Should I order some Ludwigs?

[Crydevil]

Hey everyone, i got a small problem that keeps me busy right now.
It's involving a new Ludwig Classic Maple kit I i'd like to buy, but i don't know if it's worth it or not.

The facts are:
- My local dealer doesn't distribute Ludwig, but i can order it there, but without their warranty then ofcourse, or on the internet.
- It seems as if Ludwig has been lying low, cause all i get to see are bands like Tama, Pearl, Sonor, ... Is this true?
- I want to buy a Ludwig because most of my favourite drummers used to play one, but ofcourse that was 30-20 years ago.

Now my questions are:
- Is it clever to buy a Ludwig Classic Maple kit, since i wont have warranty?
- Have the kits from now changed form the kits in the 60's & 70's? And in a positive or negative way?
- How do they sound?
- If i am going to buy one, should i do it on the internet (where?), or at my local dealer (i live in Belgium :P)

That's a whole bunch of questions, i know. :P
But anyway, thanks alot in advance.
Greetz :D

[joeybeats]

You can find anwers to most of your general "What should I purchase" questions, both those asked above and not, at the following link. http://georgesdrumshop.com/guide.asp

There is no way I would advise the purchase of a new set without a proper warranty. If he had any input on your thinking, shame on your local dealer for even allowing you to think he would do that. What he should do is arrange for you to purchase a brand he does not carry from one of his friends in the business. In other words, he should refer you out. If he must make a few bucks in the deal, he could arrange to be the middle man of a sale from an authorized dealer, which would satisfy both of your needs. Good luck. Joey

[ThroneAmbition]

Absolutely! Ludwig is making a comeback. They're building a quality product. Several big name drummers are playing Ludwig, Matt Sorum, Tre' Cool, and Alex Van Halen to name a few. I play a Classic Birch kit which I very happy with. I've heard many good things about the Classic Maple, which is more expensive than the Birch. Ludwig includes a 3 year limited warranty on their Classic Maple and Birch kits.

West Coast Drum Center offers a great Ludwig Custom Order program on line and they ship internationally. Here is a link that should take you to the Ludwig page:

http://www.westcoastdrums.com/cuordrse.html

Good luck, hope this helps.

[harryconway]

Ludwig has indeed changed since the 60's and 70's. Those shells were 3 ply with re-inforcement rings. In 1976, Ludwig went to a 6 ply shell. That shell carried them into the 80's somewhere (mid-to-late), I think, when the 10 ply took over. I play 6 ply shells, 26, 15, 16, 18. Love the drums. Since I played Ludwig vistalites for some 25 years, I'm not such a big stickler for warranty's. If you're buying new, you should get a warranty. Why pay the new price without the feature of a warranty? If the drums are used, then that should reflect in the cost, limited warranty (30 days), buyer beware, all that usual stuff.

[GRUNTERSDAD]

The drums are warranted by Ludwig, not by your dealer. Did they tell you that the drums wouldn't have a warranty.??

[Deltadrummer]

Originally Posted by Crydevil

Hey everyone, i got a small problem that keeps me busy right now.
It's involving a new Ludwig Classic Maple kit I i'd like to buy, but i don't know if it's worth it or not.

The facts are:
- My local dealer doesn't distribute Ludwig, but i can order it there, but without their warranty then ofcourse, or on the internet.
- It seems as if Ludwig has been lying low, cause all i get to see are bands like Tama, Pearl, Sonor, ... Is this true?
- I want to buy a Ludwig because most of my favourite drummers used to play one, but ofcourse that was 30-20 years ago.

Now my questions are:
- Is it clever to buy a Ludwig Classic Maple kit, since i wont have warranty?
- Have the kits from now changed form the kits in the 60's & 70's? And in a positive or negative way?
- How do they sound?
- If i am going to buy one, should i do it on the internet (where?), or at my local dealer (i live in Belgium :P)

That's a whole bunch of questions, i know. :P
But anyway, thanks alot in advance.
Greetz :D

I imagine that you could order them on line from a reputable dealer and still get a warranty so I would also add that you should not get the drums without one.

I've always enjoyed the classic Ludwig and Gretsch sound, which the Ludwig Classics restore. They are like the three ply from the early 70's, with reinforcement rings. I was just reading this yesterday. "Like those original shells, the exclusive Legacy Classic shells are made from thin, 1/16˝ hand-selected inner and outer plies of premium-grade North American Maple and an 1/8˝ cross-laminated North American Poplar core ply. This basic formula is then augmented by 1/4˝ maple reinforcement hoops and rounded, “Class-Cut” vintage-style bearing edges." rounded is 30 degrees, I believe, which gives you a warmer tone. The 45s will create a sharper, more defined tone.

What Tama, Pearl and Yamaha did in the 70s was bring in better hardware. My hardware is still Pearl and Tama. If you notice, Tama is used by a lot of metal drummers. They are strong drums. I like the Starclassics; but they are expensive, about as much as a DW. Pearl, from what I understand, is having a rough time. You can get a good kit pretty cheaply without the die cast rims though. Yamaha is doing quite well and has many primo endorsers. Ludwig is making a comeback. Their entry level models are really crappy; but the mid and higher range models sound quite nice. Made in America; but all these places source out. I heard that DW uses the same Keller shells for Pacific, which are manufactured in Asia, as oppossed to CA where DW is made. I've also heard that Ludwig sends the shells to Aisa for manufacture; they're not manufactured in North Carolina. It's all rumor/

Sonor are great drums, expensive, but maybe not as much for you living in Belgium; but pros complain that the hardware is unreliable and it takes forever to replace hardware and parts. That might not be the case for you since they're made next door.

Honestly, for my money, I can't imagine a better deal then the Gretsch Renown series, all American rock maple shells, with 30 degree bearing edges, die cast rims with a good suspension system; and they are affordable; but again for you it would be an import.

[Crydevil]

First of all, thanks to all who have replied :D, i appreciate it.

Originally Posted by harryconway

Ludwig has indeed changed since the 60's and 70's. Those shells were 3 ply with re-inforcement rings. In 1976, Ludwig went to a 6 ply shell. That shell carried them into the 80's somewhere (mid-to-late), I think, when the 10 ply took over. I play 6 ply shells, 26, 15, 16, 18. Love the drums. Since I played Ludwig vistalites for some 25 years, I'm not such a big stickler for warranty's. If you're buying new, you should get a warranty. Why pay the new price without the feature of a warranty? If the drums are used, then that should reflect in the cost, limited warranty (30 days), buyer beware, all that usual stuff.

But another question about the ply's.

- Does the amount of ply's have anything to do with the strenght of a drum? Because if people like John Bonham played 3 ply's in the early 70's (while sounding good), would it make a big difference if i choose to play a 6 or 10 ply?

Thanks in advance :D

[Crydevil]

Originally Posted by ThroneAmbition

Absolutely! Ludwig is making a comeback. They're building a quality product. Several big name drummers are playing Ludwig, Matt Sorum, Tre' Cool, and Alex Van Halen to name a few. I play a Classic Birch kit which I very happy with. I've heard many good things about the Classic Maple, which is more expensive than the Birch. Ludwig includes a 3 year limited warranty on their Classic Maple and Birch kits.

West Coast Drum Center offers a great Ludwig Custom Order program on line and they ship internationally. Here is a link that should take you to the Ludwig page:

http://www.westcoastdrums.com/cuordrse.html

Good luck, hope this helps.

Thanks alot man :D i'll definitely keep this shop in mind :D

[LiveGoat]

I own a Ludwig kit in Bonham sizes (minus the 18 inch floor tom). All the drums are different plys. The kick is 10 ply, the rack tom is a 6 ply, and the floor tom is a 3 ply. They sound great together and with coated heads on top and bottom have a nice warm woody classic sound. I will say that the 3ply floor tom is easier tune quickly and has the most pure tone of the kit. That being said, everyone that hears my kit loves the overall sound of it. I think you can't go wrong with the choice of plys, providing that the drums are in good shape. With regard to the strength of a 3ply drum, just take care of it like any other drum and it'll last you a lifetime. The thinness is negligible. I would prowl around ebay and and look at used kits first before buying a new kit right off the bat. There's still deals to be had. Jut my opinion, though. Happy drum getting!

---LG

Originally Posted by Crydevil

First of all, thanks to all who have replied :D, i appreciate it.



But another question about the ply's.

- Does the amount of ply's have anything to do with the strenght of a drum? Because if people like John Bonham played 3 ply's in the early 70's (while sounding good), would it make a big difference if i choose to play a 6 or 10 ply?

Thanks in advance :D

[harryconway]

[quote=Crydevil;366966
- Does the amount of ply's have anything to do with the strenght of a drum? Because if people like John Bonham played 3 ply's in the early 70's (while sounding good), would it make a big difference if i choose to play a 6 or 10 ply?

[/QUOTE]

Indeed it does, which is why the 3 ply has the re-inforcement rings. In Ludwigs heyday, they were selling 150 kits a day. Some cat named Ringo played Ludwig's and did "a lot" to sell drums for Ludwig. So Ludwig's change to the 6 ply was more a way to streamline the manufacturing process than anything else. As LiveGoat said, the 3 ply will last a lifetime if cared for. Check out the Pearl Masters Premium MMP and BMP http://www.pearldrum.com/masters.asp for modern drums still made with thin shells and re-inforcement rings. The sound difference between the 6 and 10 ply shell is not as apparent as between the 3 ply vs. the "other" 2. The 3 ply is always described as a "warmer" tone, not quite as loud as the 6 or 10. Which is why the thinshells are still made today, by a number of companies. Keller http://www.kelleratthecore.com/products.php makes both types of shells, and almost all the high end custom drum companies use Keller shell.

[Cymbalrider]

Unless you plan on throwing it down the stairs a 3 ply drum is just a sturdy as a 6 or 9 ply drum. Some companies like Pearl will get you believing you need all these planned ply construction things for different drums which seems just a fancy way of saying "Please buy our $4000 drum kit". The old style thin shells just sound better and are a lot less complicated to figure out.

[Deltadrummer]

Originally Posted by Crydevil

First of all, thanks to all who have replied :D, i appreciate it.



But another question about the ply's.

- Does the amount of ply's have anything to do with the strenght of a drum? Because if people like John Bonham played 3 ply's in the early 70's (while sounding good), would it make a big difference if i choose to play a 6 or 10 ply?

Thanks in advance :D

The general rule is that thinner the ply the more resonant the drum. Thin plies will sound more woody; thicker plies will sound more heady. I used to have a Gretsch three ply without reinforcement rings and they were pretty strong drums. The reinforcement rings were really there to reinforce the resonance. A lot of the strength has to do with the wrap, which is there to strengthen the drum, oh, and too look pretty. But the wrap will decrease the resonance of the wood. The strength of the drum also has to do with the way the wood plies are aligned and bonded so plies have a very small part in it all. . Just to reiterate, if you don't throw them around, you will have no problem.

[Crydevil]

Well, i don't think i'll throw it around pretty quick :P. But then the question remains: what do i buy? a 3, 6 or 9 ply? because to be honest, i haven't really compared them yet.

Thanks in advance, greetz

[Leadfoot]

I bought a pair of Classic Maple toms to go with my older Ludwig kit. If the quality of the drums and the customer service I recieved were indicative of how Ludwig is doing things now, I say by all means, buy them. I couldn't be happier. And as far as the warranty, it shoudn't matter where you buy them.

[Deltadrummer]

Originally Posted by Crydevil

Well, i don't think i'll throw it around pretty quick :P. But then the question remains: what do i buy? a 3, 6 or 9 ply? because to be honest, i haven't really compared them yet.

Thanks in advance, greetz

the thinner ply shells have been in fashion over the last few years but I think the trend is going the other way. I think you need to get to a store and start listening, that's half the fun of buying a kit. Go around trying different kits, getting the salespeople flustered. Then you can come back and correct us on all our misconceptions.lol

The ply thickness depends on what kind of music you play. Rock or metal could use a thicker ply. Jazz and funk a thinner ply; but it really comes down to if you want a more resonant sound (3 ply or even 6) as compared to mare stick definition. (6 or 9 of even 12) 6 seems to be the best of both worlds in that sense. lol

then the next question is what kind of wood should you get? There's enough said about that in other places. But that you won't know without listening.