativity is this:
grab a hot pan and hold it for 10 seconds and it will seem like an hour. Grab a hot woman for an hour and it will seem like 10 seconds.
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  #16  
Old 10-14-2008, 06:06 PM
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Default Re: What does "linear time" mean

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Originally Posted by larryace View Post
Holy crap Jay I appreciate the half hour it took to write that reply, thank you, but I meant as it pertains to drumming ha ha. I saw somebody say here, describing David Garibaldi as playing a linear funk groove, and didn't get it. Damn dude you have some mad knowledge there ha ha
I thought that might be what you were referring to when I first opened the thread.

A linear funk groove has the beat orchestrated individually throughout the kit. So no two instruments of the kit are playing at the same time. They usually will involve sixteenth notes.
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  #17  
Old 10-15-2008, 01:38 AM
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Default Re: What does "linear time" mean

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Originally Posted by larryace View Post
Holy crap Jay I appreciate the half hour it took to write that reply, ...
Jay didn't take the "time" to write that. He simply spent "time" cutting and pasting it from google.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time


..................
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  #18  
Old 10-15-2008, 01:40 AM
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Default Re: What does "linear time" mean

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Originally Posted by rockinrider View Post
Jay didn't take the "time" to write that. He simply spent "time" cutting and pasting it from google.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time


..................
Well of course that's what I did! You think I know all that stuff?
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  #19  
Old 10-15-2008, 01:41 AM
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Default Re: What does "linear time" mean

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Originally Posted by Big_Philly View Post
The best explanation of relativity is this:
grab a hot pan and hold it for 10 seconds and it will seem like an hour. Grab a hot woman for an hour and it will seem like 10 seconds.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH.....oh lord.

its like the idiot's guide to relativity.




oh man i am SO using that in my physics class when we get to it.
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  #20  
Old 10-15-2008, 02:14 AM
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Default Re: What does "linear time" mean

Thanks Ken, I got it now.
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  #21  
Old 10-15-2008, 11:04 PM
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Default Re: What does "linear time" mean

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Originally Posted by larryace View Post
Hey great answer. Is there any other concept of time other than linear or circular?
Staying within the musical context, there's the concept of
(a) non-linear pulse: symphonies - which are more feel than following mathematical patterns,
(b) piece-wise-linear: prog rock/math rock/fusion - which typically follow a pulse for a certain duration before changing one or more times within a song
(c) overlapping-linear: polyrhythms, and
(d) linear (your typical radio friendly rock, pop which maintain the same pulse throughout the song).
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  #22  
Old 10-16-2008, 07:44 AM
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Default Re: What does "linear time" mean

There's also the vertical approach, where multiple voices interplay with individual rhythms and notes to create a overall sound.
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  #23  
Old 10-20-2008, 03:11 PM
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Default Re: What does "linear time" mean

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Originally Posted by Big_Philly View Post
The best explanation of relativity is this:
grab a hot pan and hold it for 10 seconds and it will seem like an hour. Grab a hot woman for an hour and it will seem like 10 seconds.
ha. priceless, big P
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