HELP!!! Nylon washers

[tbmills]

i recently purchased a set of nylon washers for my whole kit an i have a question about installation.

should i leave the metal washer on between the t-rod head and nylon washer?

i have a spaun snare that has nylon and metal washers on it in the same arrangement as stated above.

my drums are in pieces right now please answer back as quick as possible....

thanks

[phil_qc]

On my Sonor, there is the rod, the metal washer and the nylon washer...

Phil.

[GRUNTERSDAD]

I left the metal ones on also.

[tbmills]

thanks phil...


still taking suggestions.

[mind_drummer]

On Mapex drums & BP snares there's only the nylon washer and that's what I did for my kit and snares. The goal is to remove any metal to metal contact. Yet I dont have any problem and the tuning is held better.

[dc2]

Originally Posted by mind_drummer

On Mapex drums & BP snares there's only the nylon washer and that's what I did for my kit and snares. The goal is to remove any metal to metal contact. Yet I dont have any problem and the tuning is held better.

I second everything he said here. I've got nylon washers on my whole kit, and I have removed all the metal washers to prevent any metal to metal contact. If you have any doubt, just do like I did and put all your metal washers in a ziploc bag. Tuck em' away and if you change your mind, you'll still have them.

[tbmills]

Originally Posted by dc2

I second everything he said here. I've got nylon washers on my whole kit, and I have removed all the metal washers to prevent any metal to metal contact. If you have any doubt, just do like I did and put all your metal washers in a ziploc bag. Tuck em' away and if you change your mind, you'll still have them.

this is exactly what i ended up doing...

[drumtechdad]

On some tension rods the metal washers are captive, so you haven't got much choice.

I think leaving the metal washers on makes sense, spreads the load evenly on the softer nylon washer. Not sure why eliminating "metal to metal" contact is an advantage.

[tbmills]

Originally Posted by drumtechdad

On some tension rods the metal washers are captive, so you haven't got much choice.

I think leaving the metal washers on makes sense, spreads the load evenly on the softer nylon washer. Not sure why eliminating "metal to metal" contact is an advantage.

i played around with both on my 10" tom before doing to whole set and found that there wasnt really a difference in how it sat on the hoop. so i just took out the metal washer eliminating ALL metal/metal contact... thats why i got the in the first place, right?

[Deathmetalconga]

Originally Posted by tbmills

i played around with both on my 10" tom before doing to whole set and found that there wasnt really a difference in how it sat on the hoop. so i just took out the metal washer eliminating ALL metal/metal contact... thats why i got the in the first place, right?

Why would you want to eliminate metal-to-metal contact? The tuning bolts are threaded into metal nuts in the lugs anway. What is the purpose of nylon washers in the tuning bolts? It seems like they would reduce friction, which would make your drums de-tune faster. I'd maybe instead want rubber ones, which would compress and hold the tuning bolt in place better.

[drumtechdad]

Originally Posted by tbmills

i played around with both on my 10" tom before doing to whole set and found that there wasnt really a difference in how it sat on the hoop. so i just took out the metal washer eliminating ALL metal/metal contact... thats why i got the in the first place, right?

As deathmetalconga says, you're going to have metal-to-metal contact between the tension rod and the lug anyway, so I'm still curious about what the deleterious effects of that contact could be.

And to deathmetalconga--they are primarily used on snares, which (obviously) have much higher tension than toms. The reduced friction helps, it gives you a smoother feel and it's much easier to make fine adjustments. I always put them on any snare that doesn't have them already.

You don't see them much on toms, though, probably for the detuning issue you mention.

[tbmills]

i got the washers because my tension rods have been binding on the hoop.

metal to metal contact in this case was bad.

the threading on the lug and rod is a different situation and requires the strength of metal over the durability of nylon.

and DMC,
if i have to rely on the friction of rod to hoop to keep heads in tune, then something is horribly wrong with the lug.


plus, metal on metal contact at the washer is much more susceptible to outside deterioration agents such as moisture, oil from fingers, and even open air.

[GRUNTERSDAD]

I put them on the top head of my snares and toms. It makes minute turns of the lugs possible where before the lugs would bind at times.

[tbmills]

Originally Posted by GRUNTERSDAD

I put them on the top head of my snares and toms. It makes minute turns of the lugs possible where before the lugs would bind at times.

yeah theyre great so far. tuning was a breeze. they also make even tension lugs feel like they are in fact even. they dont give you a false impression of how tight or loose the rod is.

[Deathmetalconga]

Originally Posted by tbmills

and DMC,
if i have to rely on the friction of rod to hoop to keep heads in tune, then something is horribly wrong with the lug.

plus, metal on metal contact at the washer is much more susceptible to outside deterioration agents such as moisture, oil from fingers, and even open air.

Well, I wouldn't rely only on the friction between the hoop and tuning bolt flange to keep the drum in tune - but it's one of the sources of friction that helps keep the tuning bolt from loosening. The less friction you have, the more easily the tuning bolt will be able to loosen. That doesn't mean nylon washers will necessarily result in detuning; it just means that friction is one of the factors keeping the tuning bolt in place. If the nylon washers are somewhat soft, they may actually increase friction and keep tuning better, but I've never used them so I don't know.

Personally, I use www.tightscrews.com. The soft nylon insert creates plenty of friction between the tuning bolt and receiver nut, but it's not the grinding metal-on-metal type friction. More like a gooey plastic friction.

[drumtechdad]

I like the tightscrews for certain applications, such as the tension rods on a snare that loosen from rim shots, and I have them on some drums that are tuned so low they are problematic.

But it should be noted that you lose all "feel" for tension when you use them--they always feel tight--so they can make it harder when making fine adjustments.

I'm going to try luglocs next, but I need to get a whole bunch of them--7-piece kit! I'd like to get the normal "feel" back yet still have the tension rods stay put after tuning.