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  #1  
Old 06-22-2008, 05:41 AM
HackerEd HackerEd is offline
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Default Home Recording Not Cheap

Hey I am looking to get into some music production not just for my drums but for my band and in the near future for many more.

So far Ive got an extreme desktop computer which I plan on loading up pro tools on since I am majoring in audio production and that is what they use at the University I will be transferring to.

I got plans to start a small business to help small time bands or bands looking to record that just don't have the gear get some tracks off the ground before they get big ;)

Anyways so far I was looking at

This Shure Mic drum Pac with the 3 SM-57s and the Beta 52 for 399.99
http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/Shure-Drum-Mic-Package?sku=270263


I was wandering if that would be all I needed to get everything including the cymbals my setup is Snare, high tom, floor tom, Bass drum, one ride, one crash, and one high hat. So will that mic set do the trick Im not trying to go cheap so if there is something you think I should add to that set let me know otherwise I have heard nothing but good things about it.

Second question is about what I use to get it into my computer there are just so many 4 track 8 track and 16 track recorders I just don't know what I should get. I am planning on going into guitar center to get some more information but since they are on commission I feel as though I will be sold more than I need. So if anyone has some recommendations I am trying to stay under 1000 on the recorder but maybe I can get away way cheaper than that? Keep in mind I won't just be using it for my drums but for my future recording of bands as well.

Any tips are appreciated maybe theres a website someone could throw out that has real reviews and not just manufactures posing as customers.

Thanks Again for all tips and help
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Old 06-22-2008, 05:47 AM
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Ironcobra Ironcobra is offline
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Default Re: Home Recording Not Cheap

You should probably look into getting some overhead mics for the cymbals. I'm no expert on the subject, but I can tell you that you'll need these.
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Old 06-22-2008, 05:56 AM
HackerEd HackerEd is offline
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Default Re: Home Recording Not Cheap

Yeah I kinda figured that I wasn't sure if the SM-57s were just so good they picked up the cymbals or what. I guess I need some recommendations on some hanging mics for the cymbals.
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Old 06-22-2008, 06:05 AM
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bojangleman bojangleman is offline
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Default Re: Home Recording Not Cheap

why not:

http://www.guitarcenter.com/Shure-PG...98-i1126561.gc

it has 2 over head condensors in it...so your ready to go....mics for all your drums and 2 overheads...

Alex
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Old 06-22-2008, 06:12 AM
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Ironcobra Ironcobra is offline
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Default Re: Home Recording Not Cheap

Quote:
Originally Posted by bojangleman View Post
why not:

http://www.guitarcenter.com/Shure-PG...98-i1126561.gc

it has 2 over head condensors in it...so your ready to go....mics for all your drums and 2 overheads...

Alex
Those aren't nearly as good as a beta 52 and SM57's, lol.
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Old 06-22-2008, 06:26 AM
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bojangleman bojangleman is offline
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Default Re: Home Recording Not Cheap

thats a good reason..lol :p

the beta 52 and SM57's are great mics. i have used them and heard them...and wow...they work and sound very good.

so stick with the first pack you linked, but get some overhead condensers....

SM57's up top?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ironcobra View Post
Those aren't nearly as good as a beta 52 and SM57's, lol.
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Old 06-22-2008, 08:07 AM
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caddywumpus caddywumpus is offline
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Default Re: Home Recording Not Cheap

SM-57s should be used as accent mics (close-up microphones) to pic up the snare, hi hat, toms. You should be recording the drums with overheads and a kick mic. The overheads would pick up everything, and you'd accent mic the kick (because the overheads wouldn't pick it up as good).

I'd recommend a pair of C1000s for the overheads and an Audix D-6 for the kick. If you want to add mics, do it in this order of importance: first the snare, then the toms, then the high hats, then the ride, then the crash cymbals.
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Old 06-22-2008, 04:18 PM
CraKaJaX CraKaJaX is offline
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Default Re: Home Recording Not Cheap

For overheads... if you're on a budget, I'd recommend Oktava MK-012's. If not, Shure SM81's are great overheads too, but a bit pricey.
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Old 06-24-2008, 08:50 AM
bokorugro bokorugro is offline
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Default Re: Home Recording Not Cheap

I am just getting into some home recording, obviously not for commercial purposes, but to listen back to my playing, and how we relate to each other in the bands ( their miking is solved ), so I'm not for professional quality yet. The question is, that can I produce a raw, but balanced drum sound ( the only point is, to hear everything, not the perfect, compressed sound ), using 1, or 2 well placed condensors? AKG Perception 150-s for example.
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Old 07-09-2008, 05:12 AM
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Trip McNealy Trip McNealy is offline
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Default Re: Home Recording Not Cheap

Quote:
Originally Posted by caddywumpus View Post

I'd recommend a pair of C1000s for the overheads and an Audix D-6 for the kick. If you want to add mics, do it in this order of importance: first the snare, then the toms, then the high hats, then the ride, then the crash cymbals.
I agree here.. and for a bit extra, the D112 is an awesome kick mic.
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Old 07-09-2008, 01:51 PM
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Default Re: Home Recording Not Cheap

If you're aiming to record on a professional basis then you'll need to use higher end equipment, 57s, D112, C1000s at least. A firewire interface of some kind would be a sensible option if recording on a pc - getting a mac would be even better.
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Old 07-09-2008, 02:04 PM
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Default Re: Home Recording Not Cheap

I would avoid C1000s if I were you, they have a very aggressive top end and not much body in the midrange. Rode NT-1As make good overheads, and they're not much more expensive at all.

The most important factor in getting a good drum sound in the room you're recording in. If the room sounds bad, the drums will too.
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Old 07-09-2008, 05:45 PM
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hawk9290 hawk9290 is offline
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Default Re: Home Recording Not Cheap

Alright, for the first question, get the first mic pack plus 2 overhead condensor's (C1000's are ok, but as mentioned, the Rodes NT-1A's are great, as are anything I've used from Sterling Audio- a new brand so prices are still low, but quality has been great thus far).

But the big problem i see in your second question is that you said you're going to use ProTools software, but then you mention using a 4, 8, or 16 track recorder. That would be a terrible disappointment if you did as such. here's why:
Pro Tools only recognizes certain hardware that Digidesign/M-Audio program it to (pretty much on M-Audio and Digidesign stuff will work as your input). The big key to look for is that whatever interface you end up getting has ADAT lightpipe. This allows you to expand your inputs later with any hardware that uses lightpipe.
Here's the situation you face, though:
The cheapest hardware mixer for Pro Tools runs around $1200 new ($800 on ebay at times), and its called the M-Audio ProjectMix. Its nice, but pricey. However, you don't actually need to mix with an external device- all that an external mixer called 'digital audio workstation' (DAW) does is give you more of the analog mixer feel. There is no functional difference in terms of abilities, its just easier to adjust levels with a fader instead of a mouse.
With that in mind, you could get something such as the M-Audio Profire Lightbridge, then add on a MOTU 8pre or any other preamp with adat output. This gives you 8 channels of mic input to start, with the ability to expand up to 32.
Or you could just get an M-Audio Firewire 1814 that gives you 2 mic inputs, 8 line inputs, and the ability to add up to 8 more inputs through the lightpipe (a total of 10 mic 8 line max). Both of these will cost less than $1000
However, neither of them give you the DAW to mix with, if that is a key to you.
Most student audio labs I have been in though just have a 1814 or equivalent (the students record on the big main Digidesign Control 24 or ICON consoles, and then put their projects on the individual computers to mix with the 1814's)
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Old 07-10-2008, 01:32 AM
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rmandelbaum rmandelbaum is offline
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Default Re: Home Recording Not Cheap

Hawk has nailed it on the head,

I looked into ProTools when I was getting ready to set up my studio, I was taking a college recording course as well and they had ProTools. I did my homework and figured out the same thing. They nail you on the hardware. Here is the lowdown on PC recording. All DAW software does the same thing, Takes the input and writes to to disk. If you learn ProTools you will be able to easily pic up any of the others. and you can import and export files to and from any of them, I do it all the time.

I used ProTools and tape at school and went with Cubase at home. I spent about 4k total to get a decent basic studio together. I think the best thing I did was to pick up a TASCAM DM-24 digital mixer. It has 16 pre amps, as well as motorized faders. I use MIDI to allow the software to be controlled by the mixer, when I move a fader on the mixer the fader in the software moves as well and mice versa. I am sure to build the same thing in ProTools would have been double at least.

My suggestion is to do your homework, compare features of the different DAWs out there. Hang out in the forums for Sonor,Cubase, ProTools etc..


Also VERY VERY important is the PC, If you are going with a PC and windows you need to set up the system correctly or you will have nothing but headaches. I found a great document that explains what services you can turn off to maximize performance for a DAW. And never use it for surfing the web or anything else you are only asking for problems if you do.


Here is my humble home studio, its not much but go to my website and you can here some stuff I have recorded with it

www.robertmdrums.com

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  #15  
Old 07-10-2008, 04:39 AM
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Default Re: Home Recording Not Cheap

Absolutely agree with the above two posters.

There is a variety of DAW software available on the current market and the prices are now more accessible than they've ever been. The new version of Logic Studio (Mac only) is 200, which is what the 'Express' version used to cost. Sonar, Cubase, Pro Tools and Logic are probably the most widely used DAW's, but that's not to say that they are necessarily the best. Pro Tools; as has been said, whilst intuitive at the software level is expensive and uncompetitive in a home market due to the cost of the hardware - for the LE version of Pro Tools (the lowest they offer) including hardware, you could purchase the professional version of Logic and for a bit more money, invest in much better hardware.

Essentially, it all comes down to preference and budget. Obviously the PC (or Mac) is important. I've gone the Mac route, but the PC route is just as apt. Most underrated I find is actually the screen size - obviously this can be altered after buying the PC. My Mac is dual-screen for that reason; I find a single screen lacking in real estate. The RAM and processor speed should be the highest priorities followed by the size of the hard disk. Obviously, the hard disk can be upgraded and replaced - external USB or FireWire hard disks are very cheap for a massive amount of storage.

With regards to choosing your software, get your hands on as much as you can. My preference is Logic - many people prefer Cubase or Sonar. All of them have basically the same functionality and it really is largely a matter of preference. This may also help you make hardware choices. Room acoustics are also important in deciding the scale of your operation. If you're recording drums, good room acoustics are a must and if you want a really good result, you're going to have to spend some money on acoustic treatment.

Although it doesn't have to be expensive, home recording isn't necessarily cheap. With that said, it is much more accessible than it ever has been and many people are taking this on board. I myself am about to go to University to study Music Technology and hope to get a career in this field. It is exciting and productive and something you will find satisfying with some experience and experimentation.
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