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  #121  
Old 01-13-2006, 11:28 PM
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jpekarek jpekarek is offline
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

IMO, Steve Gadd is an excellent drummer and also very accomplished. But (IMO) if you take away that one lightning fast lick he does all the time, there isn't anything very impressive left. It seems like most of his stuff is based on it. He throws it in everywhere and it gets a little old.

Great drummer, great chops, I just can't find anything to get impressed about.
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  #122  
Old 01-13-2006, 11:34 PM
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

The drum solo on Chick Corea's Three Quartets album amazes me everytime. I think Modern Drummer had it transcriped once.
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  #123  
Old 01-14-2006, 12:23 AM
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

IMO, Gadd would rank among the best drummers to ever have breathed even if he had never played a solo... or a fill for that matter.

Gadd is all about the GROOVE!
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  #124  
Old 01-14-2006, 05:31 AM
berlioz berlioz is offline
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jpekarek
IMO, Steve Gadd is an excellent drummer and also very accomplished. But (IMO) if you take away that one lightning fast lick he does all the time, there isn't anything very impressive left. It seems like most of his stuff is based on it. He throws it in everywhere and it gets a little old.

Great drummer, great chops, I just can't find anything to get impressed about.
a quote from Buddy Rich
"Steve Gadd was and probably still is, the best at that particular kind of drumming. I think that's because he has a jazz background, so he's able to incorporate it when he plays. He was very interesting in the beginning. Out of all the drummers I've heard, Gadd would have to be the one who has the most class behind the drums."

well i guess he had Buddy fooled, if he could only have seen past "that one lightning fast lick".... Oh and btw Gadd has done thousands of recordings and most of his stuff is not based on this lick, maybe 1% of it. Thats not what Steve Gadd's drumming is about.
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  #125  
Old 01-14-2006, 06:04 AM
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theduke86 theduke86 is offline
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

Gadd has his licks, about ten or eleven of them. He orchestrates them differently and can start and end them on any beat. He just doesn't have one.
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  #126  
Old 01-14-2006, 11:40 PM
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KzSgDrummer KzSgDrummer is offline
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tomgadd
something brand new from gadd....
http://www.sunlightsquare.co.uk/

you can listen to 4 tracks from the brand new cd and you can watch some quicktime videos
from the recording session...

line up is:

BASS - Will Lee -
DRUMS - Steve Gadd -
VOCALS: JOY MALCOLM (Moby, Incognito)
SHARLENE HECTOR (Basement Jaxx), Z-STAR (Slow Train)

cheers

THANK YOU for this notice. I promptly ordered a copy and it just came today. So far I really like it, always a treat to hear Gadd playing in a cutting-edge musical environment. The compositions start off really grooving and invigorating, but it seems as you get deeper into the album, the tracks languish a bit. But oh well, the first 4 tracks more than make up for it. Not to mention that anything - ANYTHING - Gadd plays on I will gleefully listen to.

And for those who think he has only a couple things he does over and over, you are not listening close enough. Maybe it's the same rhythm orchestrated around the kit the same way, but if you're hearing the same thing as before, you're not grasping that, for whatever reasons, it simply fits the mood being created right then and there (making technical issues pointless to think about - just feel what the song/Gadd is saying). Not to sound condescending, but you must dive deeper into his sonic spectrum and think about his playing on many levels, and especially listen to the SPACE in between his notes just as much as the actual notes. Context, musicality, groove, efficiency, touch -- he pretty much has full ownership of these concepts, and you'll be much better to keep listening until you understand how he rules these.
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  #127  
Old 01-15-2006, 12:33 AM
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ewanlaing ewanlaing is offline
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

i admire how his solos don't go on and on and on. most studio drummers can go on for hours playing rythms not only confusing to play, but also to listen to. gadd gives us a minute or two of perfection, before the rest of the band joins in again.
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  #128  
Old 01-15-2006, 01:03 AM
Slayer_metal_head
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

Damn that man has Groove!
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  #129  
Old 01-15-2006, 12:49 PM
Stu_Strib
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jpekarek
IMO, Steve Gadd is an excellent drummer and also very accomplished. But (IMO) if you take away that one lightning fast lick he does all the time, there isn't anything very impressive left. It seems like most of his stuff is based on it. He throws it in everywhere and it gets a little old.

Great drummer, great chops, I just can't find anything to get impressed about.

Wow, is this a joke post? Yes, you can have your opinion, but I think you probably haven't watched/studied/listened to or followed Gadd at all. There is so much more to his playing than the 32nd note Linear Riffs and the and the "50 ways" grove.

Watch him play with James Taylor. I assure you he doesn't play the linear riff at all, because IT DOESN'T FIT THE MUSIC.

Gadd is a master at playing for the music.

Just watch Clapton's Crossroads DVD and fast forward to the James Taylor/Joe Walsh bit with Gadd on drums.

The problem with Gadd is that he isn't always flash and chops all the time, so some more over-the-top type of drummers don't get him.

The man is a musical genius who defies classification.
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  #130  
Old 01-15-2006, 12:58 PM
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

Quote:
Originally Posted by darkcherryfade
I don't care that he can play an amazing single ratamacue. Anyone can master rudiments. I care that he can use it musically,
But did you SEE how he applied it to the kit! (besides, it isn't that amazing of a ratamacue anyway)

Ahh, this is what most people don't get. Yes he plays a fast ratamaque, but who else would have figured out how to put that to a song on a drumset??? Have you HEARD how he plays this in songs? It goes beyond comprehension sometimes. Like I said before, he shows you the riff, but none of us can pull it off like him.
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  #131  
Old 01-15-2006, 01:00 PM
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

Quote:
but i dont consider him a legend or anything
Quote:
he's a great drummerbut I don't find him to be so amazing.
Quote:
I can't seem to find something SO speacial about this guy. overrated
Quote:
I just don't hear any progress in Gadd's playing. One thing I noticed is that he does the same things, all the time! I've seen lots of video footage and heard lots of recordings he's on and it's always the same beats and that same lick between the snare and toms.
Quote:
anyone else ever thought that the 50 Ways beat just doesn't really fit the song??

Ok now I'm really flustered. I guess some people just don't get it. Why is it that people can make really absurd claims (see above) that are made mostly out of ignorance then footnote it with IMO, or IMHO. Worse, when those of us who GET Gadd respond, we are somehow knee-jerk, and reactionary? Of COURSE I'm reactionary. When you know something you know something. When someone says something as fact, and they just don't know, then naturally those of us 'in-the-know' are going to speak out.

Call it old-age, maturity, smugness, whatever...


Most intelligent thing said in this entire thread (thinshells):
Quote:
They want Steve Gadd to sound like Joey, or Travis. The bashings usually come from younger folks that aren't impressed by anything except faster, louder. Subtlety and musicianship along with groove are ideas that are undiscovered.
(sorry for the triple post, but man I feel passionate about this one)

Last edited by Stu_Strib; 01-15-2006 at 01:18 PM.
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  #132  
Old 01-15-2006, 01:37 PM
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Bernhard Bernhard is offline
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

Stu, I understand your pain.....

It's not easy to explain the beauty of a lovely girl to a motorcycle.

For me with Steve Gadd, there are some steps:

Step 1

What a great lick - what the hell he's doing

Step 2

Analysing slow motion and tabs: oh, looks very easy - much easier as it sounds....

Step 3

Trying to play it - just got it - must be this

Step 4

Shit, doesn't sound

Step 5

I give up - what a genius


Bernhard
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  #133  
Old 01-15-2006, 04:52 PM
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

brilliant. this little sequence is how i feel about a lot of drummers on DW...which is why the rule stands...don't bash the pros.

j
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  #134  
Old 01-15-2006, 09:12 PM
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jpekarek jpekarek is offline
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stu_Strib
Ok now I'm really flustered. I guess some people just don't get it. Why is it that people can make really absurd claims (see above) that are made mostly out of ignorance then footnote it with IMO, or IMHO. Worse, when those of us who GET Gadd respond, we are somehow knee-jerk, and reactionary?
Holly COW! Talk about forcing you opinions on other people! You said I am allowed to have my own opinion and then you spent the next 45 minutes taking it away from me. I REALLY do not appreciate being called “ignorant” by you simply because I have a different opinion than you! That is a very closed minded insult. You posted quotes from 5 different people (none of which were even from me BTW I never once bashed Steve Gadd, I said he is an excellent drummer), and then proceeded to imply that everyone is stupid for not feeling the same way as you. Just because I think differently than you doesn’t mean that my thoughts are to be thrown aside (I’m 40 by the way). Yes you feel very passionate about Steve Gadd and that’s great, but you don’t have to force everyone else to as well. Settle down and realize that everyone on this board is an individual person entitled to his own thoughts and opinions.

I happen to feel very passionate about Mopars, but I am not going to call everyone that drives a Ford or Chevy an idiot and spend my life trying to tell them that their wrong.
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  #135  
Old 01-15-2006, 10:14 PM
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

"You can have your opinion" was a preemptive strike. Usually when people say things that make no sense, their rebuttal is, "well, that's my opinion". I am just saying that your opinion is probably based more in what you DON'T know than what you do. How else could you justify those comments about Steve Gadd?

Now if you said, "I don't like Steve Gadd's style or sound" or something, that's different. However, you chose to say, "that one fast lick", which is a completely rediculous statement. This is STEVE FREAKIN' GADD we are talking about. If the name alone doesn't inspire awe, then I guess you just don't get it.

Nothing personal. I'm not attacking you at all. I didn't take 45 minutes to make everyone feel the way I feel. I am not FORCING my opinions on anyone. STEVE FREAKIN' GADD is completely off limits for criticism, heh. I took a few minutes to tell everyone how misguided and ininformed these quotes were (yours included.)

Ok, so he doesn't excite you, but you can't say he only has one fast lick. That is simply wrong, and yes, sorry to say, ignorant. Again, nothing personal, but what other word fits?

If you say the sky is red, I'm going to tell you it is blue, that's all I'm saying.
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  #136  
Old 01-15-2006, 10:48 PM
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

this is getting a little heated. i can see why some people think gadd only has a few patterns, but i think that may be down to those being such great patterns, and therefore the ones you always see and hear on websites. listening to songs on the gadd page rather than watching the videos opened my eyes (*ears*) as to how varied he is, and the two new videos enforce this. this shouldn't be an argument. we are supposed to understand each other and learn. thats what the forum is for i think.
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  #137  
Old 01-15-2006, 10:49 PM
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

Um, Stu....Please do not quote my question "Anyone else ever thought that the the 50 Ways beat just doesn't really fit the song" as a demonstation of a general 'misguidedness' and ignorance. I am an enormous fan of Gadd; I love his playing for all the reasons you have stated; I love countless grooves he's laid down, but I happen not to think that particular one fits that song - great pattern though it is!

However, I do agree with whoever expressed frustration at Gadd's endless repetition of his licks. There are obviously a hell of a lot of people who are happy to go to a Steve Gadd clinic, and watch him play his licks over and over again. Personally, I think it would be interesting to see the guy stretching his enormous talent, and continuing to innovate like he once did, rather than giving the crowds the quasi-drumming-pornography that Gadd playing his licks now is.
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  #138  
Old 01-15-2006, 10:57 PM
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

he must get asked about them a lot tho.

i think some folks, not you, but others form quick opinions about guys like Gadd from a few videos and an album or two. the guy has milesof studio tape with allsorts of stuff going on. there are reasons why he is a legend its just that some people only see the most popular stuff and think that's all there is .

stu is getting passionate perhaps for that reason. it is fustrating sometimes knowing something and then seeing people who have had less or limited access to the same info give an opinion. stu is sort of trying to help them think twice about their ideas. its just that some people don't like to be told stuff but rather discover it for themselves - if the can be bothered.
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  #139  
Old 01-15-2006, 11:01 PM
OceanDirt OceanDirt is offline
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Womble
Um, Stu....Please do not quote my question "Anyone else ever thought that the the 50 Ways beat just doesn't really fit the song" as a demonstation of a general 'misguidedness' and ignorance. I am an enormous fan of Gadd; I love his playing for all the reasons you have stated; I love countless grooves he's laid down, but I happen not to think that particular one fits that song - great pattern though it is!

However, I do agree with whoever expressed frustration at Gadd's endless repetition of his licks. There are obviously a hell of a lot of people who are happy to go to a Steve Gadd clinic, and watch him play his licks over and over again. Personally, I think it would be interesting to see the guy stretching his enormous talent, and continuing to innovate like he once did, rather than giving the crowds the quasi-drumming-pornography that Gadd playing his licks now is.
but gadd does not just "play his licks." does he have licks? yes. does he play them? yes he does. but that is perhaps the least important part of what he has done as an innovator on the drum set.

gadd redefined playing our intsrument. he grew to fame during the 70s when having perfect time was not a primary concern, and he had perfect time. he was precise and clean in his playing when precision was not important. and he maintained that precision and perfection of time while also playing openly (both in style and more importantly in technique) which had never really been heard mastered, especially in the musical context where he did most of his work. his concept of musicality was both incredibly simple and highly complex, giving him the ability to play next to nothing and yet do it in a way no one else would ever think of, but always first and foremost in the service of the song.

it's all about his feel. no one has a feel like he does. no one can play so perfectly and so innovatvely and yet still be so relaxed. it's like he's breathing into it, as though he played saxophone instead of drums.

there's a reason he's done more session work than nearly anybody else. and as much as i love it, it's not because of that cool paradiddle lick with the hi-hat.
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  #140  
Old 01-15-2006, 11:12 PM
Womble
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

Quote:
Originally Posted by OceanDirt
but gadd does not just "play his licks." does he have licks? yes. does he play them? yes he does. but that is perhaps the least important part of what he has done as an innovator on the drum set.
Yes. You don't say anything I disagree with. In fact, it's precisely because I agree that Gadd's licks are not the most important part of his playing that I get frustated when I see clinic clips, and all he seems to do is roll out his licks, again....and again....and again. Now as Nutha suggests, and I hinted at, maybe that's because the audience is always full of people who want to hear those licks. Maybe it's because Steve has assumed that's what people want to hear. Who knows....I just think it would be fascinating to see him come out of his comfort zone, don't you?
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  #141  
Old 01-15-2006, 11:26 PM
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stu_Strib
This is STEVE FREAKIN' GADD we are talking about. If the name alone doesn't inspire awe, then I guess you just don't get it.
I guess I don't know what I'm talking about then, but give me a little credit. I've been playng since the 4th grade, nearly 30 years now, I have played with at least 10 bands, I have had 12 drumsets, I have 2 published albums to my credit, I have won Regional and State championships with my high-school and college jazz bands (1985 and 1988), took 3dr place in a National championship with the Spartan Drum & Bugle Corps, spent an entire evening talking and drinking wine with with Virgil Donatti in Boise '97, I know Deen Castronovo personally and I have never heard of Steve Gadd until a few months ago when I joined this forum.

So call me ignorant if you must, that's OK because I am done with this topic. I guess in my brief 40 years I have grown wise enough to know when an argument has become futile.

So you win, Steve Gadd is the finest drummer in the world. Now if you will excuse me, my 5 year old is trying to kill the cat!
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  #142  
Old 01-15-2006, 11:27 PM
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Casper "DrPowerStroke" Paludan Casper "DrPowerStroke" Paludan is offline
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Womble
Yes. You don't say anything I disagree with. In fact, it's precisely because I agree that Gadd's licks are not the most important part of his playing that I get frustated when I see clinic clips, and all he seems to do is roll out his licks, again....and again....and again. Now as Nutha suggests, and I hinted at, maybe that's because the audience is always full of people who want to hear those licks. Maybe it's because Steve has assumed that's what people want to hear. Who knows....I just think it would be fascinating to see him come out of his comfort zone, don't you?
Most of the clinic videos I see make me zone out after a minute or so, and don't even get me started about non-drummers.... Gadd is a differnet story, though. He plays stuff that is both technically perfect and groovy like anything. It is just incredibly pleasing to listen to, and I admire him for holding his own against the onslaught of super chops that in my opinion have limited musical value. DPS
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  #143  
Old 01-15-2006, 11:30 PM
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

YES GADD HAS HIS LICKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! SHEEESH!

What irks me is that people think this is ALL he has. Just look at the long list of songs on here that people have posted that are specifically GADD lick free is all I'm saying. Just because Bernhard posted some of his more known licks, and there are several DVDs highlighting his licks, doesn't mean this is all he plays.

Nutha has it right. I'm trying to maybe open people's eyes to the fact there is more to Gadd than 32nd note doubles and linear snare-hi-hat-kick licks. We all have our individual styles. What makes Gadd great, is people know right away "That's Gadd". I have my own style. People don't go "That's Stu".

And Womble, you'll note I took your name out of the quote, so as not to make it personal. I was just highlighting some of the 'lowlight' comments; the ones that best demonstrate that people just don't get Gadd. 50 Ways has to be one of the most perfect and most identifiable riffs to a song ever. I think DogBreath said it best. 50 ways is a song that revolves around the drum riff. It is quite simply, the perfect part for that song. I would bet that every producer and song writer in that room nearly died when they heard Steve lay down that groove.

Even if you don't think it fits, you should still analyze the riff to see there are a lot of bad imitations of it. There are so many subtle things going on in a seemingly simple fill....it's vintage Gadd.

The cool thing about Gadd is he is one of the drummers I don't envy because of chops. Frankly, the stuff he plays isn't technically difficult. It is simply pure genius. Like Bernhard said, you can see the notes, he'll show you the notes, he'll show you how to play the notes, and you STILL can't play it right.

I could only WISH to have a lick someday that people immediately identify as being STU.

STU-isms would be cool.

But, I suck, so one can dream.


I have nothing left to say on this issue. This is like trying to convince Bud Light drinkers the virtues of fine wine, or comic book readers about nuances of fine art. You get it, or you don't.
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  #144  
Old 01-15-2006, 11:35 PM
Womble
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DrPowerStroke
Most of the clinic videos I see make me zone out after a minute or so, and don't even get me started about non-drummers.... Gadd is a differnet story, though. He plays stuff that is both technically perfect and groovy like anything. It is just incredibly pleasing to listen to, and I admire him for holding his own against the onslaught of super chops that in my opinion have limited musical value. DPS
I know what you mean. In a way, though, I think it's cooler to see a really young groove-minded guy holding his own against the chops monsters (that 14 minute Keith Carlock clinic vid game me more pleasure than from any I have seen in a long time). It would certainly be more of a psychological challenge to a a younger, less famous drummer. Gadd knows by now that he could play whatever the hell he wanted and people would still worship him like a God. That's why I think it would be interesting to see him try new things.
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  #145  
Old 01-15-2006, 11:43 PM
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jpekarek
.......... I have had 12 drumsets, I have 2 published albums to my credit, I have won Regional and State championships with my high-school and college jazz bands (1985 and 1988), took 3dr place in a National championship with the Spartan Drum & Bugle Corps, spent an entire evening talking and drinking wine with with Virgil Donatti in Boise '97, I know Deen Castronovo personally and I have never heard of Steve Gadd ........
!

Ok - I understand: you are a formula 1 racer (not a go-car Racer beware!!!) and never heard the name Ferrari.

That's ok, but so perhabs better discussing about lawn-mowers , not race-cars - there lies the misunderstanding

( just a question: Buddy Rich - ever heard? - was also a quite good drummer -won no championships, never practiced, but anyway...)

Bernhard
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  #146  
Old 01-15-2006, 11:44 PM
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jpekarek
I guess I don't know what I'm talking about then, but give me a little credit. I've been playng since the 4th grade, nearly 30 years now, I have played with at least 10 bands, I have had 12 drumsets, I have 2 published albums to my credit, I have won Regional and State championships with my high-school and college jazz bands (1985 and 1988), took 3dr place in a National championship with the Spartan Drum & Bugle Corps, spent an entire evening talking and drinking wine with with Virgil Donatti in Boise '97, I know Deen Castronovo personally and I have never heard of Steve Gadd until a few months ago when I joined this forum.

So call me ignorant if you must, that's OK because I am done with this topic. I guess in my brief 40 years I have grown wise enough to know when an argument has become futile.

So you win, Steve Gadd is the finest drummer in the world. Now if you will excuse me, my 5 year old is trying to kill the cat!
Hi Jpekarek,

You make my point for me: ignorant simply means "unaware of". At LEAST you didn't come in here saying Steve Gadd only has one lick and is overrated.

I share your sentiments, and trust me, nothing I said was directed at you or your participation in this thread. We are the same age, have the same issues (namely children killing family pets), the same credentials (Oregon States here, vs. Washington for you, I gather). I knew people would get reactionary to the word ignorant. I have no problem with your comments because you quite frankly don't know of Gadd, so therefore you didn't say anything really really ignorant about it.

Another great thing about Gadd: you may have never heard of him, but there is no way you have never heard his playing, given how much he has recorded, and your extensive experience in drumming. I assure you, with your track record, you've played something that was recorded by Gadd.

Ask Deen. I'm sure he'll tell you all about Gadd. Deen is great, and should be talked about more on DW ;-) I worshiped Deen when I was a Freshman. I think he was running the snare line at the Salem Argonauts when I tried out....man that guy was intimidating.
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  #147  
Old 01-15-2006, 11:50 PM
Womble
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

Lol Stu, how does removing my name from my quotation make it less personal to me, when you then label it a 'lowlight' comment that shows I don't 'get Gadd'!? Anyway, I'm not seriously getting up-tight about this, I'd just like the record to state, as I think it should, that my failing to worship one single but very popular Gadd groove does not cast doubt on my Gadd-loving (and 'getting'!) credentials.

Interesting how you say 50 Ways revolves around the drum part, but that the drum part is in turn the perfect part for the song. It makes me wonder which came first, the chicken or the egg? Seriously, does anyone know how that part came into existence? My gut feeling, and hence why I may be disparaging about the part, is that it was a groove Gadd had come up with in his own time and wanted to play in a song, and found one he could fit it into to.
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  #148  
Old 01-15-2006, 11:51 PM
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jpekarek jpekarek is offline
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stu_Strib
Hi Jpekarek,

You make my point for me: ignorant simply means "unaware of". At LEAST you didn't come in here saying Steve Gadd only has one lick and is overrated.

I share your sentiments, and trust me, nothing I said was directed at you or your participation in this thread. We are the same age, have the same issues (namely children killing family pets), the same credentials (Oregon States here, vs. Washington for you, I gather). I knew people would get reactionary to the word ignorant. I have no problem with your comments because you quite frankly don't know of Gadd, so therefore you didn't say anything really really ignorant about it.

Another great thing about Gadd: you may have never heard of him, but there is no way you have never heard his playing, given how much he has recorded, and your extensive experience in drumming. I assure you, with your track record, you've played something that was recorded by Gadd.

Ask Deen. I'm sure he'll tell you all about Gadd. Deen is great, and should be talked about more on DW ;-) I worshiped Deen when I was a Freshman. I think he was running the snare line at the Salem Argonauts when I tried out....man that guy was intimidating.
Well I'll tell you what I am doing. I am searching the internet for downloads of Steve Gadd's music and videos clips. Looking through old S&G recordings and listening to the "Clap". The passionate string of conversation here has intrigued me to say the least, the least I can do is learn more about the man!
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  #149  
Old 01-16-2006, 12:15 AM
berlioz berlioz is offline
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Womble
Interesting how you say 50 Ways revolves around the drum part, but that the drum part is in turn the perfect part for the song. It makes me wonder which came first, the chicken or the egg? Seriously, does anyone know how that part came into existence? My gut feeling, and hence why I may be disparaging about the part, is that it was a groove Gadd had come up with in his own time and wanted to play in a song, and found one he could fit it into to.
Paul Simon wrote the song around the groove. Steve was warming up, doing independence exercises, with left hand on hi-hat and closing the hi-hat foot on different beats, while playing this New Orleans funk pattern. Paul loved what he was playing and built the song over top of this groove.
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Old 01-16-2006, 12:49 AM
Stu_Strib
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Womble

Interesting how you say 50 Ways revolves around the drum part, but that the drum part is in turn the perfect part for the song. It makes me wonder which came first, the chicken or the egg? Seriously, does anyone know how that part came into existence? My gut feeling, and hence why I may be disparaging about the part, is that it was a groove Gadd had come up with in his own time and wanted to play in a song, and found one he could fit it into to.
According to Paul Simon, the song was done, and Gadd made it up during the session. It blew everyone away, and then the song was retweaked to fit the pattern even better. So finally, a drummer other than Neil Peart, having a profound effect on song writing!

DogBreath stated it much better than I, as he probably didn't drink a bottle of wine while on night time cold medicine, like myself, ;-)


Edit: I found more:

According to Simon -
Quote:
The big discovery on this song was Steve Gadd's drum part. It's probably what made it a hit. When Steve used to be in the studio, he used to practice these little marching-band patterns. It was like a little exercise for him. So I guess that's what it was. It's tricky; I've watched a lot of drummers try to play that. They never quite get it. It's very tricky. The song has a real casualness to the verses and a sense of humor to it, and the choruses are funny and catchy. And everybody seemed to like that one, young people and old people. The choruses were from a rhyming game I used to play with my son Harper when he was about four. I think it came off unusually well as a record. I like the chords.
AND according to GADD --
Quote:
Interviewer : Can you explain, did the song come first or did the groove come first, did he ( Paul Simon ) write the song around the groove or vice-versa ?

Steve Gadd : the song came first and we tried a few different ways and ended up with that feel.
I would just sit at the drums sometimes and instead of playing the hi-hat with my right hand, I would play with my left hand, and from playing be-bop, the hi-hat here is like if you play in 4 or you would play at different places. I was more free than just 2 and 4, so Fifty Ways is the result of using the hi-hat at different places : using the left hand and the hi-hat.

AND....

from anonymous post on the internet:
Quote:
It occurs to me Gadd's beat in (50 ways) is perhaps metaphorical but resonant with even a naive listener; that is, it's glib but very slightly drags—the glibness expressing the songs lyrics, but the slight drag expressing the hidden reluctance (or fear) to leave.
So this guy gets away with "naive" instead of "ignorant". So I change my post. You are all naive, hehe.

Last edited by Stu_Strib; 01-16-2006 at 01:22 AM.
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Old 01-16-2006, 12:54 AM
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jpekarek
Well I'll tell you what I am doing. I am searching the internet for downloads of Steve Gadd's music and videos clips. Looking through old S&G recordings and listening to the "Clap". The passionate string of conversation here has intrigued me to say the least, the least I can do is learn more about the man!
I spent probably an hour today on iTunes, sampling stuff from his discography. I'm 'only' 36, so a lot of his prime was when I was very young. I think I only got up to 1976 in an hour!

I particularly like the stuff with Bonnie Raitt, ca. 1974 (forget the album title and year, but it is in his discography).

I don't think you'll find any studio recordings of Simon & Garfunkel with Gadd on drums. He seems to only have drummed Live in Central Park for that duo.

Last edited by Stu_Strib; 01-16-2006 at 01:25 AM.
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  #152  
Old 01-16-2006, 01:26 AM
Stu_Strib
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

And I annoyingly post three in a row....


but this one is classic!

Did you notice, if you just type Steve Gadd in your browser window, it defaults to Bernhard's page on Steve Gadd!?? That's some influence, Bernie!

Stu
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  #153  
Old 01-16-2006, 01:29 AM
berlioz berlioz is offline
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

Ok i stand corrected, thanx Stu. I do remember that story from the Gadd video, i knew he was doing his independece exercise thing with the left hand and foot, but i forgot that it was the song first then the groove...got them mixed up... oops (its been a while since i seen that) this is quite embarrassing since i consider myself almost a Gadd historian :)
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  #154  
Old 01-16-2006, 01:31 AM
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finnhiggins finnhiggins is offline
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stu_Strib
According to Paul Simon, the song was done, and Gadd made it up during the session. It blew everyone away, and then the song was retweaked to fit the pattern even better. So finally, a drummer other than Neil Peart, having a profound effect on song writing!
I think there's plenty who do. Danny Carey is clearly a big influence on Tool's songwriting, likewise most prog drummers. Similarly, "Take Five" was originally written as a solo showpiece for Joe Morello, and Tony Williams and Elvin Jones had clear and obvious influence on the ways that Miles and Trane approached relating to the rhythm section.... I think the list could be virtually endless. It would be hard to be in a band with somebody as amazing as most of the people on Drummerworld and fail to be influenced in some way by their playing, IMHO.
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  #155  
Old 01-16-2006, 01:51 AM
Stu_Strib
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

Well, finn, I used Peart only because that is the one people usually like to bring up. I think Stewart Copeland had a huge influence, and thus the power struggle and eventual breakup of the Police.

Too many to name, but still the sign of a great drummer is the impact to the entire song process (not just the drum beat).
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  #156  
Old 01-16-2006, 02:02 AM
British Boy British Boy is offline
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jpekarek
IMO, Steve Gadd is an excellent drummer and also very accomplished. But (IMO) if you take away that one lightning fast lick he does all the time, there isn't anything very impressive left. It seems like most of his stuff is based on it. He throws it in everywhere and it gets a little old.

Great drummer, great chops, I just can't find anything to get impressed about.
You are kidding right?

The lick isn't impressive. The feel in his grooves is.
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  #157  
Old 01-16-2006, 02:04 AM
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Bernhard Bernhard is offline
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stu_Strib
And I annoyingly post three in a row....


but this one is classic!

Did you notice, if you just type Steve Gadd in your browser window, it defaults to Bernhard's page on Steve Gadd!?? That's some influence, Bernie!

Stu
Yes , thanks, true - but I think I should come second - when the official Dr. Steve Gadd Site will be up a bit more longer.

But for the most drummers we come second - after their official pages - that's great for us:
Buddy Rich, Dave Weckl, Vinnie Colaiuta and and and....

Bernhard
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  #158  
Old 01-16-2006, 02:18 AM
berlioz berlioz is offline
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stu_Strib
I spent probably an hour today on iTunes, sampling stuff from his discography. I'm 'only' 36, so a lot of his prime was when I was very young. I think I only got up to 1976 in an hour!

I particularly like the stuff with Bonnie Raitt, ca. 1974 (forget the album title and year, but it is in his discography).

I don't think you'll find any studio recordings of Simon & Garfunkel with Gadd on drums. He seems to only have drummed Live in Central Park for that duo.
Yes he does have an extensive discography. I used to run Gaddporium (an online all Gadd radio station) Steve performing with various artists from the last 5 decades from various musical genres.
At that time i had about 1500 songs on the go, which is only a small percentage of work he recorded.
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  #159  
Old 01-16-2006, 05:00 AM
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KzSgDrummer KzSgDrummer is offline
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

Ugh, I miss the Gaddporium! ..The most riveting radio station I've ever heard.
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  #160  
Old 01-16-2006, 10:14 AM
Stu_Strib
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Default Re: The legendary Steve Gadd.

Wow. I'd pay money for that. Was it the low quality streaming radio crap that most of them are?
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